General/Off-topic |
|
|
|
All Men Watch Porn, Scientists Find
|
1. |
03 Dec 2009 Thu 01:50 pm |
Scientists at the University of Montreal launched a search for men who had never looked at pornography- but couldn´t find any:
Researchers were conducting a study comparing the views of men in their 20s who had never been exposed to pornography with regular users.
But their project stumbled at the first hurdle when they failed to find a single man who had not been seen it.
“We started our research seeking men in their 20s who had never consumed pornography,” said Professor Simon Louis Lajeunesse. “We couldn´t find any.”
Although hampered in its original aim, the study did examined the habits of those young men who used pornography – which would appear to be all of them.
Prof Lajeunesse interviewed 20 heterosexual male university students who consumed pornography, and found on average, they first watched pornography when they were 10 years old.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/relationships/6709646/All-men-watch-porn-scientists-find.html
|
|
2. |
03 Dec 2009 Thu 04:31 pm |
Scientific confirmation.......AT LAST!
I can´t wait until the next scientific breakthrough....All Men Breathe!
|
|
3. |
03 Dec 2009 Thu 06:52 pm |
.All Men Breathe!
How shocking!
|
|
4. |
03 Dec 2009 Thu 09:05 pm |
This is terrifying!! Especially considering the kind of stuff they watch and apparently find stimulating.. a lot of it is extremely hateful and racist, but anyway..violence against women, exploitaition and mysogyny is here to stay
Here´s a recent study about the use of pornography and supporting violence against women:
Pornography and attitudes supporting violence against women: revisiting the relationship in nonexperimental studies
"the current results showed an overall significant positive association between pornography use and attitudes supporting violence against women"
Edited (12/3/2009) by catwoman
|
|
5. |
04 Dec 2009 Fri 12:15 am |
Just wondering...is there a ban on pornography in radically Islamic countries like Saudi?
|
|
6. |
04 Dec 2009 Fri 12:36 am |
Just wondering...is there a ban on pornography in radically Islamic countries like Saudi?
The answer is yes...
|
|
7. |
04 Dec 2009 Fri 02:24 am |
Cheers Armegon.
Kitty, we know you´re obssessed with the anti-porn campaign. How would you account for the violence against women in countries where porn is banned? The truth is not every man watching porn will treat women with disrespect and not every man who doesn´t will be respectful. Like it or not, we are sexual beings (meaning both men and women). Culture has forced us to believe in monogamy (or polygamy for only one gender is some cultures ) but our instincts are still there. The porn business makes money on our primitive needs. Funny how you always refer to women being abused in porns and at the same time you forget to mention there is the other gender involved as well. Aren´t men treated there in a derogatory manner?
|
|
8. |
04 Dec 2009 Fri 08:28 pm |
Kitty, we know you´re obssessed with the anti-porn campaign. How would you account for the violence against women in countries where porn is banned?
Yeah, and you´re obsessed with the pro-porn campaign. Are you actually serious about this question? I think you´re too intelligent to ask this... as well as the rest of them.
Edited (12/4/2009) by catwoman
|
|
9. |
04 Dec 2009 Fri 09:38 pm |
This is terrifying!! Especially considering the kind of stuff they watch and apparently find stimulating..
May be....but I think you are jumping to conclusions about what they watch. The article did not define exactly what porn is.
In the not too distant past many things were banned as porn....
During the excavations of Pompeii a great deal of pornography was first discovered and hidden away....for none but the "upper classes" to view. It was not expected that the lower classes would contain themselves when viewing such material.....
There used to be a definition of erotic art....and pornography....sometimes they merge together. I suspect in this cast, they are merged.
It´s interesting to look at the etymology of the word:
Porne= prostitute..............graph = write or to record
IOW it is a written or drawn description of the activity of a prostitute. I guess sort of what could be expected at certain establishments....or promotional material....
Censorship History
"As public tastes change, so does the nature of popular drama. In the fifth century BCE, Aristophanes´ "Lysistrata" attracted censors for its themes of wifely rebellion and sex. From the 15th to the 18th centuries, plays were censored primarily for religious or political reasons. In the 19th century, social and sexual reasons for censorship emerged, and modern moralists have objected to works by such playwrights as Arthur Miller, Eugene O´Neill, and Lillian Hellman. Most recently, plays dealing with topics such as homosexuality and AIDS have garnered unwanted attention from censors. This work outlines the censorship history of 125 classic plays from ancient times to the present. Each entry presents the name(s) under which the play has appeared, the date it was produced and country of original production, a summary of the play, its censorship history, and suggestions for further reading. Among the works covered are: "Angels in America - Millennium Approaches", Tony Kushner, 1991; "Le Barbier de Seville", Pierre Beaumarchis, 1775; "The Children´s Hour", Lillian Hellman, 1934; "The Crucible", Arthur Miller, 1953; "Henry IV, Part 2", William Shakespeare, 1598; "Jesus Christ Superstar" Tim Rice and Andrew Lloyd Webber, 1971; "Oedipus Rex", Sophocles, 425 BCE; "Oh! Calcutta", Kenneth Tynan, 1969; "Salome", Oscar Wilde, 1896; and "Le Tartruffe", Moliere, 1669."
I am also opposed to any type of activity that opresses or exploits anyone...or advocates such activity.
It seems in Pompeii, as today, many of the prostitutes were captives. I don´t think many would choose such a life if they hade other choices....although some may...........Let´s not forget, or over look the fact that hypersexuality does exist....
Edited (12/4/2009) by alameda
[add]
Edited (12/5/2009) by alameda
[repair]
|
|
10. |
04 Dec 2009 Fri 10:18 pm |
Yeah, and you´re obsessed with the pro-porn campaign. Are you actually serious about this question? I think you´re too intelligent to ask this... as well as the rest of them.
Nope, I´m not on a pro-porn campaign. I´m simply NOT against porn. It should be up to an adult person whether or not s/he wants to watch other adult people having consensual sexual intercourse filmed at their knowledge.
I dislike the fact that sex these days is still a bit of a taboo. Young people don´t get educated enough to know what to do with their sexuality. Their parents rarely talk about it because they haven´t been talked to about it as well. Schools offer very limited knowledge on the subject, if any, so kids are left to learn everything from their friends who are just as much in the dark.
People are often embarrassed when talking about sex - there is a dissonance between the way sex is talked about in families and normal sexual needs. That´s why people make up for it by either vulgarity or laughter.
My point is - let´s not make a taboo of sex, it´s part of who we are. Get properly educated and if you still want to watch porn so be it.
|
|
11. |
04 Dec 2009 Fri 11:10 pm |
Young people don´t get educated enough to know what to do with their sexuality. Their parents rarely talk about it because they haven´t been talked to about it as well. Schools offer very limited knowledge on the subject, if any, so kids are left to learn everything from their friends who are just as much in the dark.
I wonder what type of - if ever - sex education is given to kids in school in different countries. What do they get taught? Just the physical differences, pregnancy, STDs? Talks about staying a virgin until marriage? Do they also learn about preferences, feelings, romance? Do they get information about styles, toys, lust? And if they get any of this information, on what age?
I´m not against porn though if school/government policies make it impossible that kids are schooled well on all aspects and porn is the only solution for them, I fear for their sexual health in future.
|
|
12. |
05 Dec 2009 Sat 01:24 am |
I wonder what type of - if ever - sex education is given to kids in school in different countries. What do they get taught? Just the physical differences, pregnancy, STDs? Talks about staying a virgin until marriage? Do they also learn about preferences, feelings, romance? Do they get information about styles, toys, lust? And if they get any of this information, on what age?
In Poland it changes, depending on the ruling party (if the right-wing is on - Sexual Education or as it´s called Preparation for family Life is off the curriculum). I had SE in secondary school in form of non compulsory classes that your parents had to give you their permission for. I still remember one of my classmates having her mum come to school every month (this is how frequent the classes were) and making sure she doesn´t attend the class for sexual maniacs I really enjoyed the classes, they were taught by a psychologist specialising in sex. Still, for most of us it was a few good years too late to learn something new or to avoid a few mistakes The programme covered everything - from the biological aspects, through personal hygiene, fetishes, masturbation, STDs, pregnancies, pills, to emotions. All discussed in a friendly, non-judgemental and non-offensive way.
I have no idea if there is a SE programme in Polish schools right now, but I doubt it. It´s more probable that the kids are taught the "stay virgin till you get married or baby Jesus will cry" attitude as religion is taught at schools (2 lessons/week )
|
|
13. |
05 Dec 2009 Sat 03:06 am |
As a pornstar, most of young boyz in the world grow up with my porn movies. I´m still teaching how to have sex with their partner to my next generation. Yes it´s a fact. Everybody watch porn, so it´s no need to act like a naive person. Porn is the cradle of life and u all have to accept it.
watch porn, have fun. satisfy your partners.
|
|
14. |
05 Dec 2009 Sat 09:52 pm |
I´m not anti-porn, but I am pro-realism... Really, those porn uhum...ladies seem to give guys the idea that women like really strange things. Porn...ladies get paid to scream and moan, and fake for their job. That is why it seems that certain...actions... are what women REALLY want when in reality, they (in general) REALLY don´t like it.
Erotica --- yes, weird porn --- no
|
|
15. |
06 Dec 2009 Sun 01:57 am |
It´s kind of amusing for me to read most of these responses.. really, most of you have no f.. clue what you´re talking about and never really delved into this subject in a serious way. You clearly simply reiterate what you hear or just speak based on your "intuition". I mean this "anti porn = anti-sex" sort of logic is pretty pathetic to say for a "non-obsessed", averagely reasonable person (it´s like saying that being anti-McDonald = being anti-food ). Some of you are making porn like a new religion that´s beyond criticism. But since I´m apparently so obsessed about it, you´re not the right audience to speak to anyway.
Edited (12/6/2009) by catwoman
Edited (12/6/2009) by catwoman
Edited (12/6/2009) by catwoman
|
|
16. |
06 Dec 2009 Sun 12:23 pm |
Okay, let me put it differently...if you are saying the porn-industry, then YES, I´m anti-porn industry. The girls get paid like...nothing. 99% doesn´t like what they are doing. I´ve watched some interesting documentaries about it, with a male porn-star explaining that it´s hard sometimes to do the nast with a girl, when he had just heard her cry like a baby before the taping, because she hates herself for doing this.
I don´t see anything wrong with a man and a woman having a certain taste for voyeurism enjoying some nasty-watching together, but the way in which most porn is created is wrong. And the way women, men, and everything surrounding the nasty is portrayed in modern day porn is also wrong. So, if there could be porn, that is made by enthousiastic adults, portraying real pleasures, or at least possible pleasures, I don´t see anything wrong with that.
The problem is that this kind of porn isn´t a reality right now.
|
|
17. |
06 Dec 2009 Sun 11:27 pm |
I wonder what type of - if ever - sex education is given to kids in school in different countries. What do they get taught? Just the physical differences, pregnancy, STDs? Talks about staying a virgin until marriage? Do they also learn about preferences, feelings, romance? Do they get information about styles, toys, lust? And if they get any of this information, on what age?
I´m not against porn though if school/government policies make it impossible that kids are schooled well on all aspects and porn is the only solution for them, I fear for their sexual health in future.
well,Poland for example...right now we have so called preparation to family life..interesting thing as it was always a card between politicians.The teachers who can teach it must be either psychologist or biologist...why other subject teachers cannot be............
|
|
18. |
06 Dec 2009 Sun 11:41 pm |
In Poland it changes, depending on the ruling party (if the right-wing is on - Sexual Education or as it´s called Preparation for family Life is off the curriculum). I had SE in secondary school in form of non compulsory classes that your parents had to give you their permission for. I still remember one of my classmates having her mum come to school every month (this is how frequent the classes were) and making sure she doesn´t attend the class for sexual maniacs I really enjoyed the classes, they were taught by a psychologist specialising in sex. Still, for most of us it was a few good years too late to learn something new or to avoid a few mistakes The programme covered everything - from the biological aspects, through personal hygiene, fetishes, masturbation, STDs, pregnancies, pills, to emotions. All discussed in a friendly, non-judgemental and non-offensive way.
I have no idea if there is a SE programme in Polish schools right now, but I doubt it. It´s more probable that the kids are taught the "stay virgin till you get married or baby Jesus will cry" attitude as religion is taught at schools (2 lessons/week )
In Romania the sex is still a taboo subject even if there were 20 years after 1989`s Revolution...peoples think like in communism about sex. There is not a sexual education in school but there are a lot of magazines like Plaboy, FHM where the sexual subject are disscused. But most of youngers have a impproper sexual education. Most of teenagers become mothers at 15-16 because they didnt use contraceptive methods. Most of girls start their sexual life at 15-16....even they are still childs in behavior...And there is an improper mentality to be virgin before marriage. I have a 17 y daughter and I am talking to her about sex; I talked to her about sex from she was 2 years old, of course, not like at 17 yearsShe told me about girl friends who started their sexual life..I told her that it is not important to be virgin at marriage but it is very important the first sexual partener. Sexuality and all about that subject is a very complex and need more attention for every teenager (boy or girl)
|
|
19. |
07 Dec 2009 Mon 12:41 am |
I guess sex is a taboo notion in all countries not only Romania..it does not blurr the fact that we were created as sexual beings with rights to express our sexuality.Here,I tend to agree with DD.
Sex is overrated nowadays and made a manipulation technique,look at primitive tribes-sex is nothing for them but everyday habit,not exaggerated,not paid attention-the same thing like washing,feeding or hunting.Nothing to boast about and nothing to feel ashamed while in most cultures-a thing to blame yourself,to feel ashamed,etc...
|
|
20. |
07 Dec 2009 Mon 01:10 am |
again ! Sex is no longer taboo in Romania. From where you get all this stuffs elenagabriela ?
|
|
21. |
07 Dec 2009 Mon 01:14 am |
Mom..calm down..you seem to be advanced but your compatriots..phew!!!!!!!!!!100 years behind Abraham!!!!!!!!)))))
|
|
22. |
07 Dec 2009 Mon 01:16 am |
. I have a 17 y daughter and I am talking to her about sex; I talked to her about sex from she was 2 years old, of course, not like at 17 yearsShe told me about girl friends who started their sexual life..I told her that it is not important to be virgin at marriage but it is very important the first sexual partener.
Antalya is the best place for her to start.. and then expect her to marry a decent turkish guy!
|
|
23. |
07 Dec 2009 Mon 01:19 am |
If you are a gpsy boy the anonymously endorsed economic system that governs how income must be distributed entails that you should pick up a tambourine and master it at an as early age as possible. Otherwise, you may not be able to feed yourself, you may get sick, languish from starvation and die. There are pleny of other roles waiting to be taken up by people. If life brought you at the door of the porn industry, you had better knock on that door and do the job no matter how disgusting it is. Money you will earn from that will keep your stomach full and it will even help you enjoy a prosperous life. Don´t forget that gipsy boy; remember,you are alone there, it is your decision, you don´t need the respect of anyone else. Go and fight for your life and if you have a child for it too.
Neither Vineyards, Catwoman or the bleeding hearts of artists can and will save you. Their suggestions are good for themselves. You take your own decision and determine your own fate.
|
|
24. |
07 Dec 2009 Mon 01:19 am |
Mom..calm down..you seem to be advanced but your compatriots..phew!!!!!!!!!!100 years behind Abraham!!!!!!!!)))))
Maybe the difference of age between me and my compatriot
|
|
25. |
07 Dec 2009 Mon 01:20 am |
Antalya is the best place for her to start.. and then expect her to marry a decent turkish guy!
and here you exaggerate!!!!!!!personal Antalyan experience??/ and no decent Turkish wedding..........ohhhhhhhhh ..so pitifullllllll
|
|
26. |
07 Dec 2009 Mon 01:24 am |
No comment.
|
|
27. |
07 Dec 2009 Mon 01:31 am |
and here you exaggerate!!!!!!!personal Antalyan experience??/ and no decent Turkish wedding..........ohhhhhhhhh ..so pitifullllllll
She knows what im talking about. And no. No personal antalyan experience.
|
|
28. |
07 Dec 2009 Mon 01:37 am |
If you are a gpsy boy the anonymously endorsed economic system that governs how income must be distributed entails that you should pick up a tambourine and master it at an as early age as possible.those who are for gipsies wout feel rage now..what is your point vineyards? Otherwise, you may not be able to feed yourself, you may get sick, languish from starvation and die. There are pleny of other roles waiting to be taken up by people.True If life brought you at the door of the porn industry, you had better knock on that door and do the job no matter how disgusting it is. Money you will earn from that will keep your stomach full and it will even help you enjoy a prosperous life. Don´t forget that gipsy boy; remember,you are alone there, it is your decision, you don´t need the respect of anyone else. Go and fight for your life and if you have a child for it too.
Neither Vineyards, Catwoman or the bleeding hearts of artists can and will save you. ahh ..the set of prophets or world saviours mentioned here or a new set of saints???Their suggestions are good for themselves. You take your own decision and determine your own fate.
and why gipsies...for their love of freedom???
|
|
29. |
07 Dec 2009 Mon 01:37 am |
Neither Vineyards, Catwoman or the bleeding hearts of artists can and will save you. Their suggestions are good for themselves. You take your own decision and determine your own fate.
But Vineyards, are you implying that I condemn the "victims" of this system? No, I condemn the system!
|
|
30. |
07 Dec 2009 Mon 01:38 am |
She knows what im talking about. And no. No personal antalyan experience.
good mother)))
|
|
31. |
07 Dec 2009 Mon 08:50 am |
I have no problem with the Gypsies. I might as well use the example of a Black boy growing up in notorious Harlem as has been done by many artists, singers etc.
What is implied here is the need for improving a skill in the absence of a other choices.
As long as you can not present what can be called a more ethical alternative to millions of young people who are forced economically to enter the porn industry you must not complain of the industry itself. Since it actually serves as a last resort to make up for society´s failing ends.
There are probably four kinds of females in the porn industry.
* Those economically forced to enter
* Those considering it as a golden key to a luxourious life.
* Those who are addicted to sex
* Those who are physically forced to enter.
The first one is more specifically a social problem whose cure is elsewhere. The second and the third are the acts of free choice. The fourth one is where the problem lies. Though illegal conduct is not an exclusive problem of the porn industry, since there seems to be a greater potential for crime and other attached moral considerations, it would be normal for this sector to exist under the scrutinity of the government.
Ironically, the porn industry also flourish in small welfare countries like Sweden and Germany where there are fewer economic complaints. In these countries, the general outlook is often different from that in big but not so homogeniously developed nations (e.g. US).
We should now question an age old phenomenon. Females relying on their physical beauty to get things done. While this is not the major incentive there are of course many women who use their bodies although they have no major economical difficulties. These women are like businessmen who trade their bodies in exchange of luxury. If you ask me, there is little difference between them and rich-husband-hunters.
Edited (12/8/2009) by vineyards
|
|
32. |
07 Dec 2009 Mon 04:46 pm |
Ohw ohw ohwwww. I can feel my skin itching
I can give a big speech about sex-workers, degrading women, even degrading men. About where the money of porn goes to. About distorted sex views... But what pro-porn people may also be bothered with, is that you actually do NOT learn anything about how to give pleasure to a real woman through this films
My partner decided to introduce some porn into our relationship. I´m open minded, and have a strong relationship, so I thought, why not... Well, once and never gain. This his how it went.
him: what do you think?
me: uh...well, yeah, I guess it´s okay
the movie went on...
him: oh, she seems to enjoy that
me: ... I guess her body works different then mine... I think that would only hurt me.
the movie went on...
him: wow, she LOVES that! You want to try it out?
me: uh...no thank you dear, now get out of my way so I can go puke
|
|
33. |
07 Dec 2009 Mon 05:27 pm |
In my opinion, there is a place for erotic scenes in movies or books and where it fits in the story. However, I personally don´t want to watch people having sex just for the sake of watching two people having sex. Call me closed minded, call me old fashioned, but I strongly believe that pornography warps peoples minds, distorts expectations and makes degrading acts seem more normal the more you watch it. As for sex being a taboo, just because you don´t watch porn doesn´t mean you think sex is a taboo (at least I don´t).
|
|
34. |
08 Dec 2009 Tue 02:44 am |
him: what do you think?
me: uh...well, yeah, I guess it´s okay
the movie went on...
him: oh, she seems to enjoy that
me: ... I guess her body works different then mine... I think that would only hurt me.
the movie went on...
him: wow, she LOVES that! You want to try it out?
me: uh...no thank you dear, now get out of my way so I can go puke
yep, that´s pretty much the reality, and the reality is that the more degrading and hateful the better. it´s not the respect and pleasure that excites porn watchers, it´s the degradation and humiliation of women that excites them (rape, gang rape, ejaculating on the woman, peeing on the woman.. etc). it´s a slight generalization, but that´s how it works for most perverts (both porn watchers and those who use prostitutes) out there. that is also why men in porn have a VERY different role then women do, and they model very different type of behavior (which is also why someone saying that "oh, but men are also in porn" is just a ridiculous comparison). anyway, as someone put it: "pornography tells lies about women, but pornography tells the truth about men".
Edited (12/8/2009) by catwoman
Edited (12/8/2009) by catwoman
|
|
35. |
08 Dec 2009 Tue 04:01 am |
Kitty, you missed out a great deal of things:
1. You forget that porns are not made to show us the real life. They´re not documentaries but purely fictional films whose only purpose is to appeal to imagination and sexual drive. Why should they be realistic? People have the ´realistic´ at home or in the nearest pub. The porn industry is there to supply material for people who need visual stimulus for their fantasies. And as many people, as many fantasies. Porns cover all subjects - from "romantic" knights and princesses to gang rape. Surprising as it may be for you, some women actually dream of being raped. Of course NOT for real, it´s just a fantasy. I think it´s got something to do with dominance and submission - a psychologist or sexuologist could explain such fantasies better. Anyway, my point is, the reason why porns are for adults only is that normal adult people DO realise it´s fiction. Anybody who has ever had sex realises it´s fiction Those who think otherwise should be institutionalised. The only difference between porns and, say, Harry Potter is that while the latter depicts magic, the former is focused on sex. Both are equally unreal. Are you going to argue that all ´unreal´ films that ´distort´ the reality should be banned?
2. You´re very focused on a particular type of porn - the one where woman is playing a submissive role. Do you really think this is the prevailing "genre"? There are hundreds of different types of porn just as there are hundreds of fantasies people want to see filmed. It´s nonsense that men only want to see women hurt. Some want to see women hurt men It is, as you put it, a ridiculous approach to comment exclusively on women roles in the industry. What about SM films where men are humiliated by women? What about MILF films where older women take advantage of younger men? What about gay movies where no women appear whatsoever? You are talking about a small part of the story but even if we take that your not so small generalisation was true, what´s wrong with it? What if it is the kind of entertainment that some people need? Are you implying that men who watch gang rape organise into packs and go out wanting to try it in the real life? That would mean a lot of fools died trying to fly on their broomstick after watching Harry Potter Or, maybe rape and violence against women had not occured before porn came about?
3. This unfortunate quote "pornography tells lies about women, but pornography tells the truth about men" is simply hilarious, and I would feel insulted if I were a man. The author must have come up with that "brilliant" idea by not researching the subjet or by having a terrible sex life The thing is porn lies about both man and women. It tells the truth about neither.
Argg I wanted to say something more but the little terrorist is up
PS I really liked Vineyards to the point approach. Spot on.
|
|
36. |
08 Dec 2009 Tue 04:15 am |
Dreamy, you are simply naive about the truth behind this subject, and what mainstream porn depicts.
1. I don´t care that it is fantasy, there´s a meaning behind it and it matters what people desire. It´s all the more relevant because this fantasy is shaping the minds and attitudes of half of the population, and if these fantasies are about things like rape, then it is something to be concerned about.
2. I am focused on the mainstream type of porn. There is a lot of research done as far as in what direction porn is going. It is well documented that porn is targetting girls that appear younger, there is even animated porn with children (because ´technically´ they are not using children, so they´re allowed), there is significantly more violence and brutality.. etc. So what you´re saying is just wishful thinking and simply naiveness. There is research that shows that men who watch porn find rape much more acceptable, don´t think that monogamous relationships are natural and that they tend to desire increasingly more aggressive/brutal depictions.
3. As you said, porn is reflecting the fantasies of men, not women. So it IS showing the truth about men, while lying about women - what they want/desire, what they find acceptable in real life, in relationships.. etc.
I think that Vineyards is basically saying "yeah, if that feeds you and you have no other choice, go ahead and do it". That´s nothing new, that´s just the reality that we should take a stance against and identify the problems with it and how it hurts people. It´s much the same as Alameda saying that women should accept that they are physically weaker and should accept the fact that they will be abused adn that this is a normal state of things, as opposed to realizing that a lot of the violence is a result of social standards, and it´s unacceptable - we gotta change it.
Edited (12/8/2009) by catwoman
|
|
37. |
08 Dec 2009 Tue 07:14 am |
Daydreamer....MSN?
|
|
38. |
08 Dec 2009 Tue 09:01 am |
It´s much the same as Alameda saying that women should accept that they are physically weaker and should accept the fact that they will be abused adn that this is a normal state of things, as opposed to realizing that a lot of the violence is a result of social standards, and it´s unacceptable - we gotta change it.
Excuse me??? I never said women should accept being abused!!! I said learn your strengths and learn how to work with them, although the words I used were diferent. That is quite different.
As for the porn thing.... just about everything that can be said about it has been said here. I feel sorry for those who have to resort to such inelegant methods to obtain pleasure, and even sadder for those forced to provide the supply.
|
|
39. |
08 Dec 2009 Tue 06:24 pm |
Dreamy, you are simply naive about the truth behind this subject, and what mainstream porn depicts.
Naive? Moi? Nope, I´m just being realistic...
1. I don´t care that it is fantasy, there´s a meaning behind it and it matters what people desire. It´s all the more relevant because this fantasy is shaping the minds and attitudes of half of the population, and if these fantasies are about things like rape, then it is something to be concerned about.
Are you suggesting that porn creates fantasies? I think it´s the other way around - it gets inspiration from human fantasies and turns them into films. Rape fantasies are not uncommon - and this goes for both sexes. Like I said, there is research about sexual fantasies and as far as I remember, fantasising about being raped/raping doesn´t mean you´d like to live it in the real world. What you should be concerned about is the people who go out on the streets and rape instead of playing a film and wanking at home.
2. I am focused on the mainstream type of porn. There is a lot of research done as far as in what direction porn is going. It is well documented that porn is targetting girls that appear younger, there is even animated porn with children (because ´technically´ they are not using children, so they´re allowed), there is significantly more violence and brutality.. etc. So what you´re saying is just wishful thinking and simply naiveness. There is research that shows that men who watch porn find rape much more acceptable, don´t think that monogamous relationships are natural and that they tend to desire increasingly more aggressive/brutal depictions.
Much as I hate even to think about how sick one must be to watch a porn with children or teens, I can´t have any objections as long as no actual children appeared there. There is a number of researches on violence and films (I mean non-porn). Are you suggesting we should close all cinemas or, perhaps, play Pocahontas and Titanic only? The fact that some people are stupid enough to lose the sense of balance between reality and fiction doesn´t mean it´s porn´s fault. Earlier I talked about why sexual education is so important, and I stick to it. Should we now ban alcohol, tobbaco, knives and coffee? Sorry, luv, I believe that a person has a brain and should use it. If you overstep the limits, you get punished. Why deprive people who are sane of something they enjoy only because some other people are stupid?
3. As you said, porn is reflecting the fantasies of men, not women. So it IS showing the truth about men, while lying about women - what they want/desire, what they find acceptable in real life, in relationships.. etc.
I didn´t say that I actually said many women dream of rape Plus, you can´t generalise here - are you sure all women want to fantasise of "traditional sex"? No groups, violence, toys? Then, I´m sorry, you´re wrong Also, this foolish statement implies that all men want to have porn-star-like sex life. And that´s not true either. Most men are looking for a relationship.
The thing is, you´re fast to crtiticise porn by imposing your idea of men and women. It somehow doesn´t go with thinking outside the box but rather with stereotyping You sound as if all women were to think and want the same things, which happen to be totally different from what men want. And your mission is to take what you believe to be men´s toy away just to punish them. Well, for your information, some women enjoy porn, some are not afraid to talk about sex or play in porns because they want to. They break the traditional role society has put on them. The role of a humbe wife and mother.
The world is full of all kinds, face it - some women are happy in monogamy, some love having sex with strangers, other stay virgins till they get married. And some watch porn. You can´t impose your way of thinking onto all of them. Sure, you´re free to dislike what they like, but you have to accept people have the right to differ.
As long as porn operates within law, I have nothing against it. Ok, I do have something against it - it´s boring, but that´s not a good idea to ban it solely on this grounds
(Oh, and I think you missed Vineyard´s point but I may be wrong )
See, Kitty, we´ll never see eye to eye on this subject as long as we have different ideas of how people should live their lives - I believe anything is subject to choice as long as it´s legal and you think people are stupid and should be "protected" from different things they might see
|
|
40. |
08 Dec 2009 Tue 07:43 pm |
Naive? Moi? Nope, I´m just being realistic...
So you think.. unfortunately!!
P.S. Alameda, I apologize if I had misunderstood one of your previous posts.
Edited (12/8/2009) by catwoman
|
|
41. |
08 Dec 2009 Tue 07:54 pm |
So you think.. unfortunately!!
I suggest that you discuss the subject not each other...
|
|
42. |
09 Dec 2009 Wed 02:35 am |
Surprising as it may be for you, some women actually dream of being raped. Of course NOT for real, it´s just a fantasy. I think it´s got something to do with dominance and submission - a psychologist or sexuologist could explain such fantasies better.
Everyone has fantasies of all sorts. The other day I read in the newspaper about a Turkish male asking his wife to use a mineral water bottle on him, don´t ask how but I am sure you guessed it. When the bottle gets stuck the guy is urgently hospitalized. So far so good, the real pain must have started when friends and relatives rush to the hospital all knowing what has come to pass.
There is nothing wrong in having fantasies. Just like gurmets have a discerning taste in food, many people have colorful sexual fantasies. This is partly due to the abundance of hormons in their blood.
|
|
43. |
05 Jan 2010 Tue 08:02 pm |
Just wondering...is there a ban on pornography in radically Islamic countries like Saudi?
It maybe banned, but plenty of Saudi male still manage watch porn and not believe that it is all set up for money.
|
|
44. |
05 Jan 2010 Tue 10:57 pm |
You brought up some relevant points. I once knew a elderly unattractive woman. It was doubtful she ever was very attractive at any point i her life. I bring her up because she told me she wished she could have been able to make money from sex.....but she was never a candidate for that. She never had the choice. I wonder, if she had been attractive, what her choice would have been? She was poor, and felt being a prostitute would improve her life.
I had a student once who became a topless/lap dancer to make money. She saved her money and started a very successful business. I don´t know how she could have dealt with it so well, but she seems to have done well with the situation. Last I saw of her, she was married and had a couple of children. Most don´t fare so well, they come out with very deep scars. I knew another who did not come out so well, she committed suicide. Most have a very difficult time dealing with the dehumanization and objectification and consequently the use of drugs is high among sex workers.
I have no problem with the Gypsies. I might as well use the example of a Black boy growing up in notorious Harlem as has been done by many artists, singers etc.
What is implied here is the need for improving a skill in the absence of a other choices.
As long as you can not present what can be called a more ethical alternative to millions of young people who are forced economically to enter the porn industry you must not complain of the industry itself. Since it actually serves as a last resort to make up for society´s failing ends.
There are probably four kinds of females in the porn industry.
* Those economically forced to enter
* Those considering it as a golden key to a luxourious life.
* Those who are addicted to sex
* Those who are physically forced to enter.
|
|
45. |
08 Jan 2010 Fri 02:03 am |
Sarah Dunant wrote an interesting book on Courtesans....
you can see a video of her talking about it here....
|
|
46. |
08 Jan 2010 Fri 08:36 pm |
Well, let´s do some Aristo logic:
all men watch porn
Pope Benedict is a male
therefore he watches porn too
I wonder what his preferences are like.
|
|
47. |
08 Jan 2010 Fri 08:47 pm |
Well, let´s do some Aristo logic:
all men watch porn
Pope Benedict is a male
therefore he watches porn too
I wonder what his preferences are like.
Looking at the knees of nuns?
|
|
48. |
08 Jan 2010 Fri 08:48 pm |
Well, let´s do some Aristo logic:
all men watch porn
Pope Benedict is a male
therefore he watches porn too
I wonder what his preferences are like.
lol.... Bashing the bishop??
|
|
49. |
09 Jan 2010 Sat 01:31 am |
Well, let´s do some Aristo logic:
all men watch porn
Pope Benedict is a male
therefore he watches porn too
I wonder what his preferences are like.
ahm...I´d say the altar boys but it´s too obvious so my choice is ->getting very close to those colourfully dressed Swiss Guards
|
|
50. |
09 Jan 2010 Sat 07:14 pm |
oh poor benny, everybody now mocking you.
you ve got no respect for some people´s religion and their saints!
|
|
51. |
09 Jan 2010 Sat 11:58 pm |
Let´s attack the Swiss guard! ...or am I getting this angry religious nutcase stuff wrong?... I´m still learning, sorry
|
|
52. |
12 Jan 2010 Tue 06:50 pm |
Let´s attack the Swiss guard! ...or am I getting this angry religious nutcase stuff wrong?... I´m still learning, sorry
I suppose my original idea was pointing out to the absurdity of making generalizations like the one mentioned in the title but instead it has turned into a show of proving how mature Christians are about jokes directed to its symbols...
|
|
53. |
12 Jan 2010 Tue 07:06 pm |
I suppose my original idea was pointing out to the absurdity of making generalizations like the one mentioned in the title but instead it has turned into a show of proving how mature Christians are about jokes directed to its symbols...
And you automatically assume everyone who reacted is a Christian? Hmmm.
BTW, I wish others were as mature as ´us´ Christians.
|
|
54. |
12 Jan 2010 Tue 07:17 pm |
And you automatically assume everyone who reacted is a Christian? Hmmm.
BTW, I wish others were as mature as ´us´ Christians.
perhaps an introduction to his bishop recommended
|
|
55. |
12 Jan 2010 Tue 08:30 pm |
n o
And you automatically assume everyone who reacted is a Christian? Hmmm.
BTW, I wish others were as mature as ´us´ Christians.
Actually, that is not what he said. His message said nothing about any specific posters here, but was an abstract one regarding Christians in general.
The original title of this thread....All men Watch Porn, Scientists Find.....is an overly general statement. Not at all scientific....as the header indicates. If all men watch porn, that means ALL men. As the Pope is a man, that means he also watches porn....if one is to believe the "Scientists" research.
|
|
56. |
12 Jan 2010 Tue 08:31 pm |
I suppose my original idea was pointing out to the absurdity of making generalizations like the one mentioned in the title but instead it has turned into a show of proving how mature Christians are about jokes directed to its symbols...
I´m not a Christian
And you should know that nothing makes the world better then being able to have a laugh about something
|
|
57. |
12 Jan 2010 Tue 10:13 pm |
And you automatically assume everyone who reacted is a Christian? Hmmm.
BTW, I wish others were as mature as ´us´ Christians.
You are a bit irrelevant here.
|
|
|