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Norwegian newspaper publishes new Muhammad caricatures
(30 Messages in 3 pages - View all)
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10.       catwoman
8933 posts
 08 Jan 2010 Fri 10:23 pm

 

Quoting Elisabeth

I support free speech...but why, WHY....would somebody purposely inflame the muslim world?  Why do people INSIST that insulting someone is a freedom of expression.  

 

But it is freedom of expression.. and I think it´s not the point to "purposely inflame the muslim world", but to mock what some people actually think are irrational beliefs.  I think that the problem is that religion gets a free ride on "respect", even though it often times proves that it doesn´t deserve respect. Any other ideology is criticized and bashed without any problems, religion is just another belief/philosophical system that should not be immune to criticism and mockery. It´s blinded people who think that there are some evil people out tehre whose only goal in life is to "provoke them" (which always makes me laugh when I hear this, it´s like these people admit that they have no control of their behavior.. {#emotions_dlg.you_crazy}).

11.       barba_mama
1629 posts
 08 Jan 2010 Fri 10:43 pm

 

Quoting catwoman

 

But it is freedom of expression.. and I think it´s not the point to "purposely inflame the muslim world", but to mock what some people actually think are irrational beliefs.  I think that the problem is that religion gets a free ride on "respect", even though it often times proves that it doesn´t deserve respect. Any other ideology is criticized and bashed without any problems, religion is just another belief/philosophical system that should not be immune to criticism and mockery. It´s blinded people who think that there are some evil people out tehre whose only goal in life is to "provoke them" (which always makes me laugh when I hear this, it´s like these people admit that they have no control of their behavior.. {#emotions_dlg.you_crazy}).

 

Good response {#emotions_dlg.yes}

 

12.       alameda
3499 posts
 08 Jan 2010 Fri 10:56 pm

 

Quoting Elisabeth

I support free speech...but why, WHY....would somebody purposely inflame the muslim world?  Why do people INSIST that insulting someone is a freedom of expression.  On the other hand, this cartoon brought home the very point the cartoonist was trying to make - that there are some people who are so crazily blinded by religion that they would actually kill someone over a cartoon.  It seems to me that everyone has a lot of time on their hands to inflame, insult, get angry, plan an assassination...blah, blah...why not put ALL THIS ENERGY into making the world a better place, instead of the cespool of raw emotion that it has become?

 

Well said Elisabeth......{#emotions_dlg.flowers} 

Why....maybe to boost their sense of importance....maybe because they want attention?  Maybe they are stupid and insensitive?

13.       Elisabeth
5732 posts
 08 Jan 2010 Fri 10:58 pm

 

Quoting catwoman

 

Quoting Elisabeth

I support free speech...but why, WHY....would somebody purposely inflame the muslim world?  Why do people INSIST that insulting someone is a freedom of expression.  

 

But it is freedom of expression.. and I think it´s not the point to "purposely inflame the muslim world", but to mock what some people actually think are irrational beliefs.  I think that the problem is that religion gets a free ride on "respect", even though it often times proves that it doesn´t deserve respect. Any other ideology is criticized and bashed without any problems, religion is just another belief/philosophical system that should not be immune to criticism and mockery. It´s blinded people who think that there are some evil people out tehre whose only goal in life is to "provoke them" (which always makes me laugh when I hear this, it´s like these people admit that they have no control of their behavior.. {#emotions_dlg.you_crazy}).

 

The point to my post was not to defend one side or the other but to simply point out that if people put as much energy into doing good as they did in pointing out who is right and who is wrong, insulting eachother or provoking people ect....I think the world might be a better place.  Everyone deserves respect....not just religious people or athiest or agnostics.  Just having a hard time understanding why people can´t just be nice to eachother.  I know that depicting Mohammed would insult muslim people, so I would never dream of doing it....Do I have a right to?  Sure, but it is more important to me to protect the feelings of fellow humans that to exercise my right to free speech. 



Edited (1/8/2010) by Elisabeth

14.       alameda
3499 posts
 08 Jan 2010 Fri 11:07 pm

 

Quoting Elisabeth

 

 

The point to my post was not to defend one side or the other but to simply point out that if people put as much energy into doing good as they did in pointing out who is right and who is wrong, insulting eachother or provoking people ect....I think the world might be a better place.  Everyone deserves respect....not just religious people or athiest or agnostics.  Just having a hard time understanding why people can´t just be nice to eachother.  I know that depicting Mohammed would insult muslim people, so I would never dream of doing it....Do I have a right to?  Sure, but it is more important to me to protect the feelings of fellow humans that to exercise my right to free speech. 

 

Bravo Elisabeth....very well put.  {#emotions_dlg.flowers}

15.       Daydreamer
3743 posts
 09 Jan 2010 Sat 01:28 am

I think there is not a single poster in this thread I don´t agree with

 

On the one hand, I am against playing the religion card just to cause riots, on the other, I believe religions should be subject to criticism just like any other moral or ethical codes.

 

The question here is whether the Dannish cartoons were posted to insult or to point out what Catwoman wrote - that there are people who abuse religion in order to justify bloodshed. I think it was the latter and the reaction that followed was way out of proportion. 

 

Just like BM posted, there are hundreds if not thousands of cartoons or photos making fun of Christianity, Judaism, Buddhism and cults. Why should Islam be the only one punishing it by death?

16.       oeince
582 posts
 09 Jan 2010 Sat 02:05 am

If a civilisation owes its development to decreasing extra ordinary power the church, having fun with religious institutions and figures would be sth. casual for the new generations of this civilisation.

 

However, in order there is not that kind of an event in Islam history, religious figures and its organisations are still very important to Muslim people. That is why any Muslims don´t be unrespectful to Jesus also.

 

Mutual respect begins with not to insult the values of the other one even if its not sth. not valuable for you. That is why, Non Islamic people shall stop insulting Hz. Muhammed. Otherwise World´s public opinion will believe that these caricatures are published to provake Muslims.

 

 



Edited (1/9/2010) by oeince [missing word]

17.       catwoman
8933 posts
 09 Jan 2010 Sat 03:33 am

 

Quoting alameda

 

Why....maybe to boost their sense of importance....maybe because they want attention?  Maybe they are stupid and insensitive?

 

Hahah, are you trying to provoke some people, Alameda? I hope you are aware of how insensitive your judgmental words are!! Are you doing this to get attention? lol

18.       catwoman
8933 posts
 09 Jan 2010 Sat 03:38 am

 

Quoting Elisabeth

 

The point to my post was not to defend one side or the other but to simply point out that if people put as much energy into doing good as they did in pointing out who is right and who is wrong, insulting eachother or provoking people ect....I think the world might be a better place.  Everyone deserves respect....not just religious people or athiest or agnostics.  Just having a hard time understanding why people can´t just be nice to eachother.  I know that depicting Mohammed would insult muslim people, so I would never dream of doing it....Do I have a right to?  Sure, but it is more important to me to protect the feelings of fellow humans that to exercise my right to free speech. 

 

But it is not people that are mocked.. it´s the religion.. I know that some/most religious people equal themselves with their beliefs.. but let´s face it, if their religions weren´t causing as much harm as they do, nobody would care to mock it (or put as much energy into it). But these religions do harm some other people.. so people must care to say something to it (and it´s actually a pretty brave thing to mock some of these beliefs that shall not be named!!).



Edited (1/9/2010) by catwoman

19.       catwoman
8933 posts
 09 Jan 2010 Sat 04:10 am

 

Quoting oeince

If a civilisation owes its development to decreasing extra ordinary power the church, having fun with religious institutions and figures would be sth. casual for the new generations of this civilisation.

 

The only reason why the Church does not have as much power as it had in the past, and that people do not brainlessly go and kill others in the name of the Church any more, is that the taboo of criticizing Christianity has been lifted to a large degree, and people have been allowed to think for themselves. If that hadn´t happened, people (women) still would be burnt for witchcraft today.

Islam has to undergo a similar process, otherwise women will be legally stoned/flocked/circumsized/"married off" at ages of 12/"infidels" will be vowed death/tribalism will persist... and basically many peole will keep doing bad things without applying their inborn human morality/intelligence that would otherwise tell them to stop.



Edited (1/9/2010) by catwoman
Edited (1/9/2010) by catwoman

20.       catwoman
8933 posts
 09 Jan 2010 Sat 04:14 am

 

Quoting Daydreamer

I think there is not a single poster in this thread I don´t agree with

 

On the one hand, I am against playing the religion card just to cause riots, on the other, I believe religions should be subject to criticism just like any other moral or ethical codes.

 

The question here is whether the Dannish cartoons were posted to insult or to point out what Catwoman wrote - that there are people who abuse religion in order to justify bloodshed. I think it was the latter and the reaction that followed was way out of proportion. 

 

Just like BM posted, there are hundreds if not thousands of cartoons or photos making fun of Christianity, Judaism, Buddhism and cults. Why should Islam be the only one punishing it by death?

 

Canim, you don´t realize that you basically have only agreed with me, not with "all posters" here!! hahaha

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