General/Off-topic |
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Agnosticism: A Religion
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| 1. |
09 Jul 2008 Wed 12:07 pm |
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Let's make a little bit of history folks.
I'll kick off.
The Denominations
Strong agnosticism (also called hard agnosticism, closed agnosticism, strict agnosticism, absolute agnosticism)—the view that the question of the existence or nonexistence of an omnipotent God and the nature of ultimate reality is unknowable by reason of our natural inability to verify any experience with anything but another subjective experience.
Mild agnosticism (also called weak agnosticism, soft agnosticism, open agnosticism, empirical agnosticism, temporal agnosticism)—the view that the existence or nonexistence of God or gods is currently unknown but is not necessarily unknowable, therefore one will withhold judgment until/if more evidence is available.
Apathetic agnosticism (also called Pragmatic agnosticism)—the view that there is no proof of either the existence or nonexistence of God or gods, but since any God or gods that may exist appear unconcerned for the universe or the welfare of its inhabitants, the question is largely academic anyway.
Agnostic theism (also called religious agnosticism)—the view of those who do not claim to know existence of God or gods, but still believe in such an existence. (See Knowledge vs. Beliefs)
Agnostic atheism—the view of those who do not know of the existence or nonexistence of God or gods, and do not believe in them.[7]
Ignosticism—the view that a coherent definition of God must be put forward before the question of the existence of God can be meaningfully discussed. If the chosen definition isn't coherent, the ignostic holds the noncognitivist view that the existence of God is meaningless or empirically untestable. A.J. Ayer, Theodore Drange, and other philosophers see both atheism and agnosticism as incompatible with ignosticism on the grounds that atheism and agnosticism accept 'God exists' as a meaningful proposition which can be argued for or against.
Taken from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnosticism
Now, all you Agnostics out there, come on out of the closet! Be brave, have FAITH in your own religion and share:
a) traditions
b) rituals
c) scriptures (I heard a rumour these may vary from day to day)
d) place of 'worship'
e) symbols
f) commandments
g) Anything else I can't think of
And all you non-Agnostics (henceforth known as Agnons), what interesting or controversial facets of Agnosticism have you heard about.
All you Atheists, please don't be angry . . . your own thread is on it's way (well I mean your own special thread)
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| 2. |
09 Jul 2008 Wed 12:24 pm |
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I'm not 100% sure PT but to my knowledge agnosticism is a philosophical concept rather than religion.
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| 3. |
09 Jul 2008 Wed 12:34 pm |
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| 4. |
09 Jul 2008 Wed 01:33 pm |
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Quoting Daydreamer: I'm not 100% sure PT but to my knowledge agnosticism is a philosophical concept rather than religion. |
You haven't got my point, or possibly my sense of humour. I know it's an acquired taste
Actually on my www travels I'm sure I saw a link to Christian Agnostics . . . honestly!
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| 5. |
09 Jul 2008 Wed 01:49 pm |
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"... agnostic theists, who identify themselves as both agnostics in the original sense and followers of a particular religion."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnosticism
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| 6. |
09 Jul 2008 Wed 01:58 pm |
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Exactly, thus it is not agnosticism that constitutes a religion but it may take the form of a philosophical concept within a religion.
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| 8. |
09 Jul 2008 Wed 02:12 pm |
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Quoting Daydreamer: Exactly, thus it is not agnosticism that constitutes a religion but it may take the form of a philosophical concept within a religion. |
Does this preclude your responding to some of the questions?
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| 9. |
09 Jul 2008 Wed 02:32 pm |
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Quoting peacetrain: Quoting Daydreamer: Exactly, thus it is not agnosticism that constitutes a religion but it may take the form of a philosophical concept within a religion. |
Does this preclude your responding to some of the questions? |
Nope, the fact that I am not an agnostic does, though 
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| 10. |
09 Jul 2008 Wed 02:51 pm |
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Quoting Daydreamer: Quoting peacetrain: Quoting Daydreamer: Exactly, thus it is not agnosticism that constitutes a religion but it may take the form of a philosophical concept within a religion. |
Does this preclude your responding to some of the questions? |
Nope, the fact that I am not an agnostic does, though |
Actually I meant to say 'Does it preclude your participation?'
I covered your stance here:
Quoting Peacetrain: And all you non-Agnostics (henceforth known as Agnons), what interesting or controversial facets of Agnosticism have you heard about?
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| 11. |
09 Jul 2008 Wed 03:11 pm |
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Sorry to disappoint you, I haven't heard much about Agnostics, actually the only person I can think of who states she's an Agnostic is AE. I had a couple of Neo-Pagan friends, some Satanists, Atheists but not Agnostics
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| 12. |
09 Jul 2008 Wed 05:46 pm |
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We had a Pagan family in our school many years ago. The family name was Pendragon 
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| 13. |
09 Jul 2008 Wed 05:52 pm |
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Quoting Daydreamer: Sorry to disappoint you, I haven't heard much about Agnostics, |
Don't be sorry, this thread is for anyone to join in.
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| 14. |
10 Jul 2008 Thu 01:17 am |
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RELİGION :
Islam
Buddhist/Taoist
Christian
Christian / Protestant
Christian / Catholic
Christian / LDS
Christian / Other
Hindu
Jewish
None/Agnostic
Spiritual but not religious
Scientology
Atheist
Not Religious
I could not understand Buddhist/Taoist, Hindu, Non-Agnostic, Spiritual but not religious and Scientology?
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| 15. |
10 Jul 2008 Thu 01:37 am |
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İts a bit confusing to me
So let me get that straight
Atheist....doesnt believe totally in God
Agnostic...having doubt if there is a god or not,some do believe in and some dont but in all cases they dont believe in religions,yes ?
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| 16. |
10 Jul 2008 Thu 01:39 am |
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There's deist as well. Deists believe in God but not in religions. Agnostics believe that we cannot know whether god and religions exist or not.
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| 17. |
10 Jul 2008 Thu 01:52 am |
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Quoting mltm: Agnostics believe that we cannot know whether god and religions exist or not. |
So what do we know ? :-S
Or when will we know it ?!
İn their believes i mean
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| 18. |
10 Jul 2008 Thu 02:13 am |
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Quoting CANLI: Quoting mltm: Agnostics believe that we cannot know whether god and religions exist or not. |
So what do we know ? :-S
Or when will we know it ?!
İn their believes i mean |
We can never know basically because we do not have the means to know it. It's beyond our capabilities. We can know the afterlife whether it exists or not only after we die.
"Agnosticism (Greek: α- a-, without + γνώσις gnōsis, knowledge; after Gnosticism) is the philosophical view that the truth value of certain claims — particularly metaphysical claims regarding theology, afterlife or the existence of God, gods, deities, or even ultimate reality — is unknown or, depending on the form of agnosticism, inherently unknowable."
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| 19. |
10 Jul 2008 Thu 02:22 am |
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Quoting mltm:
We can never know basically because we do not have the means to know it. It's beyond our capabilities. We can know the afterlife whether it exists or not only after we die.
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Haaa,i got,so they believe in what they see,and what they can acknowledge
But again,in their doubts,and if they find it is true and they find out that there is a God after they die...it will be so late for them i believe.
Anyway,all to his believes !
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| 20. |
10 Jul 2008 Thu 01:49 pm |
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Thanks to peacetrain, CANLI, Mltm...
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| 21. |
10 Jul 2008 Thu 01:58 pm |
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Quoting yilgun-7: Thanks to peacetrain, CANLI, Mltm... |
Why do you thank us?
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| 22. |
10 Jul 2008 Thu 02:27 pm |
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Quoting Daydreamer: Sorry to disappoint you, I haven't heard much about Agnostics, actually the only person I can think of who states she's an Agnostic is AE. I had a couple of Neo-Pagan friends, some Satanists, Atheists but not Agnostics |
I am quite happy to share with everyone, I consider myself agnostic to, and was told by my religous mother that is what I am.
I don't believe in any God whatsoever as it cannot be proven, but I believe in aspects of the Bible and consider it to be history. I don't believe in life after death and I don't believe in immaculate conception, therefore I don't believe that Mary conceived Jesus without intercourse with someone unidentifed, in other words Jesus was illegitimate.
I don't have a problem with peoples beliefs or religions and I respect them.
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| 23. |
10 Jul 2008 Thu 02:33 pm |
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Quoting CANLI: Quoting mltm:
We can never know basically because we do not have the means to know it. It's beyond our capabilities. We can know the afterlife whether it exists or not only after we die.
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Haaa,i got,so they believe in what they see,and what they can acknowledge
But again,in their doubts,and if they find it is true and they find out that there is a God after they die...it will be so late for them i believe.
Anyway,all to his believes ! |
Yes that is right. We believe what we see and acknowledge and very well put I would say.
There is nothing better than listening to a Jehovah Witness who says that dinosaurs never existed, even though there is proof!
So the key word for me here is "proof".
But when you are dead everything is too late, so be good now, believe in what you want to believe in and be happy and considerate to others (I mean everyone in general not just you Canli  ).
If there was a life after death, why has no-one come back to tell us? Or leave a sign?
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| 24. |
10 Jul 2008 Thu 04:52 pm |
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Quoting libralady: Quoting CANLI: Quoting mltm:
We can never know basically because we do not have the means to know it. It's beyond our capabilities. We can know the afterlife whether it exists or not only after we die.
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Haaa,i got,so they believe in what they see,and what they can acknowledge
But again,in their doubts,and if they find it is true and they find out that there is a God after they die...it will be so late for them i believe.
Anyway,all to his believes ! |
If there was a life after death, why has no-one come back to tell us? Or leave a sign? |
They did! http://www.flickr.com/photos/davidhelan/269989778/ 
http://www.flickr.com/photos/22658121@N00/184199177/
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| 25. |
10 Jul 2008 Thu 05:07 pm |
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Quoting peacetrain: Quoting libralady: Quoting CANLI: Quoting mltm:
We can never know basically because we do not have the means to know it. It's beyond our capabilities. We can know the afterlife whether it exists or not only after we die.
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Haaa,i got,so they believe in what they see,and what they can acknowledge
But again,in their doubts,and if they find it is true and they find out that there is a God after they die...it will be so late for them i believe.
Anyway,all to his believes ! |
If there was a life after death, why has no-one come back to tell us? Or leave a sign? |
They did! http://www.flickr.com/photos/davidhelan/269989778/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/22658121@N00/184199177/ |
I will only believe it if it happened to me! Sorry
Should have looked at the pics first! More fool me ............ hahahahaha!!!!! 
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| 26. |
10 Jul 2008 Thu 11:48 pm |
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A Turkish proverb=
Parayla imanın kimde olduğu belli olmaz :
It is unclear who has money and who faith (Only God knows).
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| 27. |
11 Jul 2008 Fri 10:45 pm |
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Quoting yilgun-7: A Turkish proverb=
Parayla imanın kimde olduğu belli olmaz :
It is unclear who has money and who faith (Only God knows). |
Well the Vatican and the Church of England, for example, might challenge that proverb. It seems they have both and everybody knows it.
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| 28. |
11 Jul 2008 Fri 11:14 pm |
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Quoting libralady: Quoting CANLI: Quoting mltm:
We can never know basically because we do not have the means to know it. It's beyond our capabilities. We can know the afterlife whether it exists or not only after we die.
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Haaa,i got,so they believe in what they see,and what they can acknowledge
But again,in their doubts,and if they find it is true and they find out that there is a God after they die...it will be so late for them i believe.
Anyway,all to his believes ! |
Yes that is right. We believe what we see and acknowledge and very well put I would say.
There is nothing better than listening to a Jehovah Witness who says that dinosaurs never existed, even though there is proof!
So the key word for me here is "proof".
But when you are dead everything is too late, so be good now, believe in what you want to believe in and be happy and considerate to others (I mean everyone in general not just you Canli ).
If there was a life after death, why has no-one come back to tell us? Or leave a sign? |
So do you believe in love? Proove it.
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| 29. |
11 Jul 2008 Fri 11:47 pm |
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Quoting teaschip: Quoting libralady: Quoting CANLI: Quoting mltm:
We can never know basically because we do not have the means to know it. It's beyond our capabilities. We can know the afterlife whether it exists or not only after we die.
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Haaa,i got,so they believe in what they see,and what they can acknowledge
But again,in their doubts,and if they find it is true and they find out that there is a God after they die...it will be so late for them i believe.
Anyway,all to his believes ! |
Yes that is right. We believe what we see and acknowledge and very well put I would say.
There is nothing better than listening to a Jehovah Witness who says that dinosaurs never existed, even though there is proof!
So the key word for me here is "proof".
But when you are dead everything is too late, so be good now, believe in what you want to believe in and be happy and considerate to others (I mean everyone in general not just you Canli ).
If there was a life after death, why has no-one come back to tell us? Or leave a sign? |
So do you believe in love? Proove it. |
Love describes a feeling but what has believing in love got to do with dinosaurs?
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| 30. |
12 Jul 2008 Sat 12:33 am |
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Quoting libralady: Quoting teaschip: Quoting libralady: Quoting CANLI: Quoting mltm:
We can never know basically because we do not have the means to know it. It's beyond our capabilities. We can know the afterlife whether it exists or not only after we die.
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Haaa,i got,so they believe in what they see,and what they can acknowledge
But again,in their doubts,and if they find it is true and they find out that there is a God after they die...it will be so late for them i believe.
Anyway,all to his believes ! |
Yes that is right. We believe what we see and acknowledge and very well put I would say.
There is nothing better than listening to a Jehovah Witness who says that dinosaurs never existed, even though there is proof!
So the key word for me here is "proof".
But when you are dead everything is too late, so be good now, believe in what you want to believe in and be happy and considerate to others (I mean everyone in general not just you Canli ).
If there was a life after death, why has no-one come back to tell us? Or leave a sign? |
So do you believe in love? Proove it. |
Love describes a feeling but what has believing in love got to do with dinosaurs? |
Nothing pertaining to dinosauras. you mentioned what you see and needing proof that God exists. I mearly pointed out how do you proove you are in love with someone? Not every thing is explainable or smack right in front of your eyes. It's a feeling..but the question is do you believe in love?
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| 31. |
12 Jul 2008 Sat 02:35 am |
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Quoting teaschip:
Nothing pertaining to dinosauras. you mentioned what you see and needing proof that God exists. I mearly pointed out how do you proove you are in love with someone? Not every thing is explainable or smack right in front of your eyes. It's a feeling..but the question is do you believe in love? |
....I think it could be explained like another sense. Seeing, smell, hearing, and....some people have that sense, others do not. How would one explain seeing to one who could not see? How do you explaine the feeling of silk satin to one who has only touched bricks?
For centuries most thought the world was flat.....they could not see it was not...they had to be convinced it was not.
For centuries people thought the earth was the center of the universe...and all revolved around the earth....Cats and dogs can see and hear what humans can not.
We now know that many diseases come from germs...but we can't see them. People used to say a evil spirit got into the sick person....how much we don't know and don't see.
Some have a sense of that Highest Power some do not.
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| 32. |
24 Jul 2008 Thu 08:46 pm |
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WORLD RELIGIONS =
Islam
Buddhist/Taoist
Christian
Christian / Protestant
Christian / Catholic
Christian / LDS
Christian / Other
Hindu
Jewish
None/Agnostic
Spiritual but not religious
Scientology
Atheist
Not Religious
Other
What do Spiritual but not religious, Buddhist/Taoist, Hindu and Scientology mean?
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| 33. |
24 Jul 2008 Thu 09:56 pm |
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Did Daydreamer predict this one? 
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| 34. |
24 Jul 2008 Thu 11:49 pm |
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Quote: Quote: Quote: Quoting teaschip:
If there was a life after death, why has no-one come back to tell us? Or leave a sign? |
So do you believe in love? Proove it. |
Love describes a feeling but what has believing in love got to do with dinosaurs? |
Nothing pertaining to dinosauras. you mentioned what you see and needing proof that God exists. I mearly pointed out how do you proove you are in love with someone? Not every thing is explainable or smack right in front of your eyes. It´s a feeling..but the question is do you believe in love? |
Sorry I did not see the response - I was sort of joking about the dinosaurs! Actually I do believe in love, I have children whom I love unconditionally and that is returned. I tend to find that two adults always put some sort of condition on love, therefore I don´t fall in love easily.
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| 35. |
25 Jul 2008 Fri 08:38 am |
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Quoting AEnigmamagnadea: Did Daydreamer predict this one? |
No  Apparently it´s not super powers that I thought I had but a lucky strike...
(I´m still quite sure we´ll see kinds of music - blues, rock, country etc; languages - so far we´ve had just the hardest and the most popular, no mention of language families; then there´s best paid jobs and endangered animals still to go)
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| 36. |
25 Jul 2008 Fri 01:02 pm |
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Quoting Daydreamer:
No Apparently it´s not super powers that I thought I had but a lucky strike...
(I´m still quite sure we´ll see kinds of music - blues, rock, country etc; languages - so far we´ve had just the hardest and the most popular, no mention of language families; then there´s best paid jobs and endangered animals still to go) |
I think we should start a new thread, something like ´what Yilgun will post next´..
(And whoever predicts correctly most, I take that person to a dinner)
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| 37. |
25 Jul 2008 Fri 01:58 pm |
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Quoting thehandsom:
(And whoever predicts correctly most, I take that person to a dinner)
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Is that a threat? 
And....can we expect more than toast?
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| 38. |
25 Jul 2008 Fri 07:07 pm |
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Edited (3/14/2009) by yilgun-7
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| 39. |
25 Jul 2008 Fri 07:09 pm |
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Quoting yilgun-7: I have so many other things on the go right now learning good English , my university, applying for my master, and then ph degree studies, many things …I just need to sign out so that I won´t waste my time.
Farewell to Cat woman, Libralady, Roswitha,, Leelu, Christine, Alameda and Avalon : I respected these ladies very much…They are really great and overwhelming persons.
Of course I liked Lady in red and daydreamer, because they are open-minded persons.
I have to tell that I have learnt a lot of things from the TLC.Thank you.
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Thank you Yilgun, good luck with your studies and stop by whenever you feel like it. You are always welcome here. 
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| 40. |
25 Jul 2008 Fri 07:13 pm |
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Edited (3/14/2009) by yilgun-7
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| 41. |
25 Jul 2008 Fri 07:20 pm |
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Quoting yilgun-7: Thank you so much, Catwoman.
As you know nothing on earth lasts forever.
But I hope I will come back again.
You are great persons.
My best respects to you.
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Thank you canim. Best respect to you too. Take care and good luck.
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| 42. |
25 Jul 2008 Fri 09:04 pm |
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Where is Yulgin going?
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| 43. |
25 Jul 2008 Fri 09:21 pm |
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Quoting teaschip: Where is Yulgin going? |
To the great TC website in the sky. (In another post he requested his account be deleted.)
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| 44. |
25 Jul 2008 Fri 11:11 pm |
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Yes,and actually we ´some members´ try to talk him out of it.
İf he wants to leave because he got bored,its ok,its his choice,but if he wanted to leave because he feels he was a joke material here,then i believe its not a nice thing!
İf you consider those are jokes then some people have sense humore and may accept them,and some people dont
And i believe we should respect that !
God knows i for one wont accept it those kind JOKES ,and im sure many wont too!
But we have better command of the language to stop it !
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| 45. |
26 Jul 2008 Sat 12:26 am |
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Canli, maybe I am missing something here, but can you tell me what jokes was he a material for? As far as I could see, the jokes were not personal or offensive, Yilgun just took them a little bit too personally I think.
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| 46. |
26 Jul 2008 Sat 01:10 am |
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Yilgun don´t be put off! The jokes and bullying are all part of TC. I was told recently that I was not educated enough for TC and another new member was ridiculed for being Greek! So my advice is ignore.
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| 47. |
26 Jul 2008 Sat 01:11 am |
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Well,you are right cat,they are not jokes !
İ have searched those so far then got tiered,i guess you can get the idea
http://www.turkishclass.com/forumTitle_31992
http://www.turkishclass.com/forumTitle_31593
http://www.turkishclass.com/forumTitle_31916
http://www.turkishclass.com/forumTitle_31505_-1
http://www.turkishclass.com/forumTitle_31224_-1
http://www.turkishclass.com/forumTitle_6289_254
You would know what to call them!
And also he can read!
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| 48. |
26 Jul 2008 Sat 02:56 am |
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Well... I won´t go through all these threads... and I agree that sometimes the jokes were somewhat harsh, but I think one should be able to handle some of that. You cannot be oversensitive like that and get offended by everything. These jokes were not terribly offensive and on the other hand there was also an equal amount of supportive messages to Yilgun, so I think that some people just need to relax a little bit and stop taking everything so personally. One has to be able to handle a little bit of sarcasm and criticism.
I am being criticized all the time, many times in rather offensive ways too - by those who are holier then thou five minutes later. Yilgun is not the first one, not the last one and not the one who´s being criticized, or mocked even half way as much as some others are.
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| 49. |
27 Jul 2008 Sun 02:22 pm |
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Quoting bydand: Yilgun don´t be put off! The jokes and bullying are all part of TC. I was told recently that I was not educated enough for TC and another new member was ridiculed for being Greek! So my advice is ignore. |
This is absolute balls Bydand - I explained quite clearly that my joke had nothing to do with someone being greek - why would it? 
I don´t know who told you you are "not educated enough" but I am certain you have, yet again, over-reacted or misunderstood someone´s post.
I really wonder why you still turn up on this site when all you do is complain?
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| 50. |
28 Jul 2008 Mon 10:15 am |
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Catwoman may be right that I am not capable of deep philosophy but to me saying "I am greek" is no more funny than saying "I am english" or "I am polish"
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| 51. |
28 Jul 2008 Mon 02:40 pm |
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Quoting CANLI: Yes,and actually we ´some members´ try to talk him out of it.
İf he wants to leave because he got bored,its ok,its his choice,but if he wanted to leave because he feels he was a joke material here,then i believe its not a nice thing!
İf you consider those are jokes then some people have sense humore and may accept them,and some people dont
And i believe we should respect that !
God knows i for one wont accept it those kind JOKES ,and im sure many wont too!
But we have better command of the language to stop it ! |
Again I agree with you Canli (becoming a habit I feel!!) anyway, I believe he did get fed up with being the centre of ridicule at some of his posts, it appears that one or two misplaced comments by him was enough to warrant this. But as he told me, he needs to focus on what is important in his life. I for one wish him all the best.
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| 52. |
17 Aug 2008 Sun 06:37 pm |
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Quoting CANLI: Yes,and actually we ´some members´ try to talk him out of it. İf he wants to leave because he got bored,its ok,its his choice,but if he wanted to leave because he feels he was a joke material here,then i believe its not a nice thing! İf you consider those are jokes then some people have sense humore and may accept them,and some people dont And i believe we should respect that ! God knows i for one wont accept it those kind JOKES ,and im sure many wont too! But we have better command of the language to stop it ! |
Again I agree with you Canli (becoming a habit I feel!!) anyway, I believe he did get fed up with being the centre of ridicule at some of his posts, it appears that one or two misplaced comments by him was enough to warrant this. But as he told me, he needs to focus on what is important in his life. I for one wish him all the best.
Exactly to the point. One or two friendly jibes is acceptable but constant mockery is quite another thing. Yilgun is a very polite young man, with not a hint of the arrogance some have accused him of. If he has made some response to his treatment, he´s well within his rights, we all do it, why should he be given such nasty treatment for that? There´s nothing anyone can say to excuse their poor treatment of Yilgun and I personally think his brand of sensitivity is far better than being thick skinned. None of his topics caused any harm, except ultimately to himself because of the constant remarks of a few snobbish people here who think they have the intellectual edge.
I hope Yilgun comes back soon with his batteries recharged, he was a respectful young man.
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| 53. |
17 Aug 2008 Sun 08:27 pm |
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What´s your point in bringing up these old threads, dear War Train? You already expressed your opinion on this topic, as others did as well (and their opinions are equally important here). Your opinions do not have any superiority over others´ opinions. So, maybe you could start respecting a little bit more then just your friends.
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| 54. |
17 Aug 2008 Sun 10:04 pm |
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Well, dear Catw´moan I´m not dragging up an old thread. I´ve been away and was catching up.
Friends? Why do you want to compartmentalise people by trying to decide who is friends with who? Is this the measure of how you treat someone or address them? "Oh they are friends with ´x´ so I can´t possibly be civil to them."
I don´t know Yilgun that well but it´s clear to see that he was unnecessarily mocked by some people here and if I want to I can give my opinion and anyone can comment, as you have commented on my post (and this doesn´t bother me in the slightest).
Reply as you wish but I´ve said what I wanted to say about Yilgun´s treatment, so the matter´s closed now as far as I´m concerned.
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| 55. |
17 Aug 2008 Sun 10:11 pm |
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I´m glad the matter is closed for you and I hope you mean what you say this time (as it happens you often change your mind).
About the friends thing... you really have a nerve.  Mz CGG persecutor. 
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| 56. |
17 Aug 2008 Sun 10:47 pm |
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About the friends thing... you really have a nerve. Mz CGG persecutor.
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| 57. |
18 Aug 2008 Mon 03:09 am |
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What´s your point in bringing up these old threads, dear War Train?
All the threads here is old, forum like vicous circle, at least yılgün´s threads change the atmosphere here 
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| 60. |
18 Aug 2008 Mon 04:25 pm |
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Aenigma, Femme Fatal, Slavica, Vineyards.... and many others do come back too! 
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| 61. |
14 Mar 2009 Sat 01:18 am |
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| 62. |
14 Mar 2009 Sat 01:48 am |
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Ohhh..that explains it!
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| 63. |
14 Mar 2009 Sat 01:59 am |
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btw..I completely agree what he says up there..
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| 64. |
14 Mar 2009 Sat 02:10 pm |
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what did he say?
btw..I completely agree what he says up there..
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| 65. |
14 Mar 2009 Sat 02:53 pm |
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what did he say?
It can only be viewed through magic glasses.....don´t you have a pair? 
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| 66. |
14 Mar 2009 Sat 02:56 pm |
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It can only be viewed through magic glasses.....don´t you have a pair?
It is actually invisible ink, and you have to hold it over a steaming kettle to be able to read it.............. nah! 
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| 67. |
14 Mar 2009 Sat 03:01 pm |
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i dont have one. can i borrow yours?
It can only be viewed through magic glasses.....don´t you have a pair?
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| 68. |
14 Mar 2009 Sat 03:12 pm |
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what did he say?
what he said was invisible to our eyes but it was outstanding to our sprits
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| 69. |
14 Mar 2009 Sat 04:15 pm |
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what he said was invisible to our eyes but it was outstanding to our sprits
after this massage  my third eye has opened and i started seeing things the way yilgun sees.
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| 70. |
14 Mar 2009 Sat 04:26 pm |
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Aenigma, Femme Fatal, Slavica, Vineyards.... and many others do come back too!
Like bad pennies.....
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| 71. |
14 Mar 2009 Sat 04:31 pm |
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Like bad pennies.....
the other two have joined the dead sheep poets society
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| 72. |
14 Mar 2009 Sat 04:32 pm |
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the other two have joined the dead sheep poets society
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