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Islam in Turkey is make-believe
(93 Messages in 10 pages - View all)
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10.       azade
1606 posts
 20 Sep 2008 Sat 09:43 pm

 

Quoting catwoman

Well, as far as I know, Islam has tons of interpretations as well. Naturally, each of them says that it is the ´correct´ one... I am sure it depends on who you learn these things from.. Thanks for explaining.

 

 Yeah you are right about that catwoman, there are many differences between the schools of fiqh, who base their rules on different Qur´an verses, it´s really hard to find an absolute truth to anything even in islam.

11.       CANLI
5084 posts
 20 Sep 2008 Sat 10:33 pm

 

Quoting thehandsom

 

 İ wonder why didnt you add the title of the article you have quoted  ?

The writer saying those things under that title to make a point,so you just erased the title and kept the content for a reason ?

12.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 20 Sep 2008 Sat 10:45 pm

 

Quoting CANLI

 İ wonder why didnt you add the title of the article you have quoted  ?

The writer saying those things under that title to make a point,so you just erased the title and kept the content for a reason ?

 

There was no particular reason..

I must have forgotten it.

Do you think I omitted deliberately?

 

13.       CANLI
5084 posts
 20 Sep 2008 Sat 10:47 pm

 

Quoting azade

 Yeah you are right about that catwoman, there are many differences between the schools of fiqh, who base their rules on different Qur´an verses, it´s really hard to find an absolute truth to anything even in islam.

 

 Actually i dont agree azada,anyone can say whatever he/she likes

We have 2 things only as reference in İslam...Qur´an and Hadith ´strong ones´

So regarding to the rules,they are obvious

İmams dont have different opinions at explaining the rules,because they cant

Maybe about applying them,some is a bit conservative than the other,some a bit simplified than the other,but all are with in the rule in Qur´an

And its mercy for us when imams have different opinions about a matter ´again within the Qur´an rules´ you can apply any opinion you wish and any of them will be right.

 

Examples,

You know Reba ´when you lend someone money and you take an extra money from him when he give it back to you ´ is haram ´forbidden´

So,if you borrow money from a bank is haram ?

İf you put money as a deposit in the bank and you gain interest is haram ?

İmams have different opinions about things like that

But for example is alcohol haram ?

They dont have different opinions about that because the rule is obvious.

When you hear something different,you know you shouldnt trust that person opinion because its against the rules.

14.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 20 Sep 2008 Sat 11:10 pm

 

Quoting CANLI

 Actually i dont agree azada,anyone can say whatever he/she likes

We have 2 things only as reference in İslam...Qur´an and Hadith ´strong ones´

So regarding to the rules,they are obvious

İmams dont have different opinions at explaining the rules,because they cant

Maybe about applying them,some is a bit conservative than the other,some a bit simplified than the other,but all are with in the rule in Qur´an

And its mercy for us when imams have different opinions about a matter ´again within the Qur´an rules´ you can apply any opinion you wish and any of them will be right.

 

Examples,

You know Reba ´when you lend someone money and you take an extra money from him when he give it back to you ´ is haram ´forbidden´

So,if you borrow money from a bank is haram ?

İf you put money as a deposit in the bank and you gain interest is haram ?

İmams have different opinions about things like that

But for example is alcohol haram ?

They dont have different opinions about that because the rule is obvious.

When you hear something different,you know you shouldnt trust that person opinion because its against the rules.

 

What is written in Quran is not clear enough and it is obviously inadequate to give sufficent answers to all problems people are facing in modern world.

 

Just that little example you have given it up there is a proof for that.. In today´s world with the inflation and everything, if you dont take interest from a bank because it is haram, would not be a losing money because of Quran.

The other example you have given is the alcohol. And we know that drinking a moderate amount of wine is good for you. Why will  a good thing be banned by Quran?

People are learning faster than ever. The information is traveling with incredible speed in this century that people dont need to look at Quran anymore for their answers. Science is able to give more and more answer to almost everything.

And that is how it is going to be in the future!!

 

 

 

 

15.       catwoman
8933 posts
 20 Sep 2008 Sat 11:25 pm

 

Quoting thehandsom

People are learning faster than ever. The information is traveling with incredible speed in this century that people dont need to look at Quran anymore for their answers. Science is able to give more and more answer to almost everything.

And that is how it is going to be in the future!!

 

Inşallah! {#lang_emotions_angel}

16.       azade
1606 posts
 20 Sep 2008 Sat 11:33 pm

 

Quoting CANLI

 Actually i dont agree azada,anyone can say whatever he/she likes

We have 2 things only as reference in İslam...Qur´an and Hadith ´strong ones´

So regarding to the rules,they are obvious

İmams dont have different opinions at explaining the rules,because they cant

Maybe about applying them,some is a bit conservative than the other,some a bit simplified than the other,but all are with in the rule in Qur´an

And its mercy for us when imams have different opinions about a matter ´again within the Qur´an rules´ you can apply any opinion you wish and any of them will be right.

 

Examples,

You know Reba ´when you lend someone money and you take an extra money from him when he give it back to you ´ is haram ´forbidden´

So,if you borrow money from a bank is haram ?

İf you put money as a deposit in the bank and you gain interest is haram ?

İmams have different opinions about things like that

But for example is alcohol haram ?

They dont have different opinions about that because the rule is obvious.

When you hear something different,you know you shouldnt trust that person opinion because its against the rules.

 

 Canlı can you tell me which leading imams think it is aceptable to put money in the bank and gain interest from it or borrow money?

From what I have read all imams say it is haram, but if you have some material stating the opposite I´d like to read it. We actually have a special bank (http://amanah.dk/) where you can borrow or deposit money with no interest in my home country, because loads of muslims here have not been wanting to buy a home (with a loan in the bank) because it´s a very common opinion that it is haram.

17.       CANLI
5084 posts
 20 Sep 2008 Sat 11:59 pm

 

Quoting thehandsom

What is written in Quran is not clear enough and it is obviously inadequate to give sufficent answers to all problems people are facing in modern world.

 

 

 

Well,i think you should add ´i think,or in my opinion´ because obviouly thats not WE muslims think !

 

Quoting thehandsom

 

 

Just that little example you have given it up there is a proof for that.. In today´s world with the inflation and everything, if you dont take interest from a bank because it is haram, would not be a losing money because of Quran.

 

 

İ didnt know that Qur´an was meant for some period,and not the other

So its fit for the past time and not suitable for the present,nor the future ?

Hmmm,sorry to disappoint you,but believers,not just muslims,but all,DO believe that their holly books and rules are valid for all times

 

Quoting thehandsom

The other example you have given is the alcohol. And we know that drinking a moderate amount of wine is good for you. Why will  a good thing be banned by Quran?

 

 

Just a little example,check the accident rate that made by drunk people and maybe you can find an answer ?!

 

Quoting thehandsom

People are learning faster than ever. The information is traveling with incredible speed in this century that people dont need to look at Quran anymore for their answers. Science is able to give more and more answer to almost everything.

And that is how it is going to be in the future!!

 

Science will give answer for if lying is sin or not ?

Science will give answer if stealing is good or not ?

mmmm do you need more examples ?

What brought up science here ? even tho,who said that religion conflict with science ?

Again,i guess you need to add ´i think,or in my opinion´  because WE ´believers´ actually have time to read Quran .

18.       CANLI
5084 posts
 21 Sep 2008 Sun 12:16 am

 

Quoting azade

 Canlı can you tell me which leading imams think it is aceptable to put money in the bank and gain interest from it or borrow money?

From what I have read all imams say it is haram, but if you have some material stating the opposite I´d like to read it. We actually have a special bank (http://amanah.dk/) where you can borrow or deposit money with no interest in my home country, because loads of muslims here have not been wanting to buy a home (with a loan in the bank) because it´s a very common opinion that it is haram.

 

 azade,im trying to search that issue for you on the net and have it in English so you can go through it yourself.

Yes,here our imams have different opinions about the gaining interest issue

Some dont allow it and some do

But at borrowing money issue,most of them are against it.

 

We can continue it via pm if you like

We would find handsom complaining that he feels like sitting in mosque  

19.       armegon
1872 posts
 21 Sep 2008 Sun 12:40 am

Actually, thehandsom it seems you are now confusing the terms science & religion. Science is one thing and religion is another. Science is a method of obtaining true informations, explaining the matter and events using mathematics. Science is entire informations obtained via these methods. Science is related to nature, laws of nature not the laws beyond nature. This universe which we live in has standart laws. So human-being is bounded with that laws just like no thing can be faster than light, because of this proving or disproving & verifying or refuting a subsistence beyond nature with science seems impossible. Then you cannot prove or disprove God using science if the God is beyond the scientific formulas, senses and experiments. In that case God cannot be observed, cannot be explained mathematically. Because of this He is called God. And because of this many scientists do not mention their beliefs in their articles except some personal allusions. So this is belief and everybody is free to believe in God or not. People are researching through the centuries, whats the purpose of life, what will happen when we die, how life started on earth etc. People who thinks these are withstand to a subsistence beyond nature namely God, choose a religion for themselves, try to abide by its rules. Some rules which comes to you absurd, maybe very meaningful for another one, thats belief, and thats simple...

20.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 21 Sep 2008 Sun 01:01 am

I didnt know that Qur´an was meant for some period,and not the other

So its fit for the past time and not suitable for the present,nor the future

Hmmm,sorry to disappoint you,but believers,not just muslims,but all,DO believe that their holly books and rules are valid for all times.

 

But Canli, you proved yourself that Quran is not giving you clear answers in today´s world with the saving money!!!

 

Check the accident rate that made by drunk people and maybe you can find an answer ?!

 

But then, it could have been like ´dont drink and drive´..why was it banned totaly?

 

Science will give answer is lying is sin or not ?

 

Lying is a moral concept and moral concepts are determined by the societies not by religious books.

Do you think humans were lying all the time when there were not books around?

 

Science will give answer if stealing is good or not ?

I would support Robin Hood type stealing personally   Again, good or bad is a moral concept and it is nothing to do with religions

 

Who said that religion conflict with science

I am (and many many many people are) saying that religions (and all dogmas) conflict with science..

Again,i guess you need to add ´i think,or in my opinion´  because WE ´believers´ actually have time to read Quran .

I think I have read  Quran more than an average believer.

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