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Subjunctive Tense Help please!
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| 10. |
11 Aug 2007 Sat 01:05 am |
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Thank you so much all of you for your help both native speakers and learners!!
You really threw light on the subject. I read your explanations and links carefully and it is much clearer for me know.
I realize it is just a matter of reading and practice although the context might change significantly if you use a suffix of those wrongly...so I have to be careful too!
Size tesekkur edEYIM! 
Dilara.
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| 11. |
11 Aug 2007 Sat 12:13 pm |
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Quote: Hi all, I struggle to understand the subjunctive tense in turkish but cant grasp it yet!
I just know that the suffixes are :
-eyim
-esin
-e
-elim
-esiniz
-eler
But sometimes I confuse it with the imperative mood, above all the 3rd person singular!
I also read it can mean "should we...?" but as far as I know , in turkish "should uses the "-meli / - mali" suffix ,
therefore, "I must = I should"... ayni mi?
Is " let's / let me etc" the closest translation of the subjunctive suffix??
Any help and examples highly appreciated,
Dilara |
From my grammar book:
| | Dilek-Şart | İstek | Gereklilik | Buyuru |
|---|
| Bildirme | | sev-se-m | | sev-se-n | | sev-se | | sev-se-k | | sev-se-niz | | sev-se-ler |
| | sev-e-yim | | sev-e-sin | | sev-e, sev-sin | | sev-e-lim | | sev-e-siniz | | sev-e-ler, sev-sin-ler |
| | sev-meli-yim | | sev-meli-sin | | sev-meli | | sev-meli-yiz | | sev-meli-siniz | | sev-meli-ler |
| | - | | sev | | sev-sin | | - | | sev-in,sev-in-iz | | sev-sin-ler |
| | Anlatım | | sev-se-ydi-m | | sev-se-ydi-n | | sev-se-ydi | | sev-se-ydi-k | | sev-se-ydi-niz | | sev-se-ydi-ler |
| | sev-e-ydi-m | | sev-e-ydi-n | | sev-e-ydi | | sev-e-ydi-k | | sev-e-ydi-niz | | sev-e-ydi-ler |
| | sev-meli-ydi-m | | sev-meli-ydi-n | | sev-meli-ydi | | sev-meli-ydi-k | | sev-meli-ydi-niz | | sev-meli-ydi-ler |
| yok | | Söylenti | | sev-se-ymiş-im | | sev-se-ymiş-sin | | sev-se-ymiş | | sev-se-ymiş-iz | | sev-se-ymiş-siniz | | sev-se-ymiş-ler |
| | sev-e-ymiş-im | | sev-e-ymiş-sin | | sev-e-ymiş | | sev-e-ymiş-iz | | sev-e-ymiş-siniz | | sev-e-ymiş-ler |
| | sev-meli-ymiş-im | | sev-meli-ymiş-sin | | sev-meli-ymiş | | sev-meli-ymiş-iz | | sev-meli-ymiş-siniz | | sev-meli-ymiş-ler |
| yok | | Şart | yok | yok | | sev-meli-yse-m | | sev-meli-yse-n | | sev-meli-yse | | sev-meli-yse-k | | sev-meli-yse-niz | | sev-meli-yse-ler |
| yok |
Notice that in istek-bildirme table, 3rd persons
seve or sevsin (also in buyuru-bildirme table)
and
seveler or sevsinler
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| 12. |
11 Aug 2007 Sat 02:21 pm |
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Quoting Dilara: Thank you so much all of you for your help both native speakers and learners!!
You really threw light on the subject. I read your explanations and links carefully and it is much clearer for me know.
I realize it is just a matter of reading and practice although the context might change significantly if you use a suffix of those wrongly...so I have to be careful too!
Size tesekkur edEYIM!
Dilara. |
Müthişsin
Furthermore, there is a common form about -eyim,-elim:
This may be used as a response of an offer that you should do it too:
- Biz gidiyoruz
- En iyisi biz de gidelim
- We are leaving
- Let's leave too (the best is we should leave too)
En iyisi (ben de/biz de) ....-eyim/-elim
or
O zaman (ben de/biz de) ...-eyim/-elim
as a decision (I mentioned it before). If you have just decided than this is a good idea, and you should do it, then you can sue these forms. You may use them for other people as well, but this time, imperative form could be better:
O zaman siz de gidin.
or for the others:
O zaman o da gitsin
En iyisi onlar da gitsin(ler) (ler may be used or not if you say "onlar"; but if you don't mention that they are plural, you have to use "-ler/lar" at the end of the verb)
There is another form for wishes/orders to close people: "-sene"/"-senize"
But I am not sure if it is official usage or not. We generally use this very much:
- Biz futbol oynayacağız, sen de gelsene!
- We'll play football, come! (join us!)
Actually this is: "-sen ya!?/-seniz ya!?"
It means something like "what would it be if you do ...?" as offer or order(strong offer)
- Bu akşam Ahmet'le ders çalışacağız, siz de gelsenize?! (or gelseniz ya?!)
- This evening, I (we) will study with Ahmet, you should come too. (or: "what do you think of coming too?")
He offers them to join he and Ahmet to study, so he says: "gelsenize"
You may hear this form very much between close friends/relatives etc.
If there is someone who talks very much (like me), you can say:
Sen sussana biraz!
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| 13. |
12 Aug 2007 Sun 02:22 am |
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Quoting caliptrix: Quoting Dilara: Thank you so much all of you for your help both native speakers and learners!!
You really threw light on the subject. I read your explanations and links carefully and it is much clearer for me know.
I realize it is just a matter of reading and practice although the context might change significantly if you use a suffix of those wrongly...so I have to be careful too!
Size tesekkur edEYIM!
Dilara. |
Müthişsin
Furthermore, there is a common form about -eyim,-elim:
This may be used as a response of an offer that you should do it too:
- Biz gidiyoruz
- En iyisi biz de gidelim
- We are leaving
- Let's leave too (the best is we should leave too)
En iyisi (ben de/biz de) ....-eyim/-elim
or
O zaman (ben de/biz de) ...-eyim/-elim
as a decision (I mentioned it before). If you have just decided than this is a good idea, and you should do it, then you can sue these forms. You may use them for other people as well, but this time, imperative form could be better:
O zaman siz de gidin.
or for the others:
O zaman o da gitsin
En iyisi onlar da gitsin(ler) (ler may be used or not if you say "onlar"; but if you don't mention that they are plural, you have to use "-ler/lar" at the end of the verb)
There is another form for wishes/orders to close people: "-sene"/"-senize"
But I am not sure if it is official usage or not. We generally use this very much:
- Biz futbol oynayacağız, sen de gelsene!
- We'll play football, come! (join us!)
Actually this is: "-sen ya!?/-seniz ya!?"
It means something like "what would it be if you do ...?" as offer or order(strong offer)
- Bu akşam Ahmet'le ders çalışacağız, siz de gelsenize?! (or gelseniz ya?!)
- This evening, I (we) will study with Ahmet, you should come too. (or: "what do you think of coming too?")
He offers them to join he and Ahmet to study, so he says: "gelsenize"
You may hear this form very much between close friends/relatives etc.
If there is someone who talks very much (like me), you can say:
Sen sussana biraz!
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Once again, thanks a lot for your help si++ and caliptrix !
Your examples were very useful for me as usual.
I just have 2 more question and would be pleased if someone can help me.
The "-sana / -sene " expression (should I say suffix?) is used often according to caliptrix , right? but I was wondering if the closest translation could also be
" why don't you...?"
Mesela :
" Turkiye'ye gelsene!" why dont you come to Turkey!
and another question,
The imperative form of second person singular was verb without -mek/ -mak
" Buraya gel!" = (you) came here!
But what if I want to say :
" I will not let you come here " , " I will not let you (singular) cry for him" etc ...The verb IZIN VERMEK has nothing to do here?
The same with -in suffix for 2nd person plural imperative :
" Buraya gelin !" veya " bana yardim edin!" (you all help me!)
How do I say :
" I want to let you (all ) see it by yourselves
" I will not let you (all) come here with me "
I hope I wrote clearly and thank you for the "Müthişsin " part caliptrix ...
Iltifat almak her zaman güzel
Dilara.
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