Language |
|
|
|
When are personal pronouns used?
|
1. |
17 Dec 2005 Sat 12:47 pm |
Is there ever a time when personal pronouns are used with the verb 'to be' or can they always be omitted???
For example would you ever say:
Ben yorgunum
"I am tired"
Or would it always be shortened to:
Yorgunum
|
|
2. |
17 Dec 2005 Sat 01:18 pm |
Quoting bod: Is there ever a time when personal pronouns are used with the verb 'to be' or can they always be omitted???
For example would you ever say:
Ben yorgunum
"I am tired"
Or would it always be shortened to:
Yorgunum |
As I understand this issue both of these are correct. 'ben' is used in addition to the personal suffix if you want to emphasise the point you are making, but without the personal pronoun is correct, it just has less emphasis.
Personal pronouns are my 'bete noir' in every way actually. i never remember what they are, where they go in the construction of the sentence or how they figure when talking about someone else. the 'object' 'subject' order is the most confusing for this.
for example
'seni seviyorum' is clear. 'seni' = 'you' the use of the personal suffix on the verb = 'me' I LOVE YOU! Fine! but how would you say
'you are mine'
' I am yours'
'you and me'
'mine and yours'
'his and hers'
'my husbands car'
blah blah.
Oooffff, its confusing! the answers are out there...I just can't find a simple way to remember them.
|
|
3. |
20 Dec 2005 Tue 12:00 am |
Quoting Lyndie: As I understand this issue both of these are correct. 'ben' is used in addition to the personal suffix if you want to emphasise the point you are making, but without the personal pronoun is correct, it just has less emphasis. |
Thanks
Am I right then in thinking that there is never a time when the personal pronoun is essential - other than to give stress to the person of course???
Quoting Lyndie: Oooffff, its confusing! the answers are out there...I just can't find a simple way to remember them. |
erm......
I suspect the remembering them only comes with practice, practice and more practice
|
|
4. |
21 Dec 2005 Wed 09:21 pm |
I've been lerning Turkish for 6 years and I've managed to notice that one can easily omit the personal pronounce since the person is shown by the personal endings as well, but yes, if you want to emphasize the person you can use the pronouns, too, e.g.
Sen çalışıyorsun = Çalışıyorsun
Siz güzelsiniz = Güzelsiniz
Ben mutluyum = Mutluyum
|
|
5. |
19 Apr 2006 Wed 03:33 am |
Quoting Lyndie: Quoting bod: Is there ever a time when personal pronouns are used with the verb 'to be' or can they always be omitted???
For example would you ever say:
Ben yorgunum
"I am tired"
Or would it always be shortened to:
Yorgunum |
As I understand this issue both of these are correct. 'ben' is used in addition to the personal suffix if you want to emphasise the point you are making, but without the personal pronoun is correct, it just has less emphasis.
Personal pronouns are my 'bete noir' in every way actually. i never remember what they are, where they go in the construction of the sentence or how they figure when talking about someone else. the 'object' 'subject' order is the most confusing for this.
for example
'seni seviyorum' is clear. 'seni' = 'you' the use of the personal suffix on the verb = 'me' I LOVE YOU! Fine! but how would you say
'you are mine'
' I am yours'
'you and me'
'mine and yours'
'his and hers'
'my husbands car'
blah blah.
Oooffff, its confusing! the answers are out there...I just can't find a simple way to remember them. |
Can anyone help with the above?
Thanks
|
|
6. |
19 Apr 2006 Wed 04:10 am |
|
|
7. |
19 Apr 2006 Wed 05:58 am |
Quoting Lyndie: how would you say
'you are mine'
' I am yours'
'you and me'
'mine and yours'
'his and hers'
'my husbands car'
blah blah.
Oooffff, its confusing! the answers are out there...I just can't find a simple way to remember them. |
You are mine.
Sen benimsin.
I am yours.
Ben seninim.
You and me
Sen ve ben
mine and yours
benimki ve seninki
his and hers
onlarınki
my husbands car
kocamın arabası
Dear Lyndie, long time no see. If you need more examples just write as many as you want.
Some time ago I decided to check the printed materials on Turkish as a foreign language.
I bought "Colloquial Turkish" and another set which is "teach yourself Turkish". Both are available in the UK. I bought the first one for £23 and the second one for £18 from WHSmith. Both have CD's. The former is good for practice and the latter is good for some grammer which is explained in a friendly way with exercises and themes.
HoşÃ§akal.
|
|
8. |
19 Apr 2006 Wed 06:22 am |
I am using "Teach Yourself Turkish" and I like it very much. Although it has some exercises, I feel like it's not enough and as I go on I'm forgetting what I learnt in previous chapters. What do you recommend Erdinc?
|
|
9. |
19 Apr 2006 Wed 08:12 am |
Catwoman,
Of course you are going to forget what you have learned. The important thing is whether or not you will remember them again when you come across to it in a dialogue for instance.
"Colloquial Turkish" is a good set to practice. It has a book with dialogues and two cd's (and two casettes) with the audio of these dialogues. Each dialogue has some short discussion on vocabulary and has a new vocabulary list. It has also the translation of the dialogue into English. I think it is a very good idea to listen to dialogues many times and then when you have them in your mind it is much easier to discuss the grammar used in these dialogues. I bought this book a few weeks ago and am using it in my lessons. "Colloquial Turkish" gets my approval.
It is also possible to put the audio files on a mp3 player. But of course a personal CD player would do it as well. I think listening each dialogue 20 times is a good idea.
There is also a book called "kayıp çanta" (The missing briefcase). It is currently out of print. I think Amazon.com has a few copies left. I recently bought the last copy of Tulumba.com. This is like a radio theather. The book comes with a casette. This is more advanced than Colloquial Turkish.
edit:
there is also a smillar book with the title "teach yourself beginners Turkish". I have checked that book any many other in a book shop and I think it is not a good one. Beginners could just start with "Colloquial Turkish" and "Teach yourself Turkish. These are the main two sources I'm currently suggesting for grammar and practice. Both have CD's.
Many people think it is a good idea to start with basic grammar and then do some exercises and further practice related to the grammar you studied. I think the other way is better. For instance listen to some dialugues that you don't understand completely. Then with these questions in mind study the grammar that is related to them.
When it comes to listening things that you don't understand there are tremendous options. Movies are a good option but one problem with movies is that you don't have the text. Therefore audio books are a better option.
A student of mine after listening to a dialogue 20 times was very curious what "teşekkür ederim" exactly meant. She couldn't find "ederim" in dictionaries. When I explained that it comes from the infinitive 'etmek' and the t changes to 'd' according consonant mutation she asked what consonant mutation was.
I explained that it was the consonants p,ç,t,k changing to b,c,d,ğ when followed by a wovel and I think she has leared consonant mutation forever.
It is very useful if you have a problem or an issue with a topic, a word or phrase. If you walk around for a few days with a question in your mind you are likely to remember it again.
|
|
10. |
19 Apr 2006 Wed 05:15 pm |
Thank you very much Erdinc, these are really good suggestions that you gave, I didn't think about them this way before. It is irritating when you don't remember something you know you studied before, but reading texts from different sources will raise new questions and give a refreshment of the material from different perspectives.
Yes, movies won't work, as well as newspapers or books won't work for my level.
I'm going to look into "Colloquial Turkish", but I think I should buy it after I finish my language course in Istanbul, maybe after a month there I will need a higher level... hopefully .
Thanks a lot Erdinc, I appreciate your great advice.
|
|
|