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-den/-dan-Ablative suffix
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10. |
24 Sep 2011 Sat 09:26 pm |
Thank you Gokuyum, Deli and Si+ so used in my example,
"birşey söylemeden" = "something without telling"
If this is part of adverbial clauses, do thy follow vowel harmony or no? Or is there -madan for a, ı, o, u ?
örn
sormeden= without asking
paylaşmeden=without sharing
sormadan
paylaşmadan
they follow vowel harmony.
sarılmadan ---> ı ---> a [ without hugging]
korumadan ---> u ---> a [ without protecting]
koşmadan -----> o ---> a [ without running ]
Edited (9/24/2011) by tunci
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11. |
24 Sep 2011 Sat 09:35 pm |
thanks Tunci. I was not sure because the Adverbial clause lesson on this site does not mention that they follow VH. But I know they do now.
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12. |
24 Sep 2011 Sat 09:46 pm |
Rica ederim Mavili.. Well, there is only two option in this case ;
meden ---> e, i ,ü , ö ----> e
madan ----> a, ı, u, o ----> a
so we better call it "special harmony " in it
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13. |
24 Sep 2011 Sat 11:58 pm |
Thank you Gokuyum, Deli and Si+ so used in my example,
"birşey söylemeden" = "something without telling"
If this is part of adverbial clauses, do thy follow vowel harmony or no? Or is there -madan for a, ı, o, u ?
örn
sormeden= without asking
paylaşmeden=without sharing
bir şey söylemeden lets analise this
bir is adjective
şey is noun
bir şey is adjective phrase
söyle(mek) to say
meden is without
söylemeden is adverb
This adverb also has an indefinite object. It is "bir şey".
So "bir şey söylemeden" means "without saying anything".
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14. |
25 Sep 2011 Sun 02:43 am |
bir şey söylemeden lets analise this
bir is adjective
şey is noun
bir şey is adjective phrase
söyle(mek) to say
meden is without
söylemeden is adverb
This adverb also has an indefinite object. It is "bir şey".
So "bir şey söylemeden" means "without saying anything".
Thank you Gokuyum! Very detailed explanation, which I usually need.
Can I ask about another part in this exercise? How about when there is an adjective but appears to be given an aorist tense? -er/-ar
In the little story its used this way;
"Az sonra onlara birer tabak sıcak su ikram eder."
Edit; And I had been thinking that I could start figuring out how to translate in case one day I want to read a storybook thats in Turkish.
Edited (9/25/2011) by Mavili
Edited (9/25/2011) by Mavili
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15. |
25 Sep 2011 Sun 03:03 am |
Thank you Gokuyum! Very detailed explanation, which I usually need.
Can I ask about another part in this exercise? How about when there is an adjective but appears to be given an aorist tense? -er/-ar
In the little story its used this way;
"Az sonra onlara birer tabak sıcak su ikram eder."
Edit; And I had been thinking that I could start figuring out how to translate in case one day I want to read a storybook thats in Turkish.
The word ´birer´ has nothing to do with aorist tense.
birer means ´one at a time, one each
birer birer means ´one by one´
ikişer means ´two each, two apiece´
ikişer ikişer means ´two by two, in pairs´
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16. |
25 Sep 2011 Sun 03:33 am |
thanks Henry, Ok I will have to remember that. Guess I should have figured that tense isn´t added to "bir" That and make sure to check words that Im not sure of to see if they are words with a suffix or already true as they are.
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17. |
23 Oct 2011 Sun 05:21 am |
I was not able to find where more of the previous story is, from the internet. But I have started other children´s stories to try and translate during my free time
I know this story (Pinocchio) in Turkish is maybe a little advanced for me but I wanted to give it a try of course! Though alot of it has been little easy, so far, I have already come across one sentence that uses words that I can´t figure out in what context they are being used.
"İhtiyar oyuncakçının hayatta üzüldügü tek şey bir çocuğunun olmamasıymış."
About üzüldüğu, I know it has to with -dik, that makes verbs into adjectives. But I am not sure what tense is after it so is it worried or worries.
Id also like to find other kinds of short stories so that its not just -miş tense
Edited (10/23/2011) by Mavili
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18. |
23 Oct 2011 Sun 09:23 am |
"İhtiyar oyuncakçının hayatta üzüldüğü tek şey bir çocuğunun olmamasıymış."
´The only thing (tek şey) in the old toy maker´s life (ihtiyar oyuncakçının hayatta) that made him sad (üzüldüğü) was that he didn´t have a child (bir çocuğunun olmamasıymış).´
The -dik- participle doesn´t have a tense of its own. The tense is written in the predicate verb, in this case ol|ma|ma|sı|ymış = verb stem + negation + infinitive marker + possessive suffix sg 3rd + inferential tense marker (imiş). The inferential (which is also called the -miş-past) is often used in stories instead of -di-past. It´s a past anyway. So, the answer to your question is that üzüldüğü, adapting itself to the tense of the predicate verb also refers to the past.
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19. |
24 Oct 2011 Mon 03:05 am |
Thank you Abla for the complete explanation. I couldn´t tell how to break down -olmamasıymış. But I see now how but I never would have figured it to be "he didn´t have" because of the combination of Olmak and the 3rd person possesive -si, unless someone told me. I hope I can get more exposure to that combination to be more familiar with it.
And I know that -miş is used for stories and fairy tales but I hope soon I can do other kinds of so ı can practice with -di simple past also.
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20. |
25 Oct 2011 Tue 10:20 am |
I found a nice site which you might like, Mavili: http://www.herkesemasal.com.
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