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Tilki
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03 Feb 2006 Fri 06:16 pm |
I came across a Turkish surname this morning, and while I understand all the components, I'm not sure of something. The name is Tilkicioğlu. I understand 'tilki' as fox, 'oğlu', and the general use of 'ci', as in 'eskici', 'kapicı'. But I don't understand what a 'tilkici' is. Is it a furrier? hunter? I even thought it might be an evolved corruption of 'tilkili' as 'sly'. Thanks, arkadaşlar.
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10 Feb 2006 Fri 06:41 am |
Solved: I guess it means fox-hunter.
I'm surpised that no Türk or türkçe bilen responded.
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10 Feb 2006 Fri 01:55 pm |
Yes, I was surprised too. I always came here to see whether the truth has been revealed ... but no answer ... and now you also wrote "I guess". I am affraid tilkici will remain a mystery for ever.
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10 Feb 2006 Fri 02:24 pm |
We don't have such a word in Turkish but every part of Tilkicioğlu is meaningful and therefore the word itself has a meaning. Tilkici is either a fox hunter or a fox seller. It can be both. Who knows, maybe in the past there was such an occupation. The word must be given as a last name in 1930's as we didn't have last names before 1934. In Ottoman days Turks didn't have last names. It was a tradition to call people referring to his/her father. Even now in small towns this tradition continues.
-Dün Mehmet askerden geldi.
-Hangi Mehmet?
-Çoban Ahmet'in oğlu Mehmet.
Maybe they considered the persons grandfather to be a fox hunter or fox seller. Since Tilkicioğlu means "son of fox seller" or "son of fox hunter" it could refer to an occupation that has expired long ago.
Another possibility is, they just made it up when the family leader went to office to get a last name in 1934. From my gransparents I know that they were given random last names and if they didn't like the last name they could go to the office to replace it.
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10 Feb 2006 Fri 05:22 pm |
WoW!!! How incredible???
What happened in 1934 that triggered the change to having surnames???
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10 Feb 2006 Fri 05:27 pm |
Mustafa Kemal Atatürk "happened". It was part of his attempt to westernize the country.
My next-door neighbor had an unusual last name. It seems his ancestor from the time had taken the name "Eşsiz" because he wasn't married at the time. Well, he must have married and had children because the name has come down through the years.
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10 Feb 2006 Fri 05:33 pm |
It strikes me that not having surnames is rather quaint......perhaps dropping the surnames again would be a good idea
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10 Feb 2006 Fri 05:34 pm |
Eşsiz has another and more common meaning. It means unique, unmatched.
Here is a summary of reforms made by Atatürk, the founder of Turkish Republic.
http://www.kultur.gov.tr/EN/BelgeGoster.aspx?17A16AE30572D31371BE64510F6C8BC9BD084C76B72B55B7
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9. |
10 Feb 2006 Fri 06:37 pm |
Quoting bod: WoW!!! How incredible???
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Not that very long ago, a couple of centuries, depending from country to country, most people in Europe didn't have a surname either, you know.
If you're interested, you should read this.
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