There were complaints about some profile pictures showing women wearing burka. I am carrying the discussion to this thread. Here is the picture in question:

http://www.turkishclass.com/picture_16152

my issuet was the person using this photo was just announced as the new adminstrator to this site. It is true anyone can post inappropriate photo´s if they wish in their personal photos´ providing it follows the guidlines of not being sexual explicit. As an administrator of this site one would think the behaviour would be a little bit better than most and they would hone down on  their sardonic humorous and polictical viewpoints keeping them  at bay. Be a mediator and a good representative ,act as a good example for everyone to see. When I looked to see who was announced as the next admin and  I see photo´s with the writings of TC baking class and TC graduation with woman who are clearly shown in such a suppressed state, I was appalled and shocked to see this.  ( I can not quote her words about this as she found it very funny, because you have deleted all of the posts . Administrations accountability towards the goodness of this sight is clearly questionable and one  can see that they make up the rules as they go, what is good for them and their friends is not allowed by others ( this is by reading past posts written in the forum ), as already they have shown it is a one way street, Furthermore I would expect the adminstrator to handle ths situation in a much more mature manner than to sling mud and make snarky comments and encourage the little troop to attack . Ths is a weird bunch  that runs this site and  the way I see it could be the downfall in the future to the popularity of this site

....so - I ask you again - why are you wasting your time here in the company of simpletons and weirdos?    

As a recent member of the ´weird bunch´ I take exception to your comments and having had dealings with you in the chatroom before this incident I actually think you are a rather rude, arrogant person aside from your views on Elisabeth´s photos - which you are entitled to of course.   This site has been going a very long time without you and weathered much worse storms than dissenting opinions over two photos which were posted a couple of years ago and which most of us had forgotten were there until you brought the subject up.

My post about the role of humour and mockery in fighting backward and hideous ideas was deleted (although it´s a pity all comments on the subject were not moved to a new thread) and I don´t feel like repeating myself so I´ll just highlight the fact that

Ridiculous ideas call for ridiculous means.

(ever heard of satire?)

Also, I think you got the rules wrong, the idea that admins´ views are not representative of the website means that each admin is FREE to have their own beliefs, views and opinions, rather than follow a predefined trend.

Glad I could make it clear,

DD

P.S. Regarding copyright material, I think unless it´s used for commercial purpose, one can make use of photos that are made public by the author and giving the author credit is enough.

Hmm. I haven´t noticed those photos so far. I take a look and see that they are tagged as personal pictures. Now, what is personal about those pictures as far as an American woman involved? Can somebody enlighten me? Am I supposed to feel some sense of humour here (which I don´t) under the name of personal pictures?

Just had a look at the pictures in question. Were those explanations under each picture added at a later date? Most western women would find those pictures degrading and not suitable as the butt of a joke. Whether any TC rules have been broken is debatable.

The fact that every picture that is uploaded to TC is pre-definedly tagged as ´personal pictures´ has nothing to do with whether or not the picture in question is or reflects or must reflect really personal-thing, nor with whether or not the picture shows or must show the owner/the person, who uploads the picture, like at the case of your supposedly ´personal´ picture.

DD comes in and restores the order..

This is so typical of her..

She shows how to be versatile, wise and  witty while she still remains as alluring as any magnetic and enticing woman can be..

Her savvy, sharp and skilled brains knock us out again and again and leaves us  open mouthed with admiration.. 

I agree but than again these are not most women these are the ones that run  Turkish Class and support such  regarding these photo´s

weird eh......

This was the announcement  that started me asking why she had this type of photo

if she was just a normal member and I saw this I was just have a personal opinion about her ethics and leave it at that!

New Admin

Elisabeth has kindly agreed to become a new Admin on the page, after Lady in Red had resigned. Thank you Elisabeth and welcome onboard!

Elisabeth you might want to remove those those self photos that are extremely rude and derrogatory to you being administrator they are neither funny or amusing

http://www.turkishclass.com/picture_16152

my thought here was Elisabeth was just announced as the new administrator of Turkish Class if you read the the post where this started

these are rules posted  for TC and I believe her attitute  is important as a representative to this site as many people use this site from all over the world.

10. Discussion on politics or religion and religious matters is allowed as long as the topic does not get personal or agressive. If a moderator or administrator thinks that a message or a title may have legal implications in Turkey or in the US, that message or title will be deleted.

3. Views of moderators and administrators do not represent the views of the site. TurkishClass.com website is not responsible for the opinions of its users.

( this time is did  represent the opinion of administrator )

how did this not affect TC when the photo said  TC graduation ?

extra explanations were put on yesterday after I started posting regarding them

most of the additional posting were removed because of they were not constructive in anyway.

You both need some sense of humour lessons..

And Lisa should be the lecturer!!!

Where is  ptasazek when we need her?

why would you rather digress  by making repetitive statements and throwing mud (  playground antics ) at me instead of just giving your idea as to whether you think the pictures are suitable for an administrator of the site.

you clearly seem to have a problem in how you handle yourself !

your dealing was with me in the chatroom was with regards to me helping someone in a dfferent language ( which you did not understand ) other than english for finding ther way around the this site and you rudely insisted that the only languages allowed in the chat room were english or turkish  which is incorrect of you as a former administrator. I suggested you go back and reread your own rules to this matter. You were not only rude to me and bullied me in the chatroom you also threatened to have me banned for speaking in a different language when I see many other languages in there all the time and no posting on the chat room to say anything regarding the rules of language in the chatroom and nothing in the rules to say any dfferent in the chat room on the languages in the forums have been noted as a general rule.

Furthermore for you to feel the need to bring up the subject of me being here, I would say I have actually met some very nice people here who show much more intelligence and manners than you have shown. And like any other member I am free to use the forum  providing I don´t break the rules already broken  by you and your lttle close knit group who think those photos are funny. As you said in the posts already deleted.

İs it really so important to be one of the administrators of a site ? You make it sound like you are talking about an Obama or something

Though few on here would believe it hansom I do have a sense of humour. My point is that there are legitimate targets for satire such as politicians, celebs etc who thrive on publicity. I don´t think it is right to lampoon someone who has not had the advantages we enjoy.

Welcome back by the way.

Look who´s talking III, IV, V and VI.

I absolutely agree.

With full respect for those with great sense of humour, I don´t see anything funny in making jokes of someone´s misfortune. It looks like laughing at blind or one-handed.

No, I don´t think posting such creations is against the rules, but it still doesn´t mean that it is nice.

Much ado about nothing...

Post deleted because of personal insults.

 here))missed me?

anyway Gayatri Spivak-a postcolonial writer-a Dannish feminist asks"Can the subaltern speak?"

why the white women should speak in the name of colonized,abused ones??? if I have my own choice?wearing burka or not???exaggeration is not a good thing!even in burka war!

 you definitely do not know Shakespeare BM))))nothing in his play was -virginity!!!)))with Lis´s burka it makes sense))Lis you-promiscuous bed American!!!!!!!undress!!!right now!!!TLC will examine you

is alright i am rewriting without insults but please take out all of your personal insults in every post too and the others

 relax spritzer)))you are lucky enough not to be given burka´s classes-all bcs of this damn new features of not finding old threads)))

seeing as how this post is okay with trudy that ladyin red worte  i will address it better

this is from lady in red posting lady in red her posting are in blue

why would you rather digress  by making repetitive statements and throwing mud (  playground antics ) at me

..actually I was just giving my personal opinion of you

instead of just giving your idea as to whether you think the pictures are suitable for an administrator of the site.

..as noted by Zeytinne - Elisabeth is not President of the United States - no-one said she had to be perfect [like Obama ]

very weak of you to quote someone else  and is not a good example in the first place but I can understand why you need the help of others to make your decisions and joint opinions.....well done again

the president of usa is not of my concern and is not really  anything related to this

you clearly seem to have a problem in how you handle yourself !

Nope

your dealing was with me in the chatroom was with regards to me helping someone in a dfferent language ( which you did not understand ) other than english for finding ther way around the this site and you rudely insisted that the only languages allowed in the chat room were english or turkish  which is incorrect of you as a former administrator. I suggested you go back and reread your own rules to this matter.

You were not only rude to me and bullied me in the chatroom you also threatened to have me banned for speaking in a different language

I don´t think you are capable of being bullied and I certainly never threatened to ban you!  Many people complain when chat is not carried on in a communal language.  It´s fine if everyone in the room speaks the same language, but rather rude if they don´t (as in real life)  

when I see many other languages in there all the time and no posting on the chat room to say anything regarding the rules of language in the chatroom and nothing in the rules to say any dfferent in the chat room on the languages in the forums have been noted as a general rule.

as noted today

(15:37): hello istanbul..
 (15:36): hello there
(15:36): tienes tu muchas examenes antes verano?

(15:35): si ahora mucho... pruebas... y otras...
 (15:34): aqui ...vacaciones de verano el 18 de junio... y viajo a Espaã..
 (15:34): y tu, mucho trabajo?
(15:34): ahh que bien...
 (15:33):
 (15:33): ahorita estoy de vacaciones de la escuela por fin!
(15:33): pues
(15:3: mucho trabajo con estudias?
. (15:3:
 (15:3: muy bien gracias a Dios!
(15:29): bien gracias...y tu?
(15:28): me alegro verte...´
(15:28): como estass
 (15:28): hola
(15:27): hola XXX

 does that mean we need chat room police  I took out their names for their privacy but I am sure adminstration will let them know  because they keep chats for 3 days or longer from this room

when I see many other languages in there all the time and no posting on the chat room to say anything regarding the rules of language in the chatroom and nothing in the rules to say any dfferent in the chat room on the languages in the forums have been noted as a general rule.

Forum rules definitely say the language of the forums (apart from translation forum) is English

Furthermore for you to feel the need to bring up the subject of me being here, I would say I have actually met some very nice people here who show much more intelligence and manners than you have shown.

One of whom has already had his account deleted a couple of times...

what is this  about I don´t even know who you are talking about and for you to bring up some other member that I don´t know again shows your inability to keep anything to yourself as an administrator because clearly you are divulging something here that Do you share all the private pms from members  to admin with this group too too. Very sick behaviour if this is the case  in all ways  mabye a good reason for you to have stepped down from this site.

by the way to say sick behaviour is allowed as an admin you have used in other post

And like any other member I am free to use the forum  providing I don´t break the rules already broken  by you and your lttle close knit group who think those photos are funny. As you said in the posts already deleted.

I don´t have a close-knit group - who are these people?  - are they part of the Ankara Group?     again have no idea what you mean by this but  carry on

Ha ha

I would not go as far as ´missing you´..

All I was asking for to arrange some humour classes with Lisa as the lecturer as it seems it will be a class with many students.. (spritzer, bydand, gokuyum and the queen of humour -Alameda are the names so far)

And I was definetaly  NOT asking for your opinion about the matter

don´t worry we will hold classes for we demand==a reasonable level of  intelligence and you  and few others will be invited  oh right lets make the insult a joke first that it is ok hahahahahhaahaha

Spritzer

Look.. I dont want to be in a fight..

But I really think you need a "cold shower".

 theh you contradict yourself ....voicing for me in this thread may mean only one thing-you joined my and my ego fan club-beware!!lemon is possesive)

...and do not flatter yourself,pls!!!..as always)))your ego was on vacation,wasn´t it????

but at least i hope you know that i do not like cowardish weepers)))TlC can be informative,can´t it???

Awww tesekkur ederim balim My wisdom astonishes me sometimes But this time I apparently failed as Spritzer The Angry didn´t understand my clarification of the TC rules:

Spritzer posted:

"3. Views of moderators and administrators do not represent the views of the site. TurkishClass.com website is not responsible for the opinions of its users.

( this time is did  represent the opinion of administrator )

how did this not affect TC when the photo said  TC graduation ?"

I´ll do my best to break it down more efficiently this time,

1) administrators and mods have the right to have their own opinions

2) their opinions are their personal opinions

3) the fact that they publish their opinions in accordance with TC rules does NOT make them opinions of the website because:

a) this website does not impose a certain point of view/trend on its users, ie, if admin says green apples are tasty, it doesn´t make it true or compulsory for all members to believe so

b) anyone else on this site is free and welcome to disagree with the opinions admins/mods/other users present

4) Although the picture discussed says TC graduation, it is a personal picture, not an official picture of Turkish Class Website and as such represents an individual user´s view. The fact that the user is an admin makes no difference as

1) administrators and mods have the right to have their own opinions

____________________________________________________________________________

Was this any better, or did you understand it the first time and just chose to pretend otherwise in order to continue your cute outbreak of anger?

DD, great explanation 

DD,
 
Thanks for your time for explaining the forum rules in detail for us.

But some people here talk about some sense of humour. When I look at those pictures I see some people´s misery. I can only feel pity for them let alone feel some sense of humour.

Can you feel any sense of humour when you look at them, too?

I cannot see the point in one´s putting such pictures in their profile tagged as personal pictures.  Maybe somebody can enlighten us on that as well.

I wouldn´t expect you to - it was a joke that would only be understood by a select few [damn! that does sound like a close-knit group - I´ve been sucked in ]

9. Personal attacks or insults towards other users will not be tolerated. Posts with negative remarks about another person´s character that result in or are a cause of conflict or resentment are also subject to deletion by moderators or admins. If someone posts an insulting comment towards you, do not reply to it, it will only start a flame-war, instead send a private message to one of the forum moderators and they will take care of it. Avoid personal correspondence in the forum, use private messages for that purpose.

9a of course unless it is one of the forum administrators and they can do as they wish, say what they wish and attack when they wish .........

Admins and moderators have the right to delete posts if these posts contain abusive, vulgar, insulting language, are particularly offensive or if posts contain personal attacks (or negative statements about another person´s character if it results in a conflict between members).

again except when it comes to their own posts

seems I did not see these options before , they must be on the hiddened list for the monitors

oops I forgot this one  right on the site for putting up personal photo´s but again does not apply for forum moderators or administrators

Pictures you upload must belong to you. (TC Terms and Conditions)

WHAT A SHAM

I have happily lived on this site for about five years now.  Those of you who know me understand my opinions, those who do not know me, I invite you to keep an open mind.  As to my critics I can only say one thing:  I will not be bullied into changing and I will not be forced to wear a burka on this site (in other words...I will not bow down to the wishes of a bully)  My pictures will not be changed unless the owners of this site request that I remove them.  These pictures where posted years ago during a discussion about the suppression of women.  They are meant to protest the patriarchal societies that suppress women and not a comment about the women themselves.  I understand that many people do not agree with me.  I don´t have a problem with that.  What I do have a problem with is being called a moron, a simpleton and a myriad of other things.  As a member of this site, I still have the right to my opinions and I still have the right to express myself despite being an admin.  I also have the right to be free of name calling.   

question one of the rules on the site says when you are loading up a personal photo that you actually must own it  so explaing this one to me how you feel as an admin you can bend the rules for your own purpose

Pictures you upload must belong to you. (TC Terms and Conditions)

second question  seeing as how i did not actually call you a name directly yet  it looks like someone has so as an administrator to a public forum I would advise you (idiom ) " to suck it up buttercup "

or  in other words learn to handle it better than to publically cry about it.

Well, this obviously is a lie. We don´t have a rule that says what you quote here. 

 Obviously another lie...you have called me names although it has been very passive aggressively but your meaning was very clear as was the direction of your comment.  As for "sucking it up" I think I have taken a thread created entirely to criticize my personal profile for the benefit of a new member who isn´t very happy about anything very well, Thank You!

Your comments beg me to ask the question again…..What does it say about YOU if you continue to come to a site that you so clearly despise? What does it say about YOU that you continue to batter away at a point when all you are doing is repeating yourself? What does it say about YOU that you cannot accept the simple fact that while YOU may not like something, it is not going to be changed.

It speaks volumes to the type of person YOU are….an arrogant, bullying, self-righteous, self-inflated egotist. 

Now I fully expect for you to call for my post to be deleted because you are also a person who wants to dish it out but can’t take it. You say others are crying and should suck it up….well right back atcha baby! 

Great post, Elisabeth!  

try again who ever you are that answered this as the admin

1.   go to your page

2.   now  to your personal photo´s

3.   delete one

so that you have room to put it back

4.  now press to add a picture up and this is noted on it

so  before you make an accusation as to this being a lie  please learn about your site and what is on here and by the way who is the owner of the site  why is this not public information incase we have incompletes ruling as administrator´s

have a nice day

10000++++++ I agree with you  great post

This is fixed now, hopefully this clears up the misunderstanding around this issue. The link to the rules on the picture upload page was also broken, that one is also fixed now. 

well done now inform us to who is the owner of this site and the reason why administrators and forum monitors can be rude and offensive in public forums bully people or their comments, allow some people to be rude and offensive using foul language and other´s get reprimanded,  how are they managing these rules seems very one sided to me

Would it be possible you ASK instead of just demanding? Or is asking an unknown word in your vocabulary?

I find it funny that this forum was made for the express purpose of allowing YOU to vent your opinion about my personal profile photos yet YOU are the one who feels bullied?  You have pretty much gotten what you want...you have been given a forum to voice your opinion...you have voiced your opinion and have been answered.  You are still not satisfied because you have not gotten your way.  Obviously, there is nothing that can be done to please you...so I have nothing else to say.

what is on here and by the way who is the owner of the site  why is this not public information

it was already asked a few posts up  before and ignored

I am

You made up a rule that the owner must give his/her personal information to every ´friendly´ person that drops by? For all who are regular members it is known who owns the site, those who don´t and want to know can ask it, I repeat: ask.  

NB. Who are you, where do you live (name, number, postal code, city, country please), what are you here for? Why is this information not public?

fine be prepared for a large list of emails and forum posting that are rude and offensive

for you to handle

have a nice day

oh an apology for saying i was lying about the photo must be own in personal photos would be outstanding to see.

uffffffffffft

apparently this was not a lie as you reported you fixed this now

waiting

I apologize for saying this was a lie.

 Now I can´t wait for spit spritzers apology to all she has offended!!  Oh wait, that would take a rational person.............

I highly doubt we will see the same curtesy for being called morons, weirdos and simpletons.  You´re a good man, admin!

 At first I found you to be rather like a gnat, just a little flitting annoyance....now I find you to be quite amusing!  It is rather interesting to watch you implode.    

Rather like watching one of those itty bitty two-year olds tossing themselves on the floor at the market in a hissy fit when mommy won´t buy them candy! 

She is deleted after the last forum post that had a pretty nasty personal attack - after previous warnings. But let´s not lose hope, maybe she will apologize with a brand new account