I am just saying... if you want to use wikipedia as a source to make your point, then at least have wikipedia STATE your point. If you want to say "the world is flat, look at wikipedia!" and wikipedia says "the world is round"...then why are you quoting wikipedia?

Actually, it is controversial.  This constant haranging on the "AG" issue reminds me of a technique I read about in a book on different ways to get what you want....one of the most primitive, but effective methods was the ram rod technique.  That is...you keep on pressing your point until the other party gives in. If you keep banging a wall, sooner or later if will fall......unless counter measures are taken.

Did you ever consider why all these Kurdish/Armenian claims are coming up now? Take a look at a few maps....after the "Genocide" is determined....compensation is next.....and just what do they claim as their lost territories?...........ah....look at the beachfront property!

The bottom line....it´s about territory and assets....and as water has been seen to be a serious source of conflict....look at what is there!

I do agree with you regarding the wiki. It is not a stable source of information. I personally witnessed the manipulations, thus I changed my mind as for its reliability. However, it is still a great source of information.

I also do agree with you on the Armenian lobby. Having now said that, you cant deny that it can also be vice versa. Turks arent stupid or weak to simply not push their own campaigns.

Yes, the world powers long before and after WW1 tried to crush and divide the Ottoman empire between themselves, successfully.

Great Influenza. What has it to do with the subject?

Although, the old good wiki states the mortality could have reached globally 50-100 million.

The great Influenza Epidemic has a lot to do with the death tolls of the time in question.  It was the first international epidemic that spread so fast as to almost cover the whole world simultaneously. It is estimated between 20 to 40 million people died because of it. (a lower number, not from Wikipedia)

Trench warfare during WWI and the airplane helped spread the disease around the world.

The difference between the Armenian lobby and the Turkish one is the fact that there are many more Armenians living in comfort in the US who have mastered how to communicate and express themselves here. I was reading an interesting article on racisim and it mentioned the influx of the Armenians during the early part of the 20th Century. They just barely were able to slide by as "White European", instead of Asian giving them access to property and citizenship rights.

Living in a place, learning the cultural nuances, as well as language, helps of knowing how to promote one´s agenda.  One is more able to integrate into the society one wants to influence. I actually doubt if many of the second, and third generation Armenians know much about the historic facts of the early part of the 20th Century themselves. They only know what grandma or great grandmother or uncles told them. It feeds hate, and that is never good. As I have said before, IMHO....all war is a type of genocide. It was a war.....and until that is dealt with it is just another case of the pot calling the kettle black.

"During a revealing moment in the history of American citizenship, the line between white and non-white blurred briefly. Fleeing from genocide in their homelands, 50,000 Armenians had come to America in the early twentieth century. In 1909 federal authorities classified Armenians as ´Asiatics´ and denied naturalized citizenship to Armenian immigrants. But shortly afterward, in the Halladjian decision, a U.S. circuit court of appeals ruled that Armenians were Caucasian because of their ethnography, history, and appearance. Four years later California passed its alien land law, but the restriction did not apply to Armenians. By 1930, some 18,000 Armenians lived in the state; their access to land ownership enabled many Armenians to become farmers in Fresno County. They became wealthy farmers-owners of vast acreage and leading producers of raisins. ´The Armenians, they like the Japanese,´ recalled a Japanese farmer of Fresno. ´Lots speak only Armenian-just like Issei immigrant Japanese. They came about the same time too. But I think they learned a little bit more English than the Japanese did and they looked more American and I think it helped them a lot.´ The experience of the Armenians illustrated the immense difference it made to be Caucasian and not ´Asiatic.´"-R. Takaki, Strangers From a Different Shore

To say that the Kurdish issue is simply about assets is a very limited view. Did you forget that Kurds in Turkey weren´t even allowed to write or speak the Kurdish language in public for many years? Was that an asset-thing too?

Since this isn´t only about Armenians anymore, an interesting outcome from a questionairre:

"Political dissociation between the Turks and the Kurds becomes most concrete on the matter of whether Kurds want a separate state. A full 64.4 percent of respondents hold that Kurds want a separate state whereas only 24.6 percent do not agree with this statement. This perception becomes even more obvious in terms of ethnic background. A total of 71.3 percent of Turks hold that the Kurds want a separate state whereas only 17.9 percent do not agree with this statement. On the other hand, 59 percent of Kurds indicate that they do not seek a separate state. The figures show that there is a visible perception suggesting that the Kurds want their own independent state."

Source: http://pollmark.com.tr/Haberler.aspx?ID=76

Well Barba, I certainly hope you are not so naive as to notrealize the fact that it is ALWAYS about assets! Always....weather those assets are tangible or intangible, it is about territory, space personal, physical, metaphysical.....and how those are shared...or not...

It seems you and I define the word asset differently. For you, speaking a language or being able to express you culture is an asset. Since I have a business background, I see assets as things like money, land, and such. I do know there is such a thing as an intangible asset (like a trademarkt or goodwill). However, it seems your vague description of assets would simply cover everything in the entire universe. So yes, in that case, it is always about assets since everything is assets. But if you use this word, it makes the issues discussed here sound like they are about some form of greed.

By the way... why no remark on the part about Turkish perception and Kurdish opinions?

I do see water as an asset yes, I´m not an idiot or something. But I don´t see having the freedom to speak the language of your parents in public as an asset, but as a basic human right. Fighting for that freedom is not a form of greed, but part of being human. That is why I say the "asset-view" is a limited one, and it ignores the human side of the story. I have grown up in a country where I have always been able to speak my parents language inside my home, and outside my home. I have always been able to express my feelings in writing, in any language that I would seem fit. Turkey has a vast group of people who can´t say the same. Luckily big steps toward progress and personal freedom are being made, where people can speak the language, sing the songs, and write the things they want to write. Polarizing views have never helped anybody. And looking into the history of Turkey from different sides, and from ethnicities that are not your own will also not hurt anybody.

Kurds - currently armed in the mountains - are about to be lured into the same trap rebellious Armenians were fooled into around 1915.

Guess by who ?