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Islamic Iran - What is the general feeling toward America today in Europe and the Middle East
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| 20. |
19 Mar 2008 Wed 09:52 pm |
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Quoting Roswitha: She is great! CNN's chief international correspondent Christiane Amanpour is considered an expert on Islam. She was raised as a Christian in Islamic Iran.
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07232/810729-129.stm |
for more about Christiane Amanpour's documentaries, please visit:
http://edition.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2007/gods.warriors/
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| 21. |
20 Mar 2008 Thu 12:11 am |
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Quoting Daydreamer: Quoting libralady:
Daydreamer, you puzzle me, how do you know so much about this site and where people come from?
I know exactly what Jannisary is saying and I must say that in the past his words are very true. I can't speak for the future. On many occasions "bed" Westerners have argued about Turkey with Turks as if they are living there or have a PhD in Turkish history. |
Puzzling you? Me? Owww... 
Seriously, I've been a member here for 3 years so I have seen a lot of people acting in various ways with different nicks etc. I've also seen all the changes in this site - good ones and bad ones. Some people left, some left and came back, some left without deleting their account.
My answer to janissary concerning westerners arguing with Turks about history had a winking smiley at the end so it was obviously intended as a humorous remark. Still, I see nothing wrong in contrasting different points of view. You know it well yourself that Turkey is not really a very tolerant country when it comes to access to information. If I were Turkish, I'd love to know what world history writes about certain things. If you lived in a country that forges history (like I did for a while) - I don't mean Turkey here as I have no idea whether Turkish history is forged or not - you'd know what I mean. History is a wonderful study, unfortunately it's often distorted and subjective when taught. |
we know what other ppl think about tukey's history. It is not difficult to learn what they think or write coz they study harder about turkey's history than their history. Even I saw how much they are interested in history from some botany books, written by foreign botanist. this is only one example. of course it s important to learn different point of views, but I dont like to disscuss an issue about turkey, for example kurdish issue, with a dutch ppl or british who have lived for a short time in turkey. I prefer to talk about it with a kurdish. but as I see on this site everybody knows everything and trying to give us lessons. it would make me glad if someone appeciated my thoughts as a turkish who lives in turkey. BUT according to some members turkish education system is insufficent. I say again here is not "zembabwe"
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| 22. |
20 Mar 2008 Thu 08:18 am |
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Quoting Daydreamer: Quoting janissary: Quoting Daydreamer: Nobody got deleted yet for not loving America :O |
its not allowed to write against USA and Israel by dear moderators on this site. if you go on posting after warning you will be deleted writing about Turkey is free! whatever you want Im learning lots of things about turkey from some ppl on this site like turkish history from dutch ppl and about European Union and Turkey from Kazaks |
For one thing, I believe Catwoman wanted to close this topic as it is not DIRECTLY connected to Turkey (I guess that is what the rules say) as this is a Turkish Class. It's definitely not wrong to criticise US - there are lots of negative comments about US here (I had my share in it too).
As for learning history of your country from yabancilar, it may be beneficial - at least you can learn where world history puts Turkey. Nobody tells you to agree with it, right? Oh, the whole population of Kazakhs in this site is currently ZERO so don't say they still teach you what to think
Having explained that, dear admins, why the heck can we NOT discuss things not related to Turkey in off-topic forum? 
I thought people said they were ok discussing all kinds of issues here? |
haha, u must be one of the admin's other account or advocate...Admin and moderators are interested in topics which have bad impression about Turkey.If u wonder u can check their posts on any topic
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| 23. |
20 Mar 2008 Thu 08:21 am |
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Quoting janissary: Quoting Daydreamer: Nobody got deleted yet for not loving America :O |
its not allowed to write against USA and Israel by dear moderators on this site. if you go on posting after warning you will be deleted writing about Turkey is free! whatever you want Im learning lots of things about turkey from some ppl on this site like turkish history from dutch ppl and about European Union and Turkey from Kazaks |
this is evidence...they agreed
http://www.turkishclass.com/forumTitle_20_28589
u cant talk about USA,EU and Isreal...or u should support them.at least we learnt what is the secret on back of this web site...
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| 24. |
20 Mar 2008 Thu 10:36 am |
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Quoting janissary: we know what other ppl think about tukey's history. It is not difficult to learn what they think or write coz they study harder about turkey's history than their history. Even I saw how much they are interested in history from some botany books, written by foreign botanist. this is only one example. of course it s important to learn different point of views, but I dont like to disscuss an issue about turkey, for example kurdish issue, with a dutch ppl or british who have lived for a short time in turkey. I prefer to talk about it with a kurdish. but as I see on this site everybody knows everything and trying to give us lessons. it would make me glad if someone appeciated my thoughts as a turkish who lives in turkey. BUT according to some members turkish education system is insufficent. I say again here is not "zembabwe" |
Hi Janissary - I think I understand where you are coming from - many people think our education system is backward. My work is in education and I do feel that our education system has some catching up to but it is far from backward.
Your example about discussing Kurdish issue with Kurds and not other nationals I do disagree with. Sometimes, I think it is good to see things from different perspectives. It can often help us to learn things. I have found that some Turks will only think in one way about the Kurd issue and and also Kurds think only one way about the same issue, so sometimes discussing between these two gets us nowhere - but when a "neutral" speaker or a speaker who has intensively studied this area joins a conversation we can sometimes start to see things differently whether that person is from Zimbabwe or Australia, an Eskimo or an Indian. Everyone brings something. Just my thoughts - I thought I would share.
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| 26. |
20 Mar 2008 Thu 11:30 am |
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Quoting Daydreamer: Quoting Lapinkulta:
this is evidence...they agreed
http://www.turkishclass.com/forumTitle_20_28589
u cant talk about USA,EU and Isreal...or u should support them.at least we learnt what is the secret on back of this web site... |
How do I explain it so that you understood. I'll try to put it as simply as I can:
Admins say: 'Don't discuss things other than Turkey'
Users say: 'We want to discuss everything'
Admins say: 'Ok, but try to limit posts not about Turkey'
Lapinkuta says: ' Admins forbid to discuss USA - you can only support them'
And, yes, I am Admins' advocate. You are a very clever boy if you reached that conclusion on your own |
good work..Im so clever and more than u expected.
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| 27. |
22 Mar 2008 Sat 10:24 am |
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Quoting Daydreamer: Quoting libralady:
Daydreamer, you puzzle me, how do you know so much about this site and where people come from?
I know exactly what Jannisary is saying and I must say that in the past his words are very true. I can't speak for the future. On many occasions "bed" Westerners have argued about Turkey with Turks as if they are living there or have a PhD in Turkish history. |
Puzzling you? Me? Owww...
Seriously, I've been a member here for 3 years so I have seen a lot of people acting in various ways with different nicks etc. I've also seen all the changes in this site - good ones and bad ones. Some people left, some left and came back, some left without deleting their account.
My answer to janissary concerning westerners arguing with Turks about history had a winking smiley at the end so it was obviously intended as a humorous remark. Still, I see nothing wrong in contrasting different points of view. You know it well yourself that Turkey is not really a very tolerant country when it comes to access to information. If I were Turkish, I'd love to know what world history writes about certain things. If you lived in a country that forges history (like I did for a while) - I don't mean Turkey here as I have no idea whether Turkish history is forged or not - you'd know what I mean. History is a wonderful study, unfortunately it's often distorted and subjective when taught. |
I did not make my point clear, I was not referring to Turkish history per se just because I mentioned a PhD in Turkish history, but I was talking about polictics and history.
There has been times on this site, and if you have been here 3 years you know well what I mean, that Westerners appear to know more about the goings on it Turkey than Turks do!!!! And then wonder why native Turks get upset.
Perhaps if Turks started to tell you and argue about the potato famine, or about the IRA you would know what I mean 
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| 28. |
22 Mar 2008 Sat 12:55 pm |
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Quoting Cacık: Quoting janissary: we know what other ppl think about tukey's history. It is not difficult to learn what they think or write coz they study harder about turkey's history than their history. Even I saw how much they are interested in history from some botany books, written by foreign botanist. this is only one example. of course it s important to learn different point of views, but I dont like to disscuss an issue about turkey, for example kurdish issue, with a dutch ppl or british who have lived for a short time in turkey. I prefer to talk about it with a kurdish. but as I see on this site everybody knows everything and trying to give us lessons. it would make me glad if someone appeciated my thoughts as a turkish who lives in turkey. BUT according to some members turkish education system is insufficent. I say again here is not "zembabwe" |
Hi Janissary - I think I understand where you are coming from - many people think our education system is backward. My work is in education and I do feel that our education system has some catching up to but it is far from backward.
Your example about discussing Kurdish issue with Kurds and not other nationals I do disagree with. Sometimes, I think it is good to see things from different perspectives. It can often help us to learn things. I have found that some Turks will only think in one way about the Kurd issue and and also Kurds think only one way about the same issue, so sometimes discussing between these two gets us nowhere - but when a "neutral" speaker or a speaker who has intensively studied this area joins a conversation we can sometimes start to see things differently whether that person is from Zimbabwe or Australia, an Eskimo or an Indian. Everyone brings something. Just my thoughts - I thought I would share. |
hehe. foreign ppl who discuss kurd issue on this site, usually have kurdish boyfriends. I dont agree with you that its a different perspective. coz they tell here what their bfs tell them. that s why I said it s nonsense to discuss with them. I d like to discuss this issue with their bfs.
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| 29. |
22 Mar 2008 Sat 01:28 pm |
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Quoting janissary: hehe. foreign ppl who discuss kurd issue on this site, usually have kurdish boyfriends. I dont agree with you that its a different perspective. coz they tell here what their bfs tell them. that s why I said it s nonsense to discuss with them. I d like to discuss this issue with their bfs. |
How can you know everyone on this site ? I find that your response is in itself a closed view, to automatically assume that everyone here who wishes to discuss it has a Kurdish partner. I for one don't and often enjoy good debates on the subject. I know people who have published academic books on Ottoman history, Turkish history etc.... if I read and study their books, am I not worthy of your discussion ? This is not a personal attack just an observation and I am curious about your opinion.
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| 30. |
22 Mar 2008 Sat 02:37 pm |
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Quoting libralady:
I did not make my point clear, I was not referring to Turkish history per se just because I mentioned a PhD in Turkish history, but I was talking about polictics and history.
There has been times on this site, and if you have been here 3 years you know well what I mean, that Westerners appear to know more about the goings on it Turkey than Turks do!!!! And then wonder why native Turks get upset.
Perhaps if Turks started to tell you and argue about the potato famine, or about the IRA you would know what I mean |
Ok, I see your point. However it's not necessarily truth that Turks know more about Turkish culture than Westerners in all cases. I know next to nothing about Turkish history so I never discuss it on this forum. But saying that some Westerners who are genuinely interested in Turkish history know less about it than Turks is not a fair statement. Remember that Turkey uses lots of censorship even today. Could you bet your head that they didn't censor its history? That only historians with certain perspective can teach it?
Westerners, especially those interested in Turkish history and those who have access to differentiated historical sources, sometimes are more objective than Turks. Iąm not trying to belittle native Turks knowledge of history, but, speaking from my own experience, I know that although I do not have and never will have native English speaker's linguistic competence, I know more about linguistic processes of their language than them as I did my Master's degree in semantics. Thus, although I am not English, there are areas of English language where my knowledge is better than an average English person's.
It is the same with history. Being a Westerner does not mean that you know less than a Turk. Being a Turk does not make you a specialist in history. A person studying Polish history would have no problems pointing out my lack of knowledge of Polish history.
The problem here is that some members here take their point of view as the only correct one. They forget that history is not merely about facts, it's also about interpretation.
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