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You have to kill terrorists. Nothing else works.. (really?)
(181 Messages in 19 pages - View all)
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10.       armegon
1872 posts
 09 Jan 2009 Fri 05:19 pm

 

Quoting catwoman

Nobody said they are "equal", just "similar", in the sense that their roots is oppression.

 

 But they are not similar in that sense what you meant . Actually they are not comparable as i mentioned...

11.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 09 Jan 2009 Fri 05:55 pm

The way how the terrorism and fanatisism are florished, PKK and Hamas are fully comparable..
The mistakes which have been made in the past and the mistakes still being done are comparable..
The reasons they become terrorists or fanatics are comparable.
Humuliations and oppressions palestinians are subjected are comparable to what kurds´ havesubjected.. (I am sure everybody will agree that WE banned of their language and insisted many many years that ´Kurds did not exist´.)
They way they are treated is similar.. For Israel, they will just kill kill kill all the Hamas members.. For Turkey, the hawks, will just kill kill kill PKK members..
In both cases the people insisting that ´this is just terrorism and killing all is only option´ are  arrogant, delusional, inhumane, primitive, mindless and blind.
Blind because ´only killing the terrorists without dealing with the real cause´ will bring more dead and you will never be able to finish the terrorism..

 

12.       armegon
1872 posts
 09 Jan 2009 Fri 07:27 pm

I think the only mistake in ME is zionist Israel thehandsom. The region was in peace for nearly 400 hundred years till the WW1. And if you equalize or compare pkk and hamas, i would understand from that you are trying to say that Turkey is an occupier in south-east(eðer böyle bir þey kastediyorsan zaten git sen kumda oyna daha iyi ). Because Israel has been occupying Gazze, Golem and west sheria for about 35 years. Laws of nations also say this, there are lots of legal decisions that say Israel should step back the lands that she occupied but evevrybody knows Israel ignores this.

 

So if you FULLY compare pkk and hamas, this means you want to say pkk is fighting against the occupation of Turkey which is simply absurd. Now you see how terrorism flourished in Palestine? But dont ignore the biggest terrorist there. But you are right on something both this organizations supported by same forces. Its what Israel desires actually. If not hamas, they will sure find an another excuse, if not pkk, some will find another terrorist organization, nothing changes.

 

Pkk is a terrorist organization for sure, but hamas supported by 70% of palestenians, one of them fighting against the occupation, other one just terrorising the country. Thats the disticntion. If you also compare pkk and hamas, i would have to say that you are trying to justify the occupation of Israel using Turkey, and you see all palestenians as terrorists like Israel.

 

And you again using agitations that does not make sense really. It seems you and whitepath are also good at demagogy ...

 

  

13.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 09 Jan 2009 Fri 08:29 pm

 

Quoting armegon

I think the only mistake in ME is zionist Israel thehandsom. The region was in peace for nearly 400 hundred years till the WW1. And if you equalize or compare pkk and hamas, i would understand from that you are trying to say that Turkey is an occupier in south-east(eðer böyle bir þey kastediyorsan zaten git sen kumda oyna daha iyi ). Because Israel has been occupying Gazze, Golem and west sheria for about 35 years. Laws of nations also say this, there are lots of legal decisions that say Israel should step back the lands that she occupied but evevrybody knows Israel ignores this.

 

So if you FULLY compare pkk and hamas, this means you want to say pkk is fighting against the occupation of Turkey which is simply absurd. Now you see how terrorism flourished in Palestine? But dont ignore the biggest terrorist there. But you are right on something both this organizations supported by same forces. Its what Israel desires actually. If not hamas, they will sure find an another excuse, if not pkk, some will find another terrorist organization, nothing changes.

 

Pkk is a terrorist organization for sure, but hamas supported by 70% of palestenians, one of them fighting against the occupation, other one just terrorising the country. Thats the disticntion. If you also compare pkk and hamas, i would have to say that you are trying to justify the occupation of Israel using Turkey, and you see all palestenians as terrorists like Israel.

 

And you again using agitations that does not make sense really. It seems you and whitepath are also good at demagogy ...

 

 

 

Well I never thought for a second you would agree what I said basically..

Apart from you, almosy everybody sees the similarities and what causes those people to take arms.

But according to you, Palestinians are right but Kurds are wrong..

What I am saying here is so obvious..what caused the terrorism in Turkey is very similar to what has been going  on in Israel (though in Israel, everything is harsher)..

I never said that PKK is fighting against accupation..How can it be as they are in their own country.

But what I said was that ´not giving them to basic rights CAUSED the terrorism in Turkey´

As it is mentioned in the original text nobody is born as terrorists..Something is causing them to be terrorists.(In my country´s case, it was our brain dead nationalism and the army)

If you fail to acknowledge that fact there will be more terrorists.. If you dont look at what is causing it and thinking that ´terrorists got to be killed..there is no other way´ there will be more terrorists and more people will be dying..

If you want to see more dead people in Turkey or in Palestine, it is your wish, your choice. Not mine..

 

14.       teaschip
3870 posts
 09 Jan 2009 Fri 10:22 pm

We could sit here all day and try to analyze why people do what they do.   You talk to the majority of prisioners who have committed violent crimes, it always refers back to their upbringing. But tell me why is at that some people are brought up in horrible situations and enivornments and turn out to be normal citizens.  It puts more sympathy on the attacker instead of the victim if you ask me.  I think it´s important to know the root cause but it shouldn´t steer away from the crime itself. 

 

When you look at women who are brought up in situations where they have been victims of rape, sexual abuse they don´t typically lash out and become the attacker.  I guess that´s another topic men vs women.

15.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 09 Jan 2009 Fri 10:30 pm

 

Quoting teaschip

We could sit here all day and try to analyze why people do what they do.   You talk to the majority of prisioners who have committed violent crimes, it always refers back to their upbringing. But tell me why is at that some people are brought up in horrible situations and enivornments and turn out to be normal citizens.  It puts more sympathy on the attacker instead of the victim if you ask me.  I think it´s important to know the root cause but it shouldn´t steer away from the crime itself. 

 

When you look at women who are brought up in situations where they have been victims of rape, sexual abuse they don´t typically lash out and become the attacker.  I guess that´s another topic men vs women.

 

You are mixing up terrorism, rebelion etc with  petty crimes and petty criminals up there..

Or may be, you have always thought that people with bad upbringing becomes terrorists..

 

 

 

16.       teaschip
3870 posts
 09 Jan 2009 Fri 10:36 pm

 

Quoting thehandsom

You are mixing up terrorism, rebelion etc with  petty crimes and petty criminals up there..

Or may be, you have always thought that people with bad upbringing becomes terrorists..

 

 Petty crimes..I don´t find murder classified as petty.

17.       armegon
1872 posts
 09 Jan 2009 Fri 10:43 pm

 

Quoting thehandsom

Well I never thought for a second you would agree what I said basically..

 

 Thats my pleasure ...

Quoting thehandsom

Apart from you, almosy everybody sees the similarities and what causes those people to take arms.

 

 I just showed these organizations are not similar. Demagogy dont work on me unfortunately...

Quoting thehandsom

But according to you, Palestinians are right but Kurds are wrong..

 

No, im not saying one of them is right or wrong in the first place. Im saying comparison between pkk and hamas is nonsense and simply emphasized they are different. I dont see all Kurds as terrorists whereas it seems you nearly labelled all palestinians as terrorists because of hamas. Actually i do not sympathize with hamas, i do think they have been realizing terrorist acts, thats what Israel desires, hamas know this of course, but i know that Israel can always find an excuse to occupy, it was same before hamas and i also know that Israel using some groups in Palestinians to divide them.

Quoting thehandsom

What I am saying here is so obvious..what caused the terrorism in Turkey is very similar to what has been going  on in Israel (though in Israel, everything is harsher)..

Really? Whats that similarity? I have never realized that pkk is widely supoorted by Kurds or Turks whereas it seems hamas is supported by public.

 

Quoting thehandsom

But what I said was that ´not giving them to basic rights CAUSED the terrorism in Turkey´

 

What basic rights are you talking about? And how can you compare it with Palestine? Is Turkey occupying the lands of Kurds? Is Turkey killing women and children? We are talking about the first right of humanity which is living, thats not valid for Kurds. The only reason that cause pkk to rebel is to ban their language(it has never been banned actually but never been an official language in Turkey like the language of other ethnicities, if it is the case, today its hard to find Kurdish speaking people, in fact there are still many people who dont know Turkish) and humiliate them or any other factors as i mentioned many times here?

Quoting thehandsom

Something is causing them to be terrorists.(In my country´s case, it was our brain dead nationalism and the army)

 

 , im not surprised, it will be last stop that you will put all the blame on nationalism and the army...

Quoting thehandsom

If you want to see more dead people in Turkey or in Palestine, it is your wish, your choice. Not mine..

 

  Simply, do not compare Israel with Turkey or hamas with pkk {#lang_emotions_wink}...

18.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 09 Jan 2009 Fri 11:55 pm

 

Quoting armegon

  Thats my pleasure ..

 

 

Pleasure is all mine..you trust me..

Quote:

I just showed these organizations are not similar. Demagogy dont work on me unfortunately...

 

 

Is this your last stand? lol lol I am telling you similarities about what causes those people to take arms. and your answer is "Demagogy dont work on me"  {#lang_emotions_laugh_at}

Quote:

No, im not saying one of them is right or wrong in the first place. Im saying comparison between pkk and hamas is nonsense and simply emphasized they are different. I dont see all Kurds as terrorists whereas it seems you nearly labelled all palestinians as terrorists because of hamas. Actually i do not sympathize with hamas, i do think they have been realizing terrorist acts, thats what Israel desires, hamas know this of course, but i know that Israel can always find an excuse to occupy, it was same before hamas and i also know that Israel using some groups in Palestinians to divide them.

 

 

I never labelled palestinians terrorists at all..(show me if you insist.) I always said that hamas is the result of israel´s actions..Hamas is the result of what people are caplable of doing when you corner them like animals or treat them like animals.. (that is how it started with PKK as well..Diyarbakir prison)

Quote:

Really? Whats that similarity? I have never realized that pkk is widely supoorted by Kurds or Turks whereas it seems hamas is supported by public.

 

 

PKK is widely suported by Kurds..dont lie to yourself..

Even people who have nothing to do with pkk acknowledeges that all the gains kurds have such as recognition as a different ethnic group, language, kurdish tv etc because of PKK..at least most of the kurds respect that..Telling the opposite will be lying.

Quote:

What basic rights are you talking about? And how can you compare it with Palestine? Is Turkey occupying the lands of Kurds? Is Turkey killing women and children? We are talking about the first right of humanity which is living, thats not valid for Kurds. The only reason that cause pkk to rebel is to ban their language(it has never been banned actually but never been an official language in Turkey like the language of other ethnicities, if it is the case, today its hard to find Kurdish speaking people, in fact there are still many people who dont know Turkish) and humiliate them or any other factors as i mentioned many times here?

 

 

what basic rights?

Check the latest Turkish Economic and Social Studies Foundation, or TESEV report on the Kurdish problem..

here is the link for you.. (kurdish is indispensible prerequisite) see what I am talking about? While everybody acknowledges the basic rights have been denied for kurds. Insisting that ´it was not the case´ is going to be ´not telling the truth´. 

Kurds have been living in the same land for thousands of years..Of course there is not accupation..

About women and children? I dont want to answer that question because It will be simply embarresing. (Please check  EU court cases and how many times as a country we have been found guilty and ACCEPTED and paid the punisments..You will have plenty of examples)   

Quote:

 im not surprised, it will be last stop that you will put all the blame on nationalism and the army...

 

 

 Well nationalism, the army and the shadow of the army in Turkey have always been in the power. .While almost every initivate to bring peace into this conflict was thwarted by the army, how can you say that they were not to blame? 

 Quote:

Simply, do not compare Israel with Turkey or hamas with pkk ..

 

I am comparing pkk with hamas and you can nothing to do about it..Not only me..people even in Turkey is comparing both situations as you saw in the first post.

Simply people should wake up and stop more killings..

Because of you (in generic sense btw) people are still dying..They could have been prevented years ago..

 

19.       CANLI
5084 posts
 09 Jan 2009 Fri 11:59 pm

 

Quoting thehandsom

I am comparing pkk with hamas and you can nothing to do about it..Not only me..people even in Turkey is comparing both situations as you saw in the first post.

Simply people should wake up and stop more killings..

Because of you (in generic sense btw) people are still dying..They could have been prevented years ago..

 

 But handsom,if you compare PKK with Hamas,then you are stating PKK legal rights in fighting to gain back its land which has been occupied with Türkiye.

Ýs that what you are saying ?!

That is the case with Hamas, Palestine,and Ýsrael.

20.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 10 Jan 2009 Sat 12:02 am

 

Quoting CANLI

 But handsom,if you compare PKK with Hamas,then you are stating PKK legal rights in fighting to gain back its land which has been occupied with Türkiye.

Ýs that what you are saying ?!

That is the case with Hamas, Palestine,and Ýsrael.

 

Well I think you misunderstood what I said since the begining..

I was comparing how those people become rebels and took arms..

The conditions, the treatment, denying basic rights, ´kill them all´ mentality, ´it is all terrorism´ mentality..

is it clear?

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