I have some problems understanding the Olumsuz II form of this tense, İ’ll try to explain.

Ör.: “Yarınki partiye gelecek misin?”

- “Tabii ki geleceğim”
- “Hayır, gelmeyeceğim”
- “Hayır, gelemem.”

These kind of replies all give a 100% sure answer, there is no doubt about coming or not coming to the party.

BUT
I have a problem with the use of –ebil/-abil with a negative verb

For example the following replies to the above question:

“Henüz bilmiyorum. Belki gelebilirim, belki gelemem”.
I understand this one, İ’m still in doubt about going so that’s my answer.

“Gelebilirim de gelmeyebilirim de”
Here is where İ get kind of lost… As far as İ can see, giving this kind of reply implies doubt as well. What’s the difference in meaning then with the above sentence?

“Gelemeyebilirim”
And this one is a really hard one for me. As far as I understand, İ actually would want to go to the party, but there is something beyond my control (probable traffic problems, a very ill relative…) that makes it unable for me to decide right now.

İf someone could explain this with more examples it would be great.

Elisa I will just translate them into English so you can see the difference. A language teacher can explain the grammar better, so I'll leave this up to them!

“Tabii ki geleceğim” Of course I will come
GELECEĞİM = I will come

“Hayır, gelmeyeceğim” No, I will not come (or, colloquially, no I'm not coming)
GELMEYECEĞİM = I will not come

“Hayır, gelemem.” No, I can't come
GELEMEM = I can't come

“Henüz bilmiyorum. Belki gelebilirim, belki gelemem”.
I don't know yet, maybe I will be able to come, maybe I won't
GELEBİLİRİM = I can come
GELEMEM= I can't come

“Gelebilirim de gelmeyebilirim de”
I may be able to come, I may not be able to come
GELEBİLİRİM = I can come
GELEMEYEBİLİRİM= I may not be able to come
In the sentence above the speaker introduced the note of uncertainty by using BELKİ=maybe with a definite verb (I can or can't come). In the second the speaker uses uncertainty in the verb itself. They mean the same, just two ways of saying it (Like I may not be able to come or Maybe I can't come in English)

“Gelemeyebilirim”
GELEMEYEBİLİRİM= I may not be able to come

I will explain as it was explained to me:
Verb "gelmek"

Gelemeyebilirim : I may not be able to come
Gelmeyebilirim : I may not come ( There is a possibility of not coming . I may come or not - depends on something else)

Gelmeyebilirim : depends on the speaker's WILL , he isnt sure in advance BUT
GelEMEyebilirim : Doesnt depend on the epeaker's will but on circumstances.

Hope this helps !
Dilara.

Hi Elisa,

I just wanted to add that, perhaps you may find it easier to conceptualize if you do not stick to grammatical descriptions too much. They are usually arbitrary, and do not always follow much logic unless one has a solid grasp of word formation patterns in Turkish.

The primary verb root is GEL+MEK / to come. All others derive from this root by combining themselves with either other verbal roots, such as BIL+MEK / to know, or suffixes.

Think about it in this way. BILMEK generally translates as knowing or being aware of something. It could also mean that you have sufficient knowledge or 'ability' to do something.

E.g. okumayi bilmek / to know how to read

What is special about the verb BILMEK is that it tends to attach itself to other verbs, and usually indicates that one has the 'ability' or 'Know-How' to do something.

E.g. gormek / to see gor+e+bil+mek / to be able to see
sevmek / to love sev+e+bil+mek / to be able to love

You must have noticed the infix -e that is used to combine the primary verb with the secondary verb 'bilmek' in order to create the compound verbal formations, such as gorebilmek or sevebilmek.

The same -e may also take the form of -a, as in YAP+A+BIL+MEK due to vowel harmony. But, either way, it is just a bridge particle, which glues one verb to another.

Regarding your question about 'GELEMEYEBILIRIM', I would suggest that you try to break it down as below:

GEL+E+ME+(Y)E+BIL+IR+IM

Gelemeyabilirim indicates at the possibility that one may not be able go somewhere. +ME (or +MA) in this case is a form of negation.

GELMEK vs GEL+E+ME+MEK / not able to come

In this form, we have a verbal root combining itself with to suffixes, +E(A) & +ME(MA).

Then, suffix +E is used again to glue BILMEK to give the expression a sense of unpredictability meaning that it all depends on other circumstances.

Here is the gimmick though. Instead of saying 'gelemeyebilirim' you could have said 'gelemem', which would indicate the same thing with a subtle difference.

O gun gelemem. / I can't come that day.
O gun gelemeyebilirim. / I may not be able to come that day.

BILMEK is basically added for reasons of politeness in most cases. It serves the purpose of avoiding sounding too direct or harsh when it comes to negating someone or something.

Hello egyptian_tomb

I actualy have no teaching qualifications or any teaching experience. I am generally interested in Old Turkish, its etymology, and how some of the absurdities of Modern Turkish came about. I am happy you found our replies helpful

I think it is kind of pointless to have this discussion as I clearly do not share your assumptions about the general linguistic concepts, such as suffixes, affixes, and infixes.

I also do not understand what you are trying to say by "Turkish logic doesn't work that way." You must be some kind of an expert on this so-called Turkish logic of yours. As a Turk, my mind works exactly in the way that you are suggesting it doesn't. That's a bit odd.

For me and particle that manages to place itself in the middle is an infix. A particle that attached itself to the end is a suffix, and one that comes at the beginning is a prefix.

GOR+DU.... +DU, in this case is a suffix in my mind.
ON+GOR+DU... ON+, is a prefix, although it has a meaning
OL+A+BIL+DI
GOR+E+BIL+DI
AL+IN+TI

You can pretty much break down any Turkish word into its components and assign specific functions. The -E/-A particle that you seem to be bent on not calling an infix works very much like an infix when it is in the middle position functioning as a glue to attach one verb to the other.

It is kind of trivial anyways.

I could explain more why it's not infix.

But yes I too find it pointless.

Last thing. I don't remember seeing any infix (içek) in any Turkish grammar book. Everything is listed as suffixes.

If you know any grammar book that talks about "infixes in Turkish" let me know.

I am not really interested in anyway why you think it is not an infix. It doesn't make any difference to me. I don't generally read Turkish grammar books either. Obviously, you do.

I dedided to call it an infix simply because that particle was located in the middle of the word. Calling it an infix served a purpose of practicality.

Feel free to call it whatever you like. It is an infix for me.