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On Pronouns
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30.       Abla
3648 posts
 26 Nov 2011 Sat 02:35 pm

The difference between a few and few, if we talk about countables, what is is then?

31.       tunci
7149 posts
 26 Nov 2011 Sat 02:42 pm

 

Partiye az kişi geldi ---> Few people came to the party.

Birkaçı partiden erken ayrıldı ---> Afew of them left the party early

 

Partiye çok kişi geldi ---> Many people came to the party.

 

32.       si++
3785 posts
 26 Nov 2011 Sat 03:09 pm

 

Quoting Abla

The difference between a few and few, if we talk about countables, what is is then?

 

Different between a few and few

They both are used with countable noun.

Few, when used without a preceding a, means "very few" or "none at all". On the other hand, a few is used to indicate "not a large number". The difference is subtle, yet there are instances where the two can mean completely opposite things.

I have a few objections to the vendor´s proposed approach. implies that I am not on board with the vendor´s proposal. I have some objections, but not so many as to say "I have several objections...". Nevertheless, I have objections that need to be addressed.

I have a few objections = birkaç itirazım var


I have few objections to the vendor´s proposed approach. is a more positive statement that implies I am more or less on board with the proposal. It is not a whole-hearted endorsement, but I barely have any objections at all.

I have few objections = çok az itirazım var

 

-I have a few apples. This means that 2 or 3 apples is enough for me.
-I have few apples. This means that 2 or 3 apples that I have is not still enough, I still need more.

 

I don´t think we have the above nuance of "few" and "a few" in Turkish. Just a little bit of approximation like this:

 

I have a few apples = birkaç elmam var. (countable)

I have few apples = çok az elmam var.

 

Biraz elmam var = I have some (of an) apple (uncountable)

Çok az elmam var = I have a little of an apple (uncountable)

 

 

 

33.       Abla
3648 posts
 26 Nov 2011 Sat 03:55 pm

Thanks, tunci, si++. You are so full of knowledge it bubbles out of you. You just need more challenging learners here.

Quote:si++

I don´t think we have the above nuance of "few" and "a few" in Turkish.

 

 

Do you remember, there was a short discussion about a similar matter here a few months ago: a member wanted to know how to express ‘too big’, ‘too much’ in the opposition with ‘very big’, ‘very much’. Only çok was mentioned in the beginning (it is a word with a huge meaning), later aşırı and fazla with some reservations. Anyway, it seemed that ‘too’ and ‘very’ is not a very central opposition in Turkish.

I am fond of pronouns in every language. Just a few pawns to play with, not much to remember but a huge world of meanings. If you learn them well you can give listeners the impression you really master the language. And if you don’t you just end up in troubles in your first sentence because they are so frequent in speech. What is special about Turkish pronouns is the use of possessive suffixes in them. Just like they have both indefinite and definite meanings.

nalofel liked this message
34.       si++
3785 posts
 26 Nov 2011 Sat 05:58 pm

 

Quoting Abla

Thanks, tunci, si++. You are so full of knowledge it bubbles out of you. You just need more challenging learners here.

 

 

Do you remember, there was a short discussion about a similar matter here a few months ago: a member wanted to know how to express ‘too big’, ‘too much’ in the opposition with ‘very big’, ‘very much’. Only çok was mentioned in the beginning (it is a word with a huge meaning), later aşırı and fazla with some reservations. Anyway, it seemed that ‘too’ and ‘very’ is not a very central opposition in Turkish.

Yes I do and I had taken part in that discussion.

I am fond of pronouns in every language. Just a few pawns to play with, not much to remember but a huge world of meanings. If you learn them well you can give listeners the impression you really master the language. And if you don’t you just end up in troubles in your first sentence because they are so frequent in speech. What is special about Turkish pronouns is the use of possessive suffixes in them. Just like they have both indefinite and definite meanings.

 

Possessive suffixes are very handy/practical in Turkish. Every learner should master that subject.

35.       Mavili
236 posts
 27 Nov 2011 Sun 06:22 am

The ownership suffix seems easy, if I could confirm the need to put the -n to possesive suffix, affixed to nouns already ending in a vowel, when its a compound possesive? 

Mavili´nin gözü. Kedinin oyuncası.

 

 

 

36.       si++
3785 posts
 27 Nov 2011 Sun 11:26 am

 

Quoting Mavili

The ownership (genitive) suffix seems easy, if I could confirm the need to put the -n to possesive suffix, affixed to nouns already ending in a vowel, when its a compound possesive? 

Mavili´nin gözü. Kedinin oyuncağı.

 

 

 

 

Genitive seems easy but it can get too complicated. A great deal of Turkish grammar is based on this easy seeming construction (genitive and possessive all together).

37.       tunci
7149 posts
 27 Nov 2011 Sun 12:12 pm

 

 

 

 

Your examples are " belirtili isim tamlamasi" [determined noun phrase].

 

The genitive suffix seems easy, if I could confirm the need to put the -n to genitive suffix, affixed to nouns already ending in a vowel, when its a compound possesive? 

 

Mavili´nin gözü. Kedinin oyuncağı.

 

Mavili --> Noun

 

Mavili + n [ this "n" is buffer because the noun ends with vowel ] + in [genitive suffix]

 

So it is all to do with "buffer business" , between the modifier [Mavili ] and genitive suffix [in]

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

 

Note ! :

 

 

When the modifier is a noun, it does not have to be in genitive form. The modifier can also have nominative case marker and the head word can be a noun in any person possessive marker except non-person possessive marker.[pron]

 

Example ;   OKUL KITABI

 

                 SCHOOL BOOK

 

Okul  kitap + ı [possesive "its]]

 

-------------------------------------------

 

Benim okul kitabım

 

my  school book

 

   kitap  + ım [possesive "my"]

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Note ! ;

 

 

 

Modifiers can give information about what the head word is made of. In this type of Noun phrases, modifier is a nominative noun with certain meanings and the head word is a noun with any possessive and case marker.

 

 

 

 

Altın  Saat

 

 

Gold  watch

 

-------------------------------------------------

 

Tahta Kapı

 

wooden door

 

-------------------------------------------------

 

Demir para

 

iron [metal] money

 

-----------------------------------------------------

 

 

38.       si++
3785 posts
 27 Nov 2011 Sun 01:58 pm

 

Quoting tunci

 

 

 

 

 

 

Your examples are " belirtili isim tamlamasi" [determined noun phrase].

 

 

 

I am curious where did you get that translation for it from?

39.       tunci
7149 posts
 27 Nov 2011 Sun 02:50 pm

 

Quoting si++

 

Quoting tunci

 

 

 

 

 

 

Your examples are " belirtili isim tamlamasi" [determined noun phrase].

 

 

 

I am curious where did you get that translation for it from?

 

 Surely you must know what " belirtili isim tamlaması " means.

when it comes to that translation , it´s equivalent in english ,  I myself translated it as "determined noun phrase " but you can say " defined noun phrase" or "defined noun clause ".....

 

40.       si++
3785 posts
 27 Nov 2011 Sun 03:08 pm

 

Quoting tunci

 

 

 Surely you must know what " belirtili isim tamlaması " means.

when it comes to that translation , it´s equivalent in english ,  I myself translated it as "determined noun phrase " but you can say " defined noun phrase" or "defined noun clause ".....

 

 

Belirtili isim tamlaması is a Turkish grammar term. OK. But trying a literal translation by yourself is problematic and does not produce a good naming for English speakers.

 

First of all "isim tamlaması" can be translated as "compound noun" then if we want to bring the "belirtili" into it I would choose "determinative" for example.

 

Determinative compound noun

 

OK then out of curiosity I tried to google it. And indeed there is such a term in English.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compound_noun

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_compound

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