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incomprehensible sentence ( to me)
1.       pepka
16 posts
 10 Oct 2008 Fri 02:06 pm

Hello, again! I am a beginner, but my grammar in Turkish is not at all for beginners. I will write a sentence from it, and if somebody is willing they might explain to me what the suffixes of the words mean, their relations and translation, so that I might start learning somehow. so...this is it: " Sözcügün son hecesindeki ünlü o veya u olursa, iyelik biçimi -su takýsý ile oluþur." Thanks in advance...

2.       Merih
933 posts
 10 Oct 2008 Fri 02:12 pm

 

Quoting pepka

Hello, again! I am a beginner, but my grammar in Turkish is not at all for beginners. I will write a sentence from it, and if somebody is willing they might explain to me what the suffixes of the words mean, their relations and translation, so that I might start learning somehow. so...this is it: " Sözcügün son hecesindeki ünlü o veya u olursa, iyelik biçimi -su takýsý ile oluþur." Thanks in advance...

 

If the vowel in the last syllable is o or u, then the suffix sill be -su:

for ex:

konu-su

3.       pepka
16 posts
 10 Oct 2008 Fri 02:25 pm

Thank you! Yet, what I mean was somebody to translate the sentence to me, because I know the rules but I have to learn to explain them in turkish. Without understanding this sentence from the grammar and without knowing how the words stand in relation to each other,and what their suffixes mean, I am lost

4.       mltm
3690 posts
 10 Oct 2008 Fri 02:26 pm

Sözcüðün son hecesindeki ünlü o veya u olursa, iyelik biçimi -su takýsý ile oluþur.

 

If the vowel in the last syllable of the word is o or u, the possession form is formed with the -su suffix.

 

The words in bold are the verbs. The verbs are always in the end in turkish.

 

Olmak (to be, to become, to occur) = in turkish the infinitive is done by the -mek, -mak suffix. The root of this verb is "ol"

 

In order to add suffixes (personal, possessive, time suffixes) to this verb and conjugate the verb, you take the root "ol".

 

Ol + ur = it is, it becomes (the third person of the present tense)

               The suffix you need to conjugate the verb in the third singular person in the present tense is "er,-ar, -ur, -ür". You choose the one according to the vowel harmony rules in turkish. Here you choose -ur because you look at the last vowel of the word, it´s "o" and after "o or u", -ur comes.

 

olur ise = here "ise" gives the "if" meaning, but usually "ise" is changed to a suffix (it´s -se or -sa according to the vowel harmony rules), so "olur ise = olursa". You choose -sa when the last vowel of the word is "u,o,ý,a".

 

oluþmak = to form, to be formed , you remove the infinitive suffix -mak

You take the verb root "oluþ" and then add the needed suffixes to conjugate it

oluþ + ur = it forms, it´s formed

                  "ur" is the present tense suffix for the third singular person

5.       pepka
16 posts
 10 Oct 2008 Fri 02:34 pm

Thank you very much for writing so explicit an answer!!! But would it be too rude from me to ask you to explain the words before the word ünlü??? {#lang_emotions_unsure} 

6.       mltm
3690 posts
 10 Oct 2008 Fri 02:52 pm

Sözcüðün son hecesindeki ünlü =

 

sözcüðün son hecesi = It means "the last syllable of the word"

                                     this is a compound noun.

In turkish "of the word" part comes before the noun, here it´s "syllable"

sözcüðün = of the word

sözcük = word

Forget the "son" which means "last" and look at the compound noun "sözcüðün hecesi"

 

sözcüðün hecesi

 

The suffixes in bold are standard suffixes to form a defined compound noun.

 

To form a defined compound noun, you add the genitive suffix "-in, -ýn, -un, -ün". You have to choose the right form according to the vowel harmony rules.

 

Here "sözcük + ün" , we take "ün" form of the genitive suffix because the last vowel of the word is "ü" (sözcük). However you cannot leave the word as "sözcükü", you have to make another changement this time according to the consonant harmony rules. sözcükü --> sözcüðün

k softens to "ð" because when you add a suffix that starts with a vowel to a word of which last letter is "k", k softens to ð.

 

To form a defined compound you add the -ý, -i, -u, ü suffix (which is called third singular possessive suffix) to the second element of the compound which is "hece (syllable)" here.

 

hece + i (you do not choose "ý" but "i" because of the vowel harmony)

 

However you cannot leave it "hecei" because in turkish you have to put a consonant between two vowels. The fusion consonants in turkish are "y,s and n". Here you pick, "s", and it becomes "hecesi". (as well you need to learn which fusion consonant to put in between because they result in different meanings, forexample "heceni =your syllable, hecesi = his/her/its syllable, heceyi = the syllable)

 

Here you have "sözcüðün hecesi"

 

You can add your adjectives before the noun that you want to describe.

"Sözcüðün son hecesi"

 

hecesinde = -de suffix here is a case suffix, and it gives the meaning (in,at,on etc)

                 "n" is a fusion consonant that is used to be a link between a word that ends with a consonant ("hecesi") and the -de suffix.

 

Sözcüðün son hecesinde = in the last syllable of the word

 

Sözcüðün son hecesindeki = -ki is a suffix that means "that is/are"

Sözcüðün son hecesindeki ünlü = the vowel that is in the last syllable of the word

7.       pepka
16 posts
 10 Oct 2008 Fri 04:10 pm

Many thanks for the thorough explanation... I wish I could return the gesture should you decide to learn Bulgarian, do not hesitate to ask me for help ))

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