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I wanna know
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| 10. |
13 May 2007 Sun 10:48 pm |
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Well, deli kızın.  What about this?:
çalışaymışım: It is said (or I was told) "if only I had worked".
Such a usage is hardly used, so I wouldn't get snagged on it too much if I were in place of you.
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| 11. |
13 May 2007 Sun 10:51 pm |
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Quoting panta rei: Well, deli kızın. What about this?:
çalışaymışım: It is said (or I was told) "if only I had worked"? |
Yani.. çalışaymışım dersem, kendi fikrim değil ama öğretmen falan böyle bir şey dedi? Yoksa?
Başka bir sorum da var: Çalışaymışım.. bir S eksik değil mi?
Keşke çalışsaydım.. Orada bir S var.. ama Çalışaymışım bu S eksik, ya da gerek yok mu bu sefer?
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| 12. |
13 May 2007 Sun 11:07 pm |
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Quoting Deli_kizin: Quoting panta rei: Well, deli kızın. What about this?:
çalışaymışım: It is said (or I was told) "if only I had worked"? |
Yani.. çalışaymışım dersem, kendi fikrim değil ama öğretmen falan böyle bir şey dedi? Yoksa?
Başka bir sorum da var: Çalışaymışım.. bir S eksik değil mi?
Keşke çalışsaydım.. Orada bir S var.. ama Çalışaymışım bu S eksik, ya da gerek yok mu bu sefer? |
deli kızın - you are asking too many questions, and you know I don't like much those asking too many, like you. 
The second "s" comes from the fact that "sa" in çalışsaydım" is "subjunctive-conditional" suffix.
(Keşke) Çalışsam.
(Compare "keşke çalışsam" and "çalışsam, para kazanırım".)
But, çalışayım is imperative form for the first person singular, thus "subjuntive" in its own. And çalış-a-y-dı-m is still the same form but this time in the past tense.
çalış (verb stem) + a(subjuntive suffix) + y + dı (past tense suffix) + m (personal suffix).
çalış-a-y-mış(mış suffix) +ım
çalış (verb stem) + sa (subjunctive-conditional suffix) +m
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| 13. |
14 May 2007 Mon 12:44 pm |
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Quoting panta rei:
The second 's' comes from the fact that 'sa' in çalışsaydım' is 'subjunctive-conditional' suffix.
(Keşke) Çalışsam.
(Compare 'keşke çalışsam' and 'çalışsam, para kazanırım'.)
But, çalışayım is imperative form for the first person singular, thus 'subjuntive' in its own. And çalış-a-y-dı-m is still the same form but this time in the past tense.
çalış (verb stem) + a(subjuntive suffix) + y + dı (past tense suffix) + m (personal suffix).
çalış-a-y-mış(mış suffix) +ım
çalış (verb stem) + sa (subjunctive-conditional suffix) +m |
OK, I understand this. However, with the above explanation in mind, I can't help but wonder if your English translation in the following is correct:
Quoting panta rei: çalışaymışım: It is said (or I was told) 'if only I had worked'. |
I thought it was about 'let me work', not 'if only I had..'?
Do you get what I mean, or is it my Monday morning lethargic brain getting in the way? 
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| 14. |
14 May 2007 Mon 01:32 pm |
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Yes I wondered the same Elisa. Then I came up with this, though I am not sure if it is correct:
Çalışayım: Let me work. Considering this situation in which you're talking with friends during studying, you could say 'Neyse.. çalışayım..'.. You're not exactly asking for their permission, nor expressing something you 'want', more something you consider best to do, something you 'shoul do'. 'Anyway, I should study again'. In that case, you can more easily connect it to çalışaymışım: it is said that I should have studied.
Im not sure if this explanation is a bit too far-fetched though
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| 15. |
14 May 2007 Mon 03:26 pm |
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Quoting kitt_61:
çalışaydım
çalışaymışım
What the verbs above means?
Thank you very much. |
Hey, I'm a bit confused about grammar.
I don't use these too, only at times in a funny way, but I rather use "çalışsaydım" and "çalışsaymışım" I believe they're same with the above ones. Can someone confirm me?
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| 16. |
14 May 2007 Mon 03:33 pm |
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Quoting Elisa:
Quoting panta rei: çalışaymışım: It is said (or I was told) 'if only I had worked'. |
I thought it was about 'let me work', not 'if only I had..'?
Do you get what I mean, or is it my Monday morning lethargic brain getting in the way?
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Yes, it is supposed to be about "let me work", but sadly it isn't so; for English has no "past subjunctive form(s)". (But, you know, French has them perfectly.) For subjunctive statements of such kinds, we have to use either "wish-clauses" or "if only".
Example:
Present: çalışayım - let me work - que je travaille
Past: çalışaydım - N/A* - que je travaillasse
* N/A: I wish I had worked.
Here the simple but the main principle, at least for Turkish and French, is that whatever tense is available in a indicative statement, the same tense is and should be available in the subjunctive form macthing the indicative statement.
Example:
..........................Indicative.................Subjunctive...............................
Present:.........çalışıyorum....................çalışayım.............Şimdiki Zaman
Past:..................çalıştım......................çalışaydım............Di'li Geçmiş Zaman
...........................çalışmışım...................çalışaymışım........Miş'li Geçmiş Zaman
Present: .........je travaille..................que je travaille............Present
Past: ..............je travaillais................que je travaillasse.......Imparfait
You know "miş" implies "It is said", "they say", "I was told" and the like. These implications remain the same in the subjunctive moods, too. Thus,
Çalışmışım: They say I had worked.
Çalışaymışım: They say if only I had worked.
I am not sure, either, if the latter is correct translation. Maybe our native English friends would correct me. If I am wrong, then simply let me ask this:
How could we report "if only-clauses" to a third person?
e.g.
X: if only you had worked, panta rei!
Y (reporting to Z): X said that if only panta rei had worked
or panta rei: I was told that if only I had worked
Is the above reporting correct?
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| 17. |
14 May 2007 Mon 04:37 pm |
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Quoting Deli_kizin: 'Neyse.. çalışayım..'.. You're not exactly asking for their permission, nor expressing something you 'want', more something you consider best to do, something you 'shoul do'. 'Anyway, I should study again'. |
Nope! I think the construction "had/would + better + bare-infitinive" would fits in here better.
"Anyway, I'd better study." (Or, I'd better go on studying.)
Quoting Deli_kizin: it is said that I should have studied. |
And this would translate like the following:
Çalış-malı-y-mış-ım.
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| 18. |
14 May 2007 Mon 04:38 pm |
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Quoting Deli_kizin: 'Neyse.. çalışayım..'.. You're not exactly asking for their permission, nor expressing something you 'want', more something you consider best to do, something you 'shoul do'. 'Anyway, I should study again'. |
Nope! I think the construction "had/would + better + bare-infitinive" would fits in here better.
"Anyway, I'd better study." (Or, I'd better go on studying.)
Quoting Deli_kizin: it is said that I should have studied. |
And this would translate like the following:
Çalış-malı-y-mış-ım.
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| 19. |
14 May 2007 Mon 04:41 pm |
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I can't say it's a piece of cake for me now, but thanks once again Panta Rei for explaining 
However, this is what I will rembember for now I think 
Quoting panta rei: Such a usage is hardly used, so I wouldn't get snagged on it too much if I were in place of you. |
Think I'd better get the other tenses right first instead of racking my brains on this one..
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