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450.       lemon
1374 posts
 21 Apr 2010 Wed 04:21 pm

 

Quoting catwoman

 

 

Sounds aweful! I don´t know if the "secular Europe has no moral values"... I don´t know what you mean by that.. I think that the state should not be taking any moral stances, just like Agnieszka Graff said "for people to have moral choices, the laws have to be liberal", and laws are not liberal in "moral" (read: religious) countries.

 

I believe in the state propaganda model of the society. In countries that raise children in the strict authoritarian way, the children learn from early age to obey the rules, be obedient followers of what the elders or government tell them to do. But in free societies like the West, it is not that easy to have obedient population (and you need that if you want the politicians to run freely without any check from the people, and trust me - they themselves are billioners and they have billioner friends in whose interest it is that politicians make decisions that are bad for the people), so they have a more sophisticated model of control. They lower the standards of education, increase tuition so that people are in debt for the rest of their lives and therefore slaves to the system, and make people consumed with dumb entertainment/consumerism/"created wants" being the main pursuits.. all that while being completely ignorant about the world and important decisions that are being made in the government.

 

So yes, I think that both methods of parenting are horrible. And the traditional families apparently also beat the kids.. that´s child abuse.

 

I totally dont get what you mean by "liberal laws". Europe has the most liberal laws and regulations in the whole world. And that is the main reason for Europe to experience moral corruption. The laws are to protect innocent and punish culprints not to be fancy named liberal.

What do you mean by moral choices? you cant choose morals. good is good and bad is bad - and this is one moral. there are no other options.

 

As for politicians together with rich people fool us. True!

 

I am against the child abuse, but people should not exaggerate that too. If I punish my children even physically I do it out of love.

I understand there are patalogical cases of abuse. But what is happening in Europe where children abuse their own rights, their own lives it is OTT!

451.       Elisabeth
5732 posts
 21 Apr 2010 Wed 06:14 pm

 

Quoting catwoman

 

 

They lower the standards of education, increase tuition so that people are in debt for the rest of their lives and therefore slaves to the system, and make people consumed with dumb entertainment/consumerism/"created wants" being the main pursuits.. all that while being completely ignorant about the world and important decisions that are being made in the government.

 

 

 Soooooo true!  It is so hard to raise a well round child here in the US.  I am not sure how it is where you are lemon but they have discontinued most extra activities like art, music, theater, most sports (except for the ones that bring schools money).  I don´t think that schools should only be a place for academic studies.  It is a place to find out about the world around us and to become a "well-rounded", educated human being who is able to make decisions on their own.  It is no wonder that so many adolescent children in the west are acting out and behaving badly.  We have taken away all things that make a human being a unique and special, we have cut off all avenues of growth and expression and then pour our children into a mold of public school mediocrity.  I am lucky to be able to send my son to music lessons and to pay for extra classes for him in subjects that he is interested in.  I do live in what is supposedly a good school districe BUT I still think what he is learning in school is very substandard to what I learned 25 years ago in school.  Parents who usually work full time are charged with the task of filling in the gap of what public schools are missing....and more and more these days, less and less parents are able to do that.   

452.       catwoman
8933 posts
 21 Apr 2010 Wed 06:26 pm

 

Quoting lemon

 

 

I totally dont get what you mean by "liberal laws". Europe has the most liberal laws and regulations in the whole world. And that is the main reason for Europe to experience moral corruption. The laws are to protect innocent and punish culprints not to be fancy named liberal.

What do you mean by moral choices? you cant choose morals. good is good and bad is bad - and this is one moral. there are no other options.

 

Well, for you the line is very clear and that´s your choice, for some other people it may not be the same as yours! For example abortion - almost every woman says that she doesn´t ever want to have one, but for example when she is unfortunate enough to be raped by a man, she may have to make a TOUGH moral choice (tough either way - to get and not to get abortion).

Prostitution is another one - there are women who are in prostitution because of lack of other options, many of them! They hate themselves for doing it, but they have to make a tough moral choice. (of course not all prostituted women are the same)

On and on... so liberal laws should allow space for these moral decisions to take place and should never force anyone to do what a politician or another person THINKS one should do in her/his tough life situation.

 

What kind of "moral corruption" is Europe in? Please explain.

453.       lemon
1374 posts
 21 Apr 2010 Wed 10:17 pm

how nice to hear from you, my texan friend Cool

 

that cat thingy is suffocating me with liberal strings.

Quoting Elisabeth

 

 

 Soooooo true!  It is so hard to raise a well round child here in the US.  I am not sure how it is where you are lemon but they have discontinued most extra activities like art, music, theater, most sports (except for the ones that bring schools money).  I don´t think that schools should only be a place for academic studies.  It is a place to find out about the world around us and to become a "well-rounded", educated human being who is able to make decisions on their own.  It is no wonder that so many adolescent children in the west are acting out and behaving badly.  We have taken away all things that make a human being a unique and special, we have cut off all avenues of growth and expression and then pour our children into a mold of public school mediocrity.  I am lucky to be able to send my son to music lessons and to pay for extra classes for him in subjects that he is interested in.  I do live in what is supposedly a good school districe BUT I still think what he is learning in school is very substandard to what I learned 25 years ago in school.  Parents who usually work full time are charged with the task of filling in the gap of what public schools are missing....and more and more these days, less and less parents are able to do that.   

 

 

454.       Elisabeth
5732 posts
 22 Apr 2010 Thu 04:18 pm

 

Quoting lemon

how nice to hear from you, my texan friend Cool

 

 

 

 

 Did you have to remind everyone I am from Texas.....now I will be accused of not letting gays get a divorce!  I have been busy converting athiests and baking cookies!  Going back into the kitchen now...{#emotions_dlg.get_you}

455.       lemon
1374 posts
 22 Apr 2010 Thu 04:32 pm

 

Quoting Elisabeth

 

 

 Did you have to remind everyone I am from Texas.....now I will be accused of not letting gays get a divorce!  I have been busy converting athiests and baking cookies!  Going back into the kitchen now...{#emotions_dlg.get_you}

 

sorry my borat nature wasnt being very considerate again!

 

but where have you been for so long? it is nice to see some people back.

456.       Elisabeth
5732 posts
 22 Apr 2010 Thu 05:19 pm

 

Quoting lemon

 

 

 it is nice to see some people back.

 

Some people?  {#emotions_dlg.think}  interesting that you put it that way!

457.       lemon
1374 posts
 27 Apr 2010 Tue 04:05 pm

What do you think of UFO?{#emotions_dlg.rolleyes}

 

i may tell an interesting story  {#emotions_dlg.shy}

458.       Elisabeth
5732 posts
 27 Apr 2010 Tue 04:22 pm

 

Quoting lemon

What do you think of UFO?{#emotions_dlg.rolleyes}

 

i may tell an interesting story  {#emotions_dlg.shy}

 

 I definately believe in UFOs.....I am just so excited that you are finally going to tell the story of how you got here!!{#emotions_dlg.lol_fast} 

459.       lemon
1374 posts
 27 Apr 2010 Tue 05:03 pm

 

Quoting Elisabeth

 

 

 I definately believe in UFOs.....I am just so excited that you are finally going to tell the story of how you got here!!{#emotions_dlg.lol_fast} 

 

shhhhhh! I was abducted! {#emotions_dlg.ninja}

460.       lemon
1374 posts
 27 Apr 2010 Tue 05:13 pm

Do you know anything about Edward IIII?

 

there is a mistake.

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