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Two random language questions
1.       trip
297 posts
 22 Apr 2013 Mon 10:30 am

First, I am at a disadvantage here because I cannot find a good translation for the lyrics of Barış Manço´s "Gülme Ha Gülme," so please bear with me. "Gülme" could be read either as "laughing" or "don´t laugh," correct? I guess there would be no way to tell other than the context of the lyrics -- is that right?

Second, I see people use "umarım" at the front of sentences. For instance: Umarım iyisin. (I hope I have this right.) Is there something special about ummak or about this particular construction? I guess I would expect "umarım" to come at the end of a sentence. (Probably being stupid here. Sorry.)

2.       AlphaF
5677 posts
 22 Apr 2013 Mon 10:32 am

"Umarım iyisin" and "İyisin, umarım" are both correct and can be alternatively used.

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3.       si++
3785 posts
 22 Apr 2013 Mon 10:58 am

 

Quoting trip

First, I am at a disadvantage here because I cannot find a good translation for the lyrics of Barış Manço´s "Gülme Ha Gülme," so please bear with me. "Gülme" could be read either as "laughing" or "don´t laugh," correct? I guess there would be no way to tell other than the context of the lyrics -- is that right?

Gülme ha gülme - don´t laught (at me) eh? don´t laught

Second, I see people use "umarım" at the front of sentences. For instance: Umarım iyisin. (I hope I have this right.) Is there something special about ummak or about this particular construction? I guess I would expect "umarım" to come at the end of a sentence. (Probably being stupid here. Sorry.)

Ummak means "to expect" and ümit etmek means "to hope" more or less.

"Umarım ..." is imported into Turkish through dubbing of American serials in a near past. Earlier than than we used to prefer "inşallah ..." construction.

 

Umarım iyisin = I hope you are fine.

İnşallah iyisin = I hope you are fine.

 

The order can be freely changed:

 

İyisin umarım/ümit ederim = I hope you are fine.

İyisin inşallah = I hope you are fine.

 

Or better;

İyi olduğunu  umarım/umuyorum/ümit ederim/ediyorum = I hope you are fine.

 

 

 

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4.       AlphaF
5677 posts
 22 Apr 2013 Mon 11:17 am

Hristiyan yurttaşlarımıza, ve Türkçeyi yeni öğrenen değişik inançlara sahip Türk/Türçe dostarının bize hitab ederken "iyisin inşaallah" demelerini mecburi kılan bir kanun şart.

İlgililere duyurulur.....{#emotions_dlg.noway}

 

5.       si++
3785 posts
 22 Apr 2013 Mon 12:09 pm

 

Quoting AlphaF

Hristiyan yurttaşlarımıza, ve Türkçeyi yeni öğrenen değişik inançlara sahip Türk/Türçe dostarının bize hitab ederken "iyisin inşaallah" demelerini mecburi kılan bir kanun şart.

İlgililere duyurulur.....{#emotions_dlg.noway}

 

 

Niye konuyu dine getirdin?

I have an atheist friend who uses the words like "Amin" "Bismillahirrahirmanirrahim" etc. than any other friends of his on any occasion (for example he steps into an elevator always saying "Bismillahirrahirmanirrahim", which I rarely hear when a believer does the same). Naturally "inşallah" is used by him on many occasions.



Edited (4/22/2013) by si++

6.       trip
297 posts
 22 Apr 2013 Mon 09:40 pm

Teşekkürler, si++ and AlphaF! And your discussion of "inşallah" is interesting to me, too. I love this word and the hope and faith it expresses. But I would be reluctant to use it because I am not Muslim and I would not want to offend anyone. I guess I will stick with "umarım."

7.       si++
3785 posts
 23 Apr 2013 Tue 09:15 am

 

Quoting trip

Teşekkürler, si++ and AlphaF! And your discussion of "inşallah" is interesting to me, too. I love this word and the hope and faith it expresses. But I would be reluctant to use it because I am not Muslim and I would not want to offend anyone. I guess I will stick with "umarım."

 

That was what I was trying to explain. You don´t have to be anything to use it. It´s a mainstream usage.

We have many mainstream usages with "Allah" in it.

 

Yallah: Just go away, settle down on your business, etc.

Vallahi/Vallaha/Valla: Valla, bilmiyorum = Honestly, I don´t know

Eyvallah: You´re welcome, Thanks, etc. This is a cool usage and many prefers it to a plain "Thank you".

 

Allahtan=With the help of "Allah", Thank to "Allah", etc.

 

 

All  that said, what is this all about? I use "the God" in English in any way I know, and I am not Christian.

 

God damned,

Oh my God

God knows

Thank you my dear God

etc.

etc.

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8.       trip
297 posts
 23 Apr 2013 Tue 01:25 pm

Quote: si++

That was what I was trying to explain. You don´t have to be anything to use it. It´s a mainstream usage.

Yes, it´s true, you don´t have to be religious to use the word "God." (Quite the opposite, in some cases!) But I guess I read so many newspaper quotes during the Iraq war where people used "inşallah" in such dire circumstances that I feel it would be disrespectful of me to use it. But I am glad to know that is my own feeling and not that of others. ... And, in the end, we are all talking about the same God, anyway. Enough of divisions!

9.       si++
3785 posts
 24 Apr 2013 Wed 10:55 am

 

Quoting trip

Quote: si++

That was what I was trying to explain. You don´t have to be anything to use it. It´s a mainstream usage.

 

Yes, it´s true, you don´t have to be religious to use the word "God." (Quite the opposite, in some cases!) But I guess I read so many newspaper quotes during the Iraq war where people used "inşallah" in such dire circumstances that I feel it would be disrespectful of me to use it. But I am glad to know that is my own feeling and not that of others. ... And, in the end, we are all talking about the same God, anyway. Enough of divisions!

 

Well, I was talking about Turkish naturally. They speak Arabic there you know.

 

That said again, "inşallah" and "umarım" are different in that "umarım" is neutral way saying an expectation while "inşallah" is empathic which more or less conveys the meaning:

İnşallah ... = God knows how I wish ...

 

Again this reminds a dialog among some friends (me included).

x - I expect blah blah blah

y - Well, I don´t believe in God, but I will say it, "İnşallah" (meaning I hope the things will go the way you expect) because I can´t find a better word here.

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