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A Condition Which Is Not a Condition
1.       Abla
3647 posts
 01 Dec 2012 Sat 04:18 pm

To my surprise I came across with a sentence where ise does not actually denote a condition and where it cannot be translated with the English if in my opinion:

 

Osmanlı hükûmeti Mehmet Ali Paşa´nın üstüne ordu gönderdiyse de Ağa Hüseyin Paşa komutasındaki Osmanlı ordusu Kavalalı Mehmet Ali Paşa´nın oğlu İbrahim Paşa komutasındaki Mısır kuvvetleri tarafından bozguna uğratıldı. Even though the Ottoman Government sent an army against Muhammad Ali of Egypt, the Ottoman army which was at the command of Ağa Hüseyin Paşa was defeated by the Egyptian forces led by Muhammad Ali´s son İbrahim Paşa.

 


Osmanlı hükûmeti ...ordu gönderdiyse de does not describe a real or unreal condition but what actually happened.

 

I have a feeling de is an important part of this structure and it couldn´t be omitted. Am I right?

 



Edited (12/1/2012) by Abla

2.       Abla
3647 posts
 01 Dec 2012 Sat 04:41 pm

Another example here. It must be a productive use-pattern:

 

                 Gallia Cisalpina valisi onu durdurmaya çalıştıysa da, yenilgiye uğradı.

3.       tunci
7149 posts
 01 Dec 2012 Sat 04:46 pm

 

Quoting Abla

Another example here. It must be a productive use-pattern:

 

                 Gallia Cisalpina valisi onu durdurmaya çalıştıysa da, yenilgiye uğradı.

 

Check this thread, [ post no 18,19,20]

http://www.turkishclass.com/forumTitle_52547_2

 

4.       Abla
3647 posts
 01 Dec 2012 Sat 04:55 pm

Haha it seems that I have been wondering the same structure before. That is why the example was stored in my head.

 

So, -DI(y)sA dA has this special meaning ´even if this condition actually came true´. When you see the particle dA as a part of it you can find plenty of examples easily.

 

Thanks, tunci.

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