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Yapmak or Etmek??? please!!
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| 1. |
17 Aug 2006 Thu 12:37 am |
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Hi everybody!
I hope someone can help me with this because I've asked this before but I can't get it well!
is there ANY difference between the verbs "YAPMAK and ETMEK " ? I know they both mean to make /do/ perform but...when should I use them? for instance , is "Etmek" like = to do and "yapmak" like "to make" as in english " Do the housework" BUT we say "MAKE COFFEE " NOT "Do the coffee"... it really mixes me up! could you give me examples please? as for the sentence :
"e-maillerini almak beni çok mutlu ediyor" (getting your e-mails makes me happy" ) CAN I SAY " Emaillerini almak beni çok mutlu YAPIYOR?
Thanks a lot !!!
Dilara.
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| 2. |
17 Aug 2006 Thu 01:46 am |
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Greetings,
Both are auxiiary verbs. These types verbs are used next to a noun to buils its verb version. There are 16 such auxiliary verbs. Here are a few examples with the two that you mentioned:
dans etmek
park etmek
hayal etmek
borç yapmak
The nouns that are used with an auxiliary verb are assigned to certain auxiliary verbs. This means you can not change the auxiliary verb. The only thing you can do is to check a dictionary so you can see what auxiliary verb is assigned to a certain noun. These "noun + auxiliary verb" versions are limited in number. This means there are a few thousand of then and it is possible to generate a full list.
While I was working on the update on winmekmak I have worked in dictionary databases and ı have seen such a complete list. It was too big. As a result I have included all "noun + etmek" versions in winmekmak. That means when you type "dans etmek" or "yardım etmek" it makes a correct translation.
One interesting detail is that most of the 16 auxiiary verbs are used as ordinary verbs as well. This is very smillar to "do" in English. There is one auxiliary verb do and one ordinary verb do.
Bu dans böyle yapılmaz. > yapmak is ordinary verb.
Çok güzel dans ediyorsun. > etmek is auxiliary verb.
Burada dans etmek çok keyifli. > etmek is an auxiliary verb.
"yapmak" can be an ordinary verb and an auxiliary verb.
"etmek" has no ordinary verb version. It can only be an auxiliary verb.
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| 3. |
17 Aug 2006 Thu 09:15 am |
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Quoting erdinc: Greetings,
Both are auxiiary verbs. These types verbs are used next to a noun to buils its verb version. There are 16 such auxiliary verbs. Here are a few examples with the two that you mentioned:
"yapmak" can be an ordinary verb and an auxiliary verb.
"etmek" has no ordinary verb version. It can only be an auxiliary verb. |
What is an auxilary verb? I think they are ordinary verbs.
They are not conjugated in a different way from any other verb in Turkish, right?
Yes they are used together with nouns but still they are not like the auxilary verbs in English for example.
In English when there is an auxilary, there is a main verb as well.
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| 4. |
17 Aug 2006 Thu 01:21 pm |
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What do you mean about auxilary verbs ?
Can you give some examples pls ?
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| 5. |
17 Aug 2006 Thu 02:01 pm |
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Quoting CANLI: What do you mean about auxilary verbs ?
Can you give some examples pls ? |
In English
Can/May/Will/Should/Would/etc are called auxilary verbs. They are so called because they are followed by a main verb
I can go
I may go
I will go
I should go
I would go
etc.
And there are some main verbs that can also be used as auxilaries
I do go
I need go
In this sense, there is no auxilary verbs in Turkish.
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| 6. |
17 Aug 2006 Thu 02:51 pm |
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In Turkish they are called "yardımcı fiiller" (helping verbs). They help to create verb names (infinitives) out of nouns. I have already given many examples above.
These are helping verbs in Turkish. Next to each I have added an example.
almak > makas almak, duş almak
atmak > göz atmak
bulunmak > lutufta bulunmak
durmak > bakadurmak
etmek > dans etmek
geçmek > dalga geçmek
gelmek > karambole gelmek
getirmek > oyuna getirmek
gitmek > hoşa gitmek
göstermek >itaat göstermek
kalmak > bakakalmak
olmak > gitmez oldu, yapmaz oldu
vermek > gidivermek, yapıvermek
yapmak > piyasa yapmak
The examples are infinitives. For instance "dans etmek" is an infinitive and "dalga geçmek" is another infinitive.
In a sentence what you call main verb is called the predicate.
In Turkish we don't have main verbs in sentences. We have prdicates (yüklem). The predicate can be a noun or verb.
The infinitives I have mentioned above (dans etmek, dalga gçmek etc.) and one word infinitives (koşmak, sevmek etc) are not different. They can be a prdicate or not when used in a sentence. A verb can be a predicate or not in a sentence. This doesn't have anything to do with our issue.
Let me show you an example with an ordinary verb:
yüzmek:
1. "Denizde yüzüyorum."
In this sentence the predicate is yüzüyorum. Since yüzüyorum is a conjugation of the verb yüzmek we say that this is a verb sentence. In other words, the predicate is a verb. Bu cümlede yüklem fiildir.
2. Denizde yüzmek yasak.
The predicate in this sentence is "yasak". "Denizde yüzmek" is the subject.
3. "Sana yol göstermek istiyorum." In this sentence the predicate is "istiyorum" and "yol göstermek" is the object.
The topic is very simple actually. Let me try to summarize in another way:
There are infinitives. A infinitive is a word that is a name of a verb. For instance koşmak, yüzmek, gitmek, bakmak etc are infinitives. Also 'söz vermek', 'yardım etmek', 'dans etmek', 'demir atmak' are infinitives as well.
An infinitive can be anything in a sentence. It can be the object, subject or predicate.
Helping verbs in Turkish (etmek, olmak, yapmak, vermek etc) are helping to create verb names (infinitives). These verbs are ordinary verbs at the same time.
Ordinary verbs:
yapmak > to make
vermek > to give
almak > to buy, to take
olmak > to be, to become
Auxiliary verbs:
teşekkür etmek > to thank
dans etmek > to dance
söz vermek > to promise
duş almak > to take a shower
The "vermek" in "söz vermek" has nothing to do with the ordinary infinive "vermek".
Examples:
"Geri döneceğime söz veriyorum."
The prediacte in this sentence is "söz veriyorum" and not just veriyorum.
"Kalemi bana ver."
The predicate in this sentence is "ver".
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| 7. |
18 Aug 2006 Fri 12:00 am |
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Thanks a lot for your replies Erdic, your help is highly appreciated!!
I wasn't aware of "Auxiliary Verbs" or helping verbs at all...in fact, this is the first time I heard about them and I suppose this happened to many people on the site who asked for more examples.
It isn't easy to understand for me but I am sure I'll "process" the information you gave us little by little and with a lot of practice.
I also have problems with the accelerative and mutual action verbs...I think these are interesting topics to talk about as well.
Greetings to everybody from latin america:
Dilara.
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| 8. |
18 Aug 2006 Fri 12:41 am |
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Quoting erdinc:
almak > makas almak
atmak > göz atmak
bulunmak > lutufta bulunmak
durmak > ayakta durmak
etmek > yardım etmek
geçmek > dalga geçmek
gelmek > karambole gelmek
getirmek > oyuna getirmek
gitmek > hoşa gitmek
göstermek > yol göstermek
kalmak > sınıfta kalmak
olmak > şok olmak
vermek > söz vermek
yapmak > yemek yapmak
yazmak > yazı yazmak
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Which is 16th?
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| 9. |
18 Aug 2006 Fri 01:10 am |
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Good question. There should be one or two more. I have limited access to my sources right now. I can't tell more than I did from memory. Bye.
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| 10. |
18 Aug 2006 Fri 01:58 am |
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Could be "eylemek" one of auxiliary verbs? Or it is replaced with "etmek"?
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| 11. |
18 Aug 2006 Fri 02:12 am |
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eylemek is almost omited from the language. "viran eylemek" is still somewhat active but most Turks wouln't understand it.
I try to avoid words that the men on street would not understand. TDK as the official source must list them all in their dictionaries.
If you pick any modern dictionary 20% of words are going to be old fashioned words not used anymore. It is a good idea not to learn Turkish from old fashioned people of from their works. There is no other language changing fastre than Turkish. Some words are omited from the language before some professionals become retired. In other words there are old people who are using the words they used to use when they were younger but these word are already omited. In any other European language this process would take a few times longer than a persons lifetime.
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| 12. |
18 Aug 2006 Fri 09:51 am |
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Quoting Dilara: Thanks a lot for your replies Erdic, your help is highly appreciated!!
I wasn't aware of "Auxiliary Verbs" or helping verbs at all...in fact, this is the first time I heard about them and I suppose this happened to many people on the site who asked for more examples.
It isn't easy to understand for me but I am sure I'll "process" the information you gave us little by little and with a lot of practice.
I also have problems with the accelerative and mutual action verbs...I think these are interesting topics to talk about as well.
Greetings to everybody from latin america:
Dilara.
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Don't be confused. They are not different from other verbs in tense tables. Turkish is a very logical language, if you grab that logic, you can easily advance in a very short time. All the verbs are regular. And verbs take time and personal endings. When you learn that endings (think of them together not as time and person) all you need to do is to add them to the Verb stem (taking the vocal harmony of course). It is like putting some lego pieces together. So easy that Turkish children are the fastest language learners (not my words but findings from scientific tests)
As an example let's take a look at the past tense in Turkish:
The following are the past tense + personal suffixes
1st sg: -dim (and others according to vocal harmony)
2nd sg: -din
3rd sg: -di
1rd pl: -dik
2nd pl: -diniz
3rd pl: -diler
Now when you have this knowledge, all you need to do is take a verb and add one of the following to it accordingly. That's it, nice and easy. Piece of cake.
Ex:
Gel-mek -- to come
Gel-dim -- I came
Gel-din -- You came
Gel-di -- He/She/It came
Gel-dik -- We came
Gel-diniz -- You came
Gel-diler -- They came
And when you take the verb part here, it can be anything. And this is nice part part indeed. It can be a passive verb, negative verb, cooperative verb, reflexive verb or causative verb, etc. And here what you need to know is how you can turn a verb into a passive verb or into negative verb or whatever. Yes that is done by adding some suffixes to the verb stem.
Ex:
Sev-mek -- To love
Sev-me-mek -- To not love (negative voice)
Sev-il-mek -- To be loved (Passive voice)
Sev-iş-mek -- To love one another (cooperative voice)
Sev-dir-mek -- To make something love something else (factitive or causative)
Sev-ebil-mek -- To be able to love
Sev-eme-mek -- To not be able to love
etc.
So on the Verb part, you need to know the suffixes to turn a verb into another verb of any sort.
And on the tense part, you need to know which suffixes to add to a verb stem.
More Ex:
Kes-mek -- To cut
Kes-tim -- I cut it. (V+dim)
Kesil-di -- It was cut (V+di)
Kesilme-di -- It was not cut (V+di)
Keseme-dim -- I was not able to cut it (V+dim)
Well I hope see my point here, they are all verb plus some time and personal ending. That's the way to see it in a simple way. After that, you need to get used to how a verb is turned into another verb by using some suffixes.
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| 13. |
19 Aug 2006 Sat 12:07 am |
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aslan2 :
Thank you for your message. I understood what your point was clearly!!, As you said , turkish is like putting lego pieces together , it's a very logical language that's true but I didn't know turkish clildren where the ones who learnt their language faster! very very interesting information!
As for the mutual action verbs, it's all about learning the suffix and adding it to the stem/ verb itself, of course there are harder things such as :
When should I use the -dik OBJECT participle and when should I prefer the SIMPLE PRESENT participle for instance:
" akAR " or "akAN " because they mean actually the same!! "which flows / which is flowing etc"...I don't see any difference...?
If someone could explain this to me, I'd be more than grateful and once again, thank you all of you!
selamlar,
Dilara
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| 14. |
19 Aug 2006 Sat 09:21 am |
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Quoting Dilara: aslan2 :
Thank you for your message. I understood what your point was clearly!!, As you said , turkish is like putting lego pieces together , it's a very logical language that's true but I didn't know turkish clildren where the ones who learnt their language faster! very very interesting information!
As for the mutual action verbs, it's all about learning the suffix and adding it to the stem/ verb itself, of course there are harder things such as :
When should I use the -dik OBJECT participle and when should I prefer the SIMPLE PRESENT participle for instance:
" akAR " or "akAN " because they mean actually the same!! "which flows / which is flowing etc"...I don't see any difference...?
If someone could explain this to me, I'd be more than grateful and once again, thank you all of you!
selamlar,
Dilara |
As for Turkish children, it is quite natural to learn a language like Turkish. For more, make a Google search using "Language learnability" and you should find many links on the subject.
Let me help you with your question.
-dik suffix usually is used with personal possessive suffixes. You should know them but they are
-(i)m -- my
-(i)n -- your
-(s)i -- his/her/its
-(i)miz -- our
-(i)niz -- your
-leri -- their
So -dik+POSS
-diğ-im
-diğ-in
-diğ-i
-diğ-imiz
-diğ-iniz
-dik-leri
So far so good. I don't want to use grammatical terms here. Usually it is used to turn the object of a simple sentence into another noun in a complex sentence. Some examples:
Bir kitap okudum. -- I read a book.
V=oku-mak
Object=Bir kitap
Here the verb is oku-mak (to read). Now add -dik+POSS to the verb
oku-duğum (not -diğim but -duğum, vocal harmony you know)
Now the object (a book) should be modified by "okuduğum" and since in Turkish modifier always comes before the modified we have this
okuduğum bir kitap -- A book which I read
So here "okuduğum" modifes "bir kitap" just like in
kalın bir kitap -- a THICK book
kırmızı bir kitap -- a RED book
okuduğum bir kitap -- a book which I read
Notice the difference, in English the order is different for the 3rd one. In the first 2 examples the order is similar to Turkish, but for the 3rd one the modifier comes after the modified in English.
Well as I said in Turkish the modifier always comes before the modified. This is a golden rule you should keep in mind. I had said Turkish is a logical language before. This is an example of it. This simple rule is always maintained however complex a sentence can be.
Now let's make it more complicated.
Dün bir kitap okudum. -- Yesterday, I read a book.
Dün eve dönerken otobüste bir kitap okudum. -- Yesterday, on the way back home, I read a book.
Now let's modifiy the object "bir kitap"
Dün okuduğum bir kitap -- a book which I read yesterday
Dün eve dönerken otobüste okuduğum bir kitap -- a book which I read yesterday, on the bus, on the way back home
Also pay attention to the article. In above examples I used "bir kitap" (a book). If you want to say THE book, you should drop "bir" (a) and say "kitap" (the book). There is no definite article in Turkish. That's why
Bir kitap -- a book
Kitap -- the book
So
Kitab-ı okudum. -- I read the book.
okuduğum kitap -- The book (which) I read.
Notice that in Turkish sentence "kitap" is a definite object so it becomes "kitab-ı" by adding "-ı" suffix. But in the second example "-ı" is not used. Why is that? Because "-ı" is only used with nouns in the object position.
More ex:
Okuduğum kitap masanın üstünde. -- The book which I read is on the table.
Okuduğum kitabı masanın üstüne bıraktım. -- I put on the table the book which I read.
Notice in the first sentence "okuduğum kitap" is the subject of the sentence and the object in the second that is why it becomes "okuduğum kitabı".
Another point is that -dik+POSS can be used alone. It that case it can be thought as of modifiying the thing or what.
okuduğum -- the thing that I read or what I read
okuduğumu anladım -- I understood what I read.
OK we said dik+POSS is used for the things in object position in a sentence. And -an is used for the things in subject position. And it is used alone not by adding possessive suffixes.
Now let's take our simple sentence again.
Bir kitap okudum. -- I read a book.
If we make this a passive sentence "Bir kitap" becomes the object of the sentence.
Bir kitap okundu. -- A book was read.
Here we turn oku-mak (to read) verb into a passive verb oku-n-mak (to be read) by adding a suffix.
In this case we add an "-an" suffix to the verb.
Okun-an bir kitap -- A book which was read
Check the following link for more:
http://mail.egenet.com.tr/~mastersj/turkish-participle-construction.html
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| 15. |
19 Aug 2006 Sat 11:34 pm |
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Tekrar Merhaba!
Aslan2: Once again, thanks for replying to my question. Your examples are very clear and useful.
The -dIK participle is not as hard to understand as I thought since I just need to add the personal possessive suffixes and it modifies the whole meaning of the utterance as you pointed out. "the modifier always comes before the modified" in turkish, that's a golden rule I will keep in mind for sure!
I haven't seen the linck you gave me yet as I was trying to understand all of this first but be sure I'll take a look and once again, thank you for sharing your knowledge with us, turkish learners !
More questions are on the way, I hope you don't mind but I can't learn without asking, can I?!
selamlar:
Dilara.
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| 16. |
20 Aug 2006 Sun 09:52 am |
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Quoting Dilara: Tekrar Merhaba!
Aslan2: Once again, thanks for replying to my question. Your examples are very clear and useful.
More questions are on the way, I hope you don't mind but I can't learn without asking, can I?!
selamlar:
Dilara.
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No problem. I think I can give you some more info since you are interested.
Let's formulate this dik+POSS thing.
When you want to make a noun out of the object of a sentence and modify it using the verb and subject of the same sentence, you should use this construction.
Sentence= Subject + ... + Object + Verb + tense + personal endings.
Here,
* Subject can be personal pronouns or something else
* ... is other stuff, can be time or place adverbs like yesterday, on the bus etc.
* Object is the key one we want to modify using the other parts of the sentence
* Verb is the one we will attach -dik suffix
* Tense part will be lost, it can be past tense or present tense. It doesn't matter, it is dropped.
* personal ending defines the grammatical person. This is the one we will attach personal suffixes to -dik suffix
1- Subject is a personal pronoun
In this case, personal pronoun is usually dropped in Turkish.
Ex.
(Ben) bir kitap okudum. -- I read a book.
Here object is "bir kitap" (a book) and it is going to be modified.
Verb is oku-mak (to read) we will attach -dik suffix to it. So we have "oku-duk" at hand.
Person is I, so we need to add -(i)m (my) personal possessive suffix, now we have "okuduğum" at hand.
So according to modifier and modified rule.
okuduğum kitap.
I said the personal pronoun is usually dropped but sometimes it is not dropped. In that case object is also included by adding personal possessive pronouns which are:
Benim -- My
Senin -- Your
Onun -- his/her/its
Bizim -- Our
Sizin -- Your
Onların -- Their
Ben bir kitap okudum.
Benim okuduğum bir kitap.
2- Subject is not personal pronoun
In this case, subject is also include by using genitive case suffix -(n)in. Similar to the case above when a personal pronoun is not dropped.
Ex:
Kız bir kitap okudu. -- The girl read a book.
Now the subject is "Kız" (The girl) and we need add -(n)in suffix to it so "Kız-ın".
Kızın okuduğu bir kitap. -- a book which the girl read.
I said tense part is dropped. Let's make it clear with the following example.
Kız bir kitap okudu. -- The girl read a book. (Past)
Kız bir kitap okuyor. -- The girl is reading a book. (Present)
Both of the above become
Kızın okuduğu kitap. -- a book which the girl read
or
Kızın okuduğu kitap. -- a book which the girl is reading
So if we formulate
Subject ... Object Verb+Tense+PersonalEnding
becomes
Subject+Genitive ... V+-dik+POSS Object
and which is equal to the following in English
object which Subj V+tense ...
Ex.
Ben dün bir kitap okudum. -- I read a book yesterday.
Benim dün okuduğum bir kitap -- a book which I read yesterday.
Sen dün bir kitap okudun. -- You read a book yesterday.
Senin dün okuduğun bir kitap -- a book which you read yesterday.
Ali şimdi bir kitap okuyor. -- Ali is reading a book now
Ali-nin şimdi okuduğu kitap. -- The book which Ali is reading now.
O şimdi bir kitap okuyor. -- He is reading a book now.
O-nun şimdi okuduğu kitap. -- The book which he is reading now.
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| 17. |
21 Aug 2006 Mon 01:13 am |
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I think the -dik participle is no longer a problem for me! by means of these examples and explanations you gave me it seemed to "fit" in my head perfectly!.
I've printed all of this because I'm creatıng a kind of "hand-made book" with all the information I get from the forums as there are NO turkish books , dictionaries or teachers here in my country! (Chile) it's so depressing! anyway I won't give up...
Thank you Aslan2 and all of you who contribute to this great site.
¡Gracias!
Dilara.
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| 18. |
21 Aug 2006 Mon 01:31 am |
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Aslan2, you give excellent, professional explanations, thanks a lot
Are you a teacher?
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| 19. |
21 Aug 2006 Mon 01:40 am |
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Quoting slavica: Aslan2, you give excellent, professional explanations, thanks a lot
Are you a teacher? |
Good poınt!!
I thınk Aslan2 ıs a teacher too! ıf not, he should , serıously!! great job!!
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| 20. |
21 Aug 2006 Mon 07:37 am |
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Quoting slavica: Aslan2, you give excellent, professional explanations, thanks a lot
Are you a teacher? |
No, I am not. But I like learning languages so I also try to learn my native language better. That's it. I have not covered everything on the subject but for beginners it should be OK.
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| 21. |
21 Aug 2006 Mon 07:39 am |
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Quoting Dilara: Quoting slavica: Aslan2, you give excellent, professional explanations, thanks a lot
Are you a teacher? |
Good poınt!!
I thınk Aslan2 ıs a teacher too! ıf not, he should , serıously!! great job!! |
Actually you got me going. I wouldn't write this much if you didn't ask more questions.
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| 22. |
21 Aug 2006 Mon 03:57 pm |
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| 23. |
21 Aug 2006 Mon 08:16 pm |
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Quoting scalpel: There is no auxiliary verb in Turkish like is,has,etc in English |
This is true. I didn't say our auxiliaries are same as in English. No, they are not. They are completely different.
Like I said before, our auxiliaries are used to create verbs out of nouns by being located next to the noun.
Once again I repeat the same example:
"dans etmek" is an infinitive. You can use this infinitive as a verb like in "Ben dans ediyorum" or you can use it as noun like in "Dans etmek istiyorum". In all cases "etmek" in dans etmek is an auxiliary verb.
Here is a list of auxiliary verbs in Turkish from TDK.
http://www.tdk.org.tr/tdksozluk2/SOZBUL.ASP
On the search menu choose "yardımcı fiil" and at the end you should see a screen like in this picture:
http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/5641/yardimcifiillerpx0.jpg
Our Turkish speaking members can learn more on auxiliary verbs in this article:
http://www.tdk.org.tr/ham027.html
Quoting Prof. Dr. Hamza ZÃœLFİKAR: Etmek, olmak, eylemek, kılmak yardımcı fiilleri |
Quoting Prof. Dr. Hamza ZÃœLFİKAR: Yardımcı fiil veya yardımcı eylem dediğimiz bu birkaç fiil, isim sınıfına giren Türkçe ve yabancı kökenli kelimeleri işletmeye yarar. ... Yardımcı fiiller, yalnızca Türkçede bulunmaz; çağdaş batı dillerinden İngilizcede auxiliary verb, Fransızcada verb auxiliaire, Almancada Hilfsverb adlarıyla birer konu olarak yer alırlar |
Quoting Prof. Dr. Hamza ZÃœLFİKAR: Olmak, etmek, eylemek ünlü ile başlayan birer yardımcı fiildir |
Our auxiliary verbs also exist as ordinary verbs. This is smillar to "do" and "have" in English.
Examples:
Vermek is ordinary verb here:
Kalemi bana ver. (Give me the pencil)
Vermek is auxiliary verb here:
Geri döneceğine söz ver. (Promise [söz ver] that you will return)
The predicate in the last sentense is "söz vermek" (to give his word).
If you think vermek in "söz vermek", yapmak in "numara yapmak", olmak in "şok olmak", etmek in "teşekkür etmek" is not auxiliary verb you are wrong. There are lots of examples for auxiliary verbs in Turkish in that article mentioned above.
You can do your own search. Use "yardımcı fiil" as keyword.
Quoting scalpel: Yapmak, almak, etc,are ordinary verbs like drive,make,etc.in English. |
This is not exactly true. I understand that English langauge teachers in Turkia think that way but this is not exactlu the case. They can be ordinary verbs or auxiliary verbs.
There is a good article on this issue here:
http://tdk.gov.tr/turkdili/temmuz2005/dogruyazalim.htm
Yapmak is ordinary verb here:
Resim yapmak, ayakkabı yapmak, liman yapmak, yol yapmak, film yapmak etc.
Yapmak is ordinary verb here as well:
master yapmak, doktora yapmak, analiz yapmak
In all these examples yapmak remains its ordinary meaning: to do, to make, to create, to process.
But here yapmak is an auxiliary verb:
"laf yapmak" , "park yapmak" , "şekerleme yapmak".
'Almak' in 'duş almak' is auxiliary verb. This is typical since is makes a verb out of a noun originated from another language. Auxiliary verbs in Turkish usually make verbs of Arabic nouns. "Teşekkür etmek" is the most famous example.
But I agree it is not always easy to decide when yapmak is auxiliary or ordinary verb.
Quote: Aslında bir esas fiil olan yapmak özellikle son dönemlerde batıdan gelen isimlerin fiil biçimlerini oluşturmak için yardımcı fiil olarak kullanılmıştır. Bu akım günümüzde de artan bir hızla devam etmektedir. Örneklerden birkaçı şunlardır: kampanya yapmak, kur yapmak, diyet yapmak, koordinasyon yapmak, pike yapmak, demagoji yapmak, analiz yapmak, rezervasyon yapmak, sponsorluk yapmak vb. Burada bizi zorlayan şey bu örneklerin hangisinde yapmak esas fiil, hangisinde yardımcı fiil oluşudur. |
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| 24. |
22 Aug 2006 Tue 08:10 am |
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I don't think this auxillary verbs discussion is good for the regulars here, whose L1 language is not Turkish. It has been confusing. Yes there are some verbs in Turkish that we call them "yardımcı fiiller" (literally helper verbs) but grammatically they are not different from any other verb in Turkish. They are all conjugated the same way.
So they should be memorized as a whole with the noun they follow.
Yardım etmek -- (yardım et)-mek
Dans etmek -- (dans et)-mek
etc
Some of them are even written as one word.
hissetmek -- to feel
kaybetmek -- to lose
This is like learning the words of a language with gender (like Italian or French). Usually, you are advised to learn the words together with the article.
Ex from Italian:
La mano (hand) not mano
Il piede (foot) not piede
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| 25. |
22 Aug 2006 Tue 09:27 am |
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Quoting aslan2: I don't think this auxillary verbs discussion is good for the regulars here |
I agree there has been too much detail on this discussion. Ideally I should have all possible the topics listed as articles and when there is a discussion I would just say look at 4.55.7. This would be indeed very relieving.
I think the auxiliary verb issue is very important for the learners. In most cases when looking to a sentence a learner will not recognise the verb or predicate correctly among other words if not having heard about auxiliaries.
example:
"Sana çok teşekkür ederim."
This is a verb sentence. This means the predicate is a verb. There is one verb in this sentence that is at the same time the predicate. What is it? Is it 'ederim'? No. It is "teşekkür ederim". If you haven't heard about etmek being an auxiliary how are you going to recognize the verb correctly? Learners think 'etmek', (ederim, ediyorum, etti etc.) is an ordinary verb. This is wrong. Etmek is almost never an ordinary verb and is almost always an auxiliary.
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| 26. |
22 Aug 2006 Tue 03:59 pm |
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| 27. |
29 Jul 2015 Wed 02:33 am |
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I feel so dumb. I still don´t quite get it
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| 28. |
30 Jul 2015 Thu 03:06 pm |
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I feel so dumb. I still don´t quite get it
Instead of trying to understand grammar, I would start to read simple Turkish texts and try to understand them. I dont really think focusing on learning grammar can help you to learn the language a lot. For example I dont know how to conjugate a verb in Farsi or I dont even know the difference between past and present tense but when I read a simple Farsi text, I can still guess what some sentences mean. I am sure in time my grammar knowledge will increase too. Yep this is my manifesto for the learners. Do as I say
Edited (7/30/2015) by gokuyum
Edited (7/30/2015) by gokuyum
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