Turkey |
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Tension in Turkey
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| 10. |
08 Jul 2008 Tue 07:57 pm |
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Quoting azade: That depends on how you see it.. I'd say the same for CHP and certaintly MHP as they are über conservative and thus against progression. Not saying I'm for AKP either - loads of empty promises the last couple of years. This article is great and as it mentions I think Turkey needs a new political order with a more democratic base. |
Not just a democratic base but also a clear separation of religion from politics.
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| 11. |
08 Jul 2008 Tue 08:52 pm |
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Quoting catwoman: Quote: I personally think that the west prefers a weaker Turkey as opposed to a stronger one less dependent on the West. For this reason and this reason alone, is why the US and Britain support the AKP the way they do.
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I think you are right.. |
Quite an interesting idea.
But This is one of the conspricy theories fueled by the army and the anti democratic "so called" 'secularists' who should be ashamed for denying "very" basic democratic rights to Turkish people for so long and sidelining themselves with the soldiers which themselves are still a major player in politics.
You are talking about a government which took 47% of the legitimate vote of Turkish people. Turkish people deserve respect!
If you are using 'democracy' in your words and have any dealings with the democracy, you have to respect the democratic rules..
of course the EU will support a legitimate government.
Are they supposed to put their weight behind the army?
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| 12. |
08 Jul 2008 Tue 08:59 pm |
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I think the point was that AKP has ties with the West, so the West supports it because it makes them dependent on each other. If there was a government that would solve Turkey's problems by itself, Turkey would be less dependent on the West and that would somewhat of a threat.
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| 13. |
08 Jul 2008 Tue 09:03 pm |
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Quoting catwoman: I think the point was that AKP has ties with the West, so the West supports it because it makes them dependent on each other. If there was a government that would solve Turkey's problems by itself, Turkey would be less dependent on the West and that would somewhat of a threat. |
you hit the right point Catty...
i still hate to see these things... because Turkey has lots of major problems than these Dallas games!!!
First it was Terror and Army attack in Iraq, then it was head cover issue... then the media and society was busy with Euro2008 now its Ergenekon to keep them busy and and make them(us society) blind to see the real problems...
so sad...
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| 14. |
08 Jul 2008 Tue 09:09 pm |
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Quoting catwoman: I think the point was that AKP has ties with the West, so the West supports it because it makes them dependent on each other. If there was a government that would solve Turkey's problems by itself, Turkey would be less dependent on the West and that would somewhat of a threat. |
I still dont get the idea of 'west supporting AKP'..
What is it the west doing exactly?
can you say that the west is doing more than what they are doing for burma's house arrested leader 'Aung San Suu Kyi' or Dalai Lama?
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| 15. |
08 Jul 2008 Tue 09:21 pm |
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Quoting thehandsom: Quoting catwoman: I think the point was that AKP has ties with the West, so the West supports it because it makes them dependent on each other. If there was a government that would solve Turkey's problems by itself, Turkey would be less dependent on the West and that would somewhat of a threat. |
I still dont get the idea of 'west supporting AKP'..
What is it the west doing exactly?
can you say that the west is doing more than what they are doing for burma's house arrested leader 'Aung San Suu Kyi' or Dalai Lama?
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Akp is the most slavery government so far... for what EU wants Turkey to do.. thats why catty said that point i guess... so EU wouldnt like to lose such government
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| 16. |
08 Jul 2008 Tue 09:36 pm |
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Quoting SuiGeneris: Quoting thehandsom: Quoting catwoman: I think the point was that AKP has ties with the West, so the West supports it because it makes them dependent on each other. If there was a government that would solve Turkey's problems by itself, Turkey would be less dependent on the West and that would somewhat of a threat. |
I still dont get the idea of 'west supporting AKP'..
What is it the west doing exactly?
can you say that the west is doing more than what they are doing for burma's house arrested leader 'Aung San Suu Kyi' or Dalai Lama?
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Akp is the most slavery government so far... for what EU wants Turkey to do.. thats why catty said that point i guess... so EU wouldnt like to lose such government |
I must say, personally, I have defended most of the necessary changes to the constitution for the integration into the EU.
But I supported them because they were necessary for the Turkish people and their freedom.
I supported them because Turkish people are not 'less people' than Europeans.
I always thougth that our people deserved better than the constitution written by the soldiers in the era where communism was number one enemy.
Take 301, take the decision of abolishing death penalty, think of the thousands of people who were sent to jail because they just merely expressed their opposition..
Can you give any example about what Turkey should NOT have done but we have, because EU wanted them and say they were not necessary for Turkish people?
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| 17. |
08 Jul 2008 Tue 09:45 pm |
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Quoting thehandsom:
I must say, personally, I have defended most of the necessary changes to the constitution for the integration into the EU.
But I supported them because they were necessary for the Turkish people and their freedom.
I supported them because Turkish people are not 'less people' than Europeans.
I always thougth that our people deserved better than the constitution written by the soldiers in the era where communism was number one enemy.
Take 301, take the decision of abolishing death penalty, think of the thousands of people who were sent to jail because they just merely expressed their opposition..
Can you give any example about what Turkey should NOT have done but we have, because EU wanted them and say they were not necessary for Turkish people?
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I was in south of Turkey for 5 monthes for a project...
but all i can say that... Turkish society is not ready yet for a quick move to enter EU and freedom... because they are not educated about what freedom and rights mean... the changes must have been done according to the needs of Turkish Society not what EU wants for us to be able to enter the Union...
Ok EU is good... i was abroad for a couple of time to see the lifestyle there... but the people there are educated a 16 years old boy doesnt use a car even they have 3 cars in their garage which are around 50000 euros each... we have alot to come to that point...
The only good point that EU has is the usage of money... usage of your sources and supporting the producing people and stuff... and its Control Mechanism...
I cant give you an exact example right now, as because i was away from news for a while... and forgot what AKP did because EU wanted...
death penalty? i think it was the first thing that shouldnt be removed... they should take out APO first...
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| 18. |
08 Jul 2008 Tue 10:02 pm |
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Quoting SuiGeneris:
I was in south of Turkey for 5 monthes for a project...
but all i can say that... Turkish society is not ready yet for a quick move to enter EU and freedom... because they are not educated about what freedom and rights mean... the changes must have been done according to the needs of Turkish Society not what EU wants for us to be able to enter the Union...
Ok EU is good... i was abroad for a couple of time to see the lifestyle there... but the people there are educated a 16 years old boy doesnt use a car even they have 3 cars in their garage which are around 50000 euros each... we have alot to come to that point...
The only good point that EU has is the usage of money... usage of your sources and supporting the producing people and stuff... and its Control Mechanism...
I cant give you an exact example right now, as because i was away from news for a while... and forgot what AKP did because EU wanted...
death penalty? i think it was the first thing that shouldnt be removed... they should take out APO first... |
Sui
In 1970's Portugal, Greece were not better than Turkey both economically and politically. Even in 80s they were not much better when you check the number of people were depended on the agriculture, GDB, the position of the army, immigration from villages to the big cities etc..
But look at them now!! So I am not buying this 'we are NOT ready' argument..
I have a huge trust for Turkish people.
And as far as Apo, It was one of the best thing we did if you ask me..
There would have been bloodshed everywhere.
I dont want any more people dying in that 'unnecessary' war.
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| 19. |
08 Jul 2008 Tue 10:28 pm |
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Quoting thehandsom:
Sui
In 1970's Portugal, Greece were not better than Turkey both economically and politically. Even in 80s they were not much better when you check the number of people were depended on the agriculture, GDB, the position of the army, immigration from villages to the big cities etc..
But look at them now!! So I am not buying this 'we are ready' argument..
I have a huge trust for Turkish people.
And as far as Apo, It was one of the best thing we did if you ask me..
There would have been bloodshed everywhere.
I dont want any more people dying in that 'unnecessary' war.
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You dont need any Union to improve your skills about agriculture on anything...
If you have trust on Turkish people... you should also trust that they can anything without any union or whatever... the only thing we need is a openminded, honest and working government... not talking... but i dont have that trust because they dont know what they are doing and why they are doing... i see that by myself... most of the people are no different than sheeps... this is the sad truth unfortunately...
I know it by myself from Minister of Energy you are at far away and mass media is not a good tool to see whats going on in Turkey...
Looking at Greece or Portugal doesnt mean anything... But near that i have read somewhere that, greece was using and having more efficient income from his ports before EU...
And Apo... excuse me but, why are you keeping him in prison and feeding with the TAXES I GIVE? if they had got rid of from him... at least your court and government would have more respect and trust...
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