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my dear classmates - help me please
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| 1. |
23 Nov 2005 Wed 10:26 am |
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Do you understand the difference between "su" and "o", and also between "sunlar" and "onlar"? Can you please help me on this issue?
Thank You in advance,
Mella
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| 2. |
23 Nov 2005 Wed 10:51 am |
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şu: that
şunlar: those
o: he, she, it
onlar: they
Normally 'şu' and 'şunlar' are used for objects and not people. The object you are referring here is not very close to you since if it were you would have used bu, bunlar instead.
It is possible to use 'şu' for human but only with another word expressing its a human. For insance:
"şu adam": "that man"
In general,
1. use "bu, bunlar" for people and objects close to you.
2. use "şu, şunlar" for objects far from you.
3. use "o, onlar" for people and objects far from you.
As you see on number 2 and 3 we can use them both for objects. For instance:
"şu araba"
"o araba"
The difference is that when we say "şu araba" the car is in a distance I can point with my finger. When I say "o araba", the car is further away and not visible. If the car is in front of me I would say "bu araba".
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| 3. |
23 Nov 2005 Wed 10:56 am |
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Mella,
I will try to give you examples ....
İf you say " o kitap.....", you are talking about a definite book, but one that is not in sight. Perhaps it is somewhere in the library.
"Bu kitap...." is similar to "this book...", a book that is in the same room with the speaker and almost within his touching distance.
"Şu kitap....." is similar to "That book...", a book that is in the same room but far away from the speaker.
"Şunlar" and "onlar" are plural forms of "Şu" and "o", respectively.
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| 4. |
23 Nov 2005 Wed 11:12 am |
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Mella.
There is one funny thing here that may confuse you....
Suppose you and me are in the same room. There are a couple of books stacked on a table at the far end of the room, and I wish to ask you to fetch them for me.
I may point my finger at the books and tell you "Şunları getir" meaning "fetch them".
If I want to be more spesific however, I will say "Şu kitapları getir", meaning "fetch those books".
Why I will not say "Şunları kitapları getir", keeping constant to the plurality of my request is a mystery to me too....got it?
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| 5. |
23 Nov 2005 Wed 11:39 am |
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Thank You Erdinc and AlphaF!
You put a light to all "this, that, these,those" things for me.
Yes, Alpha ,I got it. Thanks a lot.
I knew i can always count on my classmates.
Alpha, I really like your explaning all things in the world. You are an expert. Thank You.
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| 6. |
29 Nov 2005 Tue 05:56 pm |
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Quoting AlphaF: Mella,
İf you say " o kitap.....", you are talking about a definite book, but one that is not in sight. Perhaps it is somewhere in the library.
"Şu kitap....." is similar to "That book...", a book that is in the same room but far away from the speaker.
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If we had been talking about a specific book and clearly identified that book, perhaps by discussing its title and content, would it be referred to as "Şu kitap" in the same conversation even if it was still located in a library???
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| 7. |
01 Dec 2005 Thu 07:49 am |
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Quoting bod: If we had been talking about a specific book and clearly identified that book, perhaps by discussing its title and content, would it be referred to as "Şu kitap" in the same conversation even if it was still located in a library??? |
While normally "şu" is used to a pointable distance if both the listener and the speaker know on what item they are talking about, or if they have talked before on this item, than "şu" can be used no matter if the item is close or not.
"şu" can have the following meanings:
1. the one that we talked before
2. the one that I'm pointing to
3. the one over there
4. that
This is an example of its regular usage:
Bu bilgisayar yine bozuldu.
This computer has again crashed.
(I'm in front of the computer)
Şu bilgisayar yine bozuldu.
That computer has again crashed.
(I'm further away. Probably I would be able to point at it.)
Another regular example:
Bu domatesler kaç para?
How much are these tomatoes?
Şu domatesler kaç para?
How much are those tomatoes?
There are also some additional usages of "şu". In addition to its regular meaning it can imply the following nuances:
1. something that you would rather keep away from you
2. something that you are not very familiar with
3. something that you have just come accross accidentially
4. something which you dislike
5. something you would not like to talk too much about but would rathet prefer to move on
The books are in front of me:
"Bu kitapları alın buradan"
"Take these books elsewhere"
"Şu kitabları alın buradan"
"Take these books elsewhere. (implies:I told you before to take these damn books elsewhere didnt I)
Şu adam yine nereye gitti?
Where again has this man gone? (implies: Where again has this bloody man gone?
Bu nasıl sence?
How about this one?
Şu nasıl sence?
How about this one? (implies: have seen this one just accidentially but how about this one?)
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