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GERUNDS
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20. |
14 Jul 2012 Sat 02:04 am |
- mIş kadar
When this gerundium suffix comes to the verb stem , it gives the meaning of "as if"
Sınavdan iyi not alınca, sınıfı geçmiş kadar sevindi.
When he got good point from the exam, he was as much happy as [ if ] he passed the class.
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It was only a good point that he got from the exam, there are still more exams to pass but he felt so happy as if he passed the [whole year] class.
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21. |
14 Jul 2012 Sat 08:35 am |
I agree with you, hocam..
Gerund(ium) is zarffiil in Turkish grammar:
And gerund seems to be "isimfiil" in English grammar.
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22. |
14 Jul 2012 Sat 08:47 am |
After I ve done some research ,I noticed that linguists and Turkologs call it as Gerundium [zarf-fiil]
Prof Dr. Muharrem Ergin and other linguists call them as "Gerundiums" and he says ;
And here´s how gerundivum is described in Latin itself:
Gerundivum
Gerundivum est modus verbi Linguae Latinae, accurate adiectivus verbalis passivus cuius significatio est aliquod debere facere, e.g dolor vix (non) ferendus aut labores non fugiendi. Nomen amanda sonat ergo "quae amari debet".
It could be understood as "sıfatfiil" in Turkish not "zarffiil".
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23. |
14 Jul 2012 Sat 01:40 pm |
- mAk yerine
Verb stem + mAk yerine =====> Instead of
Bana öğüt vermek yerine kendi sorunlarını çöz.
Solve your own problems instead of advising me.
[Deal with your own problems instead of preaching me.]
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Konuşmak yerine biraz da insanları dinlemeyi dene.
Try to listen to people abit instead of talking.
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24. |
14 Jul 2012 Sat 03:19 pm |
And gerund seems to be "isimfiil" in English grammar.
But their equivalents are often zarffiil in Turkish:
he sat not moving - kımıldamadan oturdu
they came running - koşarak geldiler
Mary, leaning from the window, watched him - Mary, pencereden uzanarak, (onu) izledi
That´s why gerund is not isimfiil but zarffiil in Turkish grammar..
By the way the greatest authorities of the Turkish grammar call gerundium as zarffiil
Edited (7/14/2012) by scalpel
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25. |
14 Jul 2012 Sat 09:34 pm |
-Anda
Verb stem + Anda ====> When
This form is used in folk songs and colloquial language especially it is a typical gerundium of Azerbaijani dialect.
Aklıma sen gelende gönlümde çiçekler açar. ----> My heart blossoms when you come to my mind.
We see this form in a nice folk song from Kerkük region ; it is called "Çakmağı çak"
çırağda yağ tükendi ne yaman vakit tükendi ne sennen bu güzellik ne mennen ah tükendi
çakmağı çak çırağı yandırmamışam yarim için potin aldım tekini yolda salmışam
çırağı yandıraydım yol üste konduraydım yarim bize gelende heybesin endireydim
çırağım şule verdi kölgesin güle verdi neylerim yar men sennen tez meni dile verdi
damda çırağ yandırır manin görür söndürür özü keyf sefada meni dertten öldürür
and "Ersen ve Kardaşlar " in 70´s composed this folk song as their first 45´s. Enjoy the song
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNJspekCYi8
Edited (7/14/2012) by tunci
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26. |
15 Jul 2012 Sun 07:36 am |
That´s why gerund is not isimfiil but zarffiil in Turkish grammar..
By the way the greatest authorities of the Turkish grammar call gerundium as zarffiil
Well,
I suggest you start with reading identifying verbals for example. If you insinst then we can further talk.
Let´s forget about what they (i.e the greatest authorities of the Turkish grammar) call gerendivum. We are trying to sort out what gerund means in English language (The title is in English, right?).
I´ll copy the gerund part from the given link below:
Gerunds
A gerund is a verb form ending in -ing that functions in a sentence as a noun. Although both the present participle and the gerund are formed by adding -ing to a verb, note that the participle does the job of an adjective while the gerund does the job of a noun. Compare the verbals in these two sentences:
The children, crying and exhausted, were guided out of the collapsed mine. Crying will not get you anywhere.
Whereas the participle crying modifies the subject in the first sentence, the gerund Crying is the subject of the second sentence.
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27. |
15 Jul 2012 Sun 10:58 am |
The title is in English, right?
It is in English but it is not about English.
It is impossible to create a grammar terminology which applies to every language in the world. For instance, we talk about Swedish or German auxiliaries, even Turkish auxiliaries even though we very well know they have very little in common with English auxiliaries. Grammar consists of continuums rather than strictly bordered units.
I believe transporting grammar terminology from one language to another has done damage to our understanding. Anyway, this is the way linguists at all times have struggled their way to more accurate definitions.
For some reason some grammarians have begun to use the term gerund in Turkish grammar denoting to the diverse group of adverb-like verb forms. And not only in Turkish as we saw in the Russian examples. I must admit I can’t quite understand why this happened. Probably for practical reasons. Practical reasons are as good as any. Words are agreements after all.
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28. |
15 Jul 2012 Sun 11:10 am |
It is in English but it is not about English.
I think when you say "gerund" in English, you must stick to what it means in English, right?
I repeat: what they call "gerund" in English is called "isimfiil" in Turkish. That´s my understanding.
Edited (7/15/2012) by si++
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29. |
15 Jul 2012 Sun 11:13 am |
I think when you say "gerund" in English, you must stick to what it means in English, right?
No.
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30. |
15 Jul 2012 Sun 11:24 am |
So how do you define "gerund" in English? I have provided definitions and examples so far.
I would like to hear what definition you stick to.
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