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Present participle
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| 1. |
29 Mar 2006 Wed 10:02 pm |
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Ankara'ya giden otobüslerin hepsi doludur
Ankara'ya gidenlerin hepsi erkek
Why do "otobüslerin" and "gidenlerin" and with -in?
Whereas in this sentence:
Oğluma, hediye veren adam onun amcasıydı
"adam" doesn't get a suffix. According to me "adam" has the same function (subject) in the sentence as the previous words. Why the suffix then, I thought a subject doesn't take one?
(my source is www.turkishlanguage.co.uk)
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| 2. |
29 Mar 2006 Wed 10:05 pm |
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Quoting Elisa: Ankara'ya giden otobüslerin hepsi doludur
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Another question arose! 
Why does it say "doludur" in that sentence? Shouldn't it be "dolular", or even simply "dolu"?
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| 3. |
29 Mar 2006 Wed 11:07 pm |
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Well I am as confused as you.
Perhaps the suffix on the otobus is there because it is saying 'of' the busses to Ankara each was full.
Now, I am completely guessing but I suspect that this may also be the reason for the 'dur'.
I am sure if had there been only one bus then it would be 'dolu'.
Perhaps the 'dur' relates the 'each' was full.
I throw this out for discussion as now my head is spinning. :-S
ps Thats the fist time I have used a smiley thing I hope it works!!!
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| 4. |
29 Mar 2006 Wed 11:36 pm |
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| 5. |
29 Mar 2006 Wed 11:47 pm |
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Quoting Kadir37: Quoting Elisa: Ankara'ya giden otobüslerin hepsi doludur
Ankara'ya gidenlerin hepsi erkek
Why do 'otobüslerin' and 'gidenlerin' and with -in?
Whereas in this sentence:
Oğluma, hediye veren adam onun amcasıydı
'adam' doesn't get a suffix. According to me 'adam' has the same function (subject) in the sentence as the previous words. Why the suffix then, I thought a subject doesn't take one?
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otobüslerin hepsi = all of the busses
gidenlerin hepsi = all of went to …
And we prefer to say that “Ankara’ya giden otobüslerin hepsi dolu.â€
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Ahaa, I see it now!  I didn't know you have to use the possessive construction with hepsi.
As for "dolu", that's because the subject is plural already, so there is no need for a 3rd person plural verb, right?
Thank you so much Kadir!
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| 6. |
30 Mar 2006 Thu 12:23 am |
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Quoting Elisa:
As for "dolu", that's because the subject is plural already, so there is no need for a 3rd person plural verb, right? |
This is not quite right. In verb conjugations for third person plural we use these rules:
1. If the subject is singular use a singular verb.
2. If the subject is plural follow these rules:
2.1. Individuals who have personalities (this means all humans and some animals that we call with their names) can be either conjugated with singular verbs or plural verbs. Both will be correct.
2.2. All other plural subjects including objects and animals must take a singular verb.
examples for 2.2. :
So we say, "Kuşlar uçtu" and not "Kuşlar uçtular".
We say, "Çiçekler soldu" and not "Çiçekler soldular".
Smillarly we say, "Otobüsler doldu" and not "Otobüsler doldular".
The exception for 2.2. is poetic expressions. In this case it will be alright to use plural.
Examples for 2.1. :
We can say "Çocuklar şarkı söylüyordu" or "Çocuklar şarkı söylüyorlardı".
I normally prefer the singualars for 2.1. as well. This means I use only the singular conjugation for thirs person plurals whenever possible.
"Ankara'ya giden otobüslerin hepsi dolu" is better. The -dir suffix can be used, 1.When talking about scientific facts ; 2. When telling a story.
If this had been a story -dir would be alright. Otherwise we shouldn't use it in this sentence.
"Ankara'ya giden otobüslerin hepsi doludur. Ahmet ne yapacağını bilememektedir. Hemen Ankara'ya gitmesi gerekmektedir. İşte tam bu sırada aklına bir fikir gelir."
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| 7. |
30 Mar 2006 Thu 12:53 am |
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Quoting erdinc: Quoting Elisa:
As for "dolu", that's because the subject is plural already, so there is no need for a 3rd person plural verb, right? |
This is not quite right. In verb conjugations for third person plural we use these rules:
1. If the subject is singular use a singular verb.
2. If the subject is plural follow these rules:
2.1. Individuals who have personalities (this means all humans and some animals that we call with their names) can be either conjugated with singular verbs or plural verbs. Both will be correct.
2.2. All other plural subjects including objects and animals must take a singular verb.
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Thanks, I had forgotten about that actually :s
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| 8. |
30 Mar 2006 Thu 03:14 am |
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Quoting Elisa: Quoting erdinc: Quoting Elisa:
As for "dolu", that's because the subject is plural already, so there is no need for a 3rd person plural verb, right? |
This is not quite right. In verb conjugations for third person plural we use these rules:
1. If the subject is singular use a singular verb.
2. If the subject is plural follow these rules:
2.1. Individuals who have personalities (this means all humans and some animals that we call with their names) can be either conjugated with singular verbs or plural verbs. Both will be correct.
2.2. All other plural subjects including objects and animals must take a singular verb.
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Thanks, I had forgotten about that actually :s |
i disagree. we should use '-dur' (doludur) in this sentence. a proper sentence must end with a verb.
and 'dolu' itself means 'full' and is used as an adjective.
therefore, -dur addition turns the adjective into the verb which completes the sentence.
additional info : dolu-d-ur
where 'd' is the affix and 'ur' is to make present tense.
note:
1. i'm open for any other opposite sights.let's discuss!
2. sorry for my english
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| 9. |
30 Mar 2006 Thu 03:56 am |
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The following sentence is incorrect in Turkish:
"Ankara'ya giden otobüslerin hepsi doludur."
The correct sentence should be:
"Ankara'ya giden otobüslerin hepsi dolu."
-dur shouldn't be included in that sentence as it is not telling a statement. There is still a chance that it might be a part of a story. I already gave you an example above how it could possibly be used in story telling. But since we are discussing this as a particular sentence I can tell you that it is incorrect. Most native Turks would tell you that this sentence is incorrect if its not a part of a story that somebody is telling.
Quoting Barkin: i disagree. we should use '-dur' (doludur) in this sentence. a proper sentence must end with a verb. |
No. In Turkish, sentences don't have to end with a verb. There are two types of sentences in Turkish. Sentences are either 'verb sentences' (fiil cümlesi) or 'noun sentences' (isim cümlesi).
Adjectives are considered as nouns in this context.
In other words if the predicate is not a conjugable verb (they have the -mek form) then it is a noun sentence.
Cümleler Türkçede yüklemin türüne göre 'fiil cümlesi' ve 'isim cümlesi' olmak üzere ikiye ayrılır. Yüklem çekimli bir fiil değilse cümle isim cümlesidir.
Here are examples:
Ben öğrenciyim. (noun based sentence)
Hava çok sıcak. (noun based sentence)
Bu müzik çok güzel. (noun based sentence)
Bu üç örnekte 'öğrenciyim', 'sıcak' ve 'güzel' kelimeleri yüklemdir.
In these examples 'öğrenciyim', 'sıcak' ve 'güzel' are predicates.
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