General/Off-topic |
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UK Standard of Living beats the US!!!
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| 80. |
23 Jan 2008 Wed 06:13 pm |
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Quoting ciko: i wonder what is the point of this thread... to determine which one is better?  |
I blame AEnigma for this!  Bed Englishwoman!
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| 81. |
23 Jan 2008 Wed 06:16 pm |
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Quoting teaschip1: Quoting ciko: Quoting teaschip1: Quoting ciko: Quoting teaschip1: Quoting girleegirl: Quoting teaschip1:
Well, if you think Bush is bad...Hillary is just plain evil. |
Please, do tell what 'evil' has Hillary perpetrated on the good people of the world. |
I would like to believe I'm a good judge in character. I have met thousands of women like Hillary Clinton in my life time. Hillary lacks integrity and I believe is a phony. She appears to be so self absorbed with a hidden agenda and not for the common good of the American people. Her past also doesn't help her cause. I realize you could say this about almost any politican, however I would give my vote to Obama before I would trust Hillary. |
i dont think she could be worse than G.W Bush.. and i dont think American Politics will change in long run.. US will keep destroying the world no matter who is in charge..maybe they will leave Iraq but i am very sure that they will create another enemy to fight..another land to make a blood bath as they have done for 50 years. Grrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!!! |
You may want to choose your words more carefully, Ciko. I believe Turkey has it's own battle with the PKK. Did Turkey create this enemy?
I do believe the U.S. has every right to interfere when it has a tremendous affect on our country. Otherwise, we should mind our own business. Which brings me to the following questions. Should the U.S. be providing real time intelligence to Turkey regarding the PKK or should we mind our own business? |
1 st question: did turkey create PKK?
absolutely yes if you could search about life in 70s and 80s in east of turkey you would see that.
2 nd question: Should the U.S. be providing real time intelligence to Turkey regarding the PKK or should we mind our own business?
yes you should just mind your own business as other countries..and you urgently should get the f..k out of middle east..there is nothing else you should do..the longer you stay here the more we hate US. sad but true.
and i wonder if Somalia, Sudan, Vietnam, all south american countries ( except argentina, brasil and mexico)kampuchea.. etc...did all these countries have tremendous effect on your country?
whatever you say..all the world know what is USA dont waste your energy to explain how good you are for the world
i wonder, do you have turkish blood?..you are unable to criticise your country just like most turkish people |
You at least had one wise comment Siko...I agree we should get out of the Middle East, so that you crazy people can kill eachother and not waste our good soldiers to a lost cause.. Talk about bloodshed..look at your own history.  I don't see millions of immigrants wanting to flee to Turkey.... |
awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww please dont leave us uncle sam what will we do without you
my advice to you is that dont watch fox tv so much
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| 82. |
23 Jan 2008 Wed 06:18 pm |
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Quoting Elisabeth: Quoting ciko: i wonder what is the point of this thread... to determine which one is better? |
I blame AEnigma for this! Bed Englishwoman! |
yeah!!! she always does the same ..causes a mess and then run away
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| 83. |
23 Jan 2008 Wed 06:26 pm |
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Quoting libralady: Quoting teaschip1: Quoting AEnigma III: Quoting teaschip1: So you could work one week, quit your job and have health insurance? Also, I'm curious what does a single employee pay on monthly basis into national insurance in UK? Is it the same for everyone or based on your salary and family size? |
Teas - you must get the word "insurance" out of your head. EVERYBODY is entitled to the same heathcare - from birth. You do not have to take ANY documents, certificates or evidence to the hospital with you and you don't have to claim anything back - there is NOTHING TO PAY.
National Insurance is a type of tax. It also covers other things like dental care and a state pension (most people have a private pension as well - you can have both).
Benefits that depend on NIC contributions
Your entitlement to the following benefits and/or the amount you can get will depend on your (or in some cases your spouse or civil partner's)
NIC contributions also cover:-
Contribution based Jobseeker's Allowance
Incapacity Benefit (if you can't work for long periods due to illness or injury)
State Pension
Widowed Parents' Allowance
Bereavement Allowance
Bereavement Payment
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/MoneyTaxAndBenefits/Taxes/BeginnersGuideToTax/DG_4015904
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So who is paying this tax then? |
Ok, here it is.
People who work pay tax and national insurance. Tax pays for things like the central government, local government, and the those things that are taken for granted like refuse collections, street cleaning, police, fire service, education etc etc
National Insurance pays for health care and social security payments, pensions and child benefit. (As listed by Aenigma)
If you have not worked, or you are out of work you are still entitled to social security benefits and health care but your pension will be or could be affected if you have not paid enough insurance.
We also have the options to pay private health care, private education, private pension but we still have to pay national insurance. If you have private pensions you still get your state pension (paid for by natioanl insurance)
This national insurance is not like the health insurance you pay. Our national insurance is I think around 8% or 9% of our non-taxable income, therefore the more you earn the more you pay.
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That still seems pretty high..So for example, I'm relatively heathly, rarely ever go to a doctor..I'm required to pay a 8 or 9% of my non taxable income. For example; my non-taxable income is $60,000. I contribute 8%= $4,800 annually, $400 monthly. But this forgoes any co pays and deductables..For someone who has a great deal of usage..this would seem very reasonable, however for the single healthy person a little pricey. But I haven't included SS and pensions either.
Thanks for your explanation, I appreciate your help Libra.
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| 84. |
23 Jan 2008 Wed 06:41 pm |
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No matter what way you put it, I personally don't want to pay for other peoples medical coverage thru taxation. When I was going to college, I worked 3 jobs to pay my bills (tuition, car and health insurance), I studied hard and got ahead. I come from a family that didn't have a lot of money nothing was "given" to us. My brothers and I all went to college and are all very successful (and all have health insurance). There is no reason why other people can't do that. I love helping the needy but I would like to choose how I do that...I don't want the government to choose it for me. Certainly there is a better solution to the healthcare situation than to make it a part of our already backward government!!
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| 85. |
23 Jan 2008 Wed 06:52 pm |
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It's a matter of attitude and outlook and I don't think the mentality will change anytime soon, there are of course pros and cons in both systems but I think the welfare system wins overall.
I'd like to share some more information about how it works because I have spotted some misunderstandings in this thread but it will have to be later. I've written some assignments about this in the past maybe I should dig them up as I don't remember all the details
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| 86. |
23 Jan 2008 Wed 07:29 pm |
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Quoting libralady: Quoting Elisabeth: Unfortunately, the idea of paying high taxes for everyone to have healthcare in the US is not one that most American people can be convinced is a good one. Every American wants better healthcare BUT very few are willing to pay for it. |
But your taxes are not that high? Most people here pay 22% or if you earn over £33k it is 40% plus national insurance (on our wages). |
Actually our tax is more like %30 of our gross income in the USA, whatever you make. Add to that we pay premiums for private or company group plan health insurance. We get no tax credits for paying those premiums. Add to that the fact the rate goes up depending on age (no consideration of actual health is allowed, just age). For instance $100 per month for someone under 30 to over $500 for someone over 50. Benefits are also capped. Even if you have "good" health insurance there are co-pays and deductibles.
Most cases of bankruptcy are due to medical costs incurred by persons with health insurance. When you add that up, it seems to me your system is far superior.
"Medical Bills Leading Cause of Bankruptcy, Harvard Study Finds
February 3, 2005
Illness and medical bills caused half of the 1,458,000 personal bankruptcies in 2001, according to a study published by the journal Health Affairs.
Surprisingly, most of those bankrupted by illness had health insurance. More than three-quarters were insured at the start of the bankrupting illness. However, 38 percent had lost coverage at least temporarily by the time they filed for bankruptcy.
Most of the medical bankruptcy filers were middle class; 56 percent owned a home and the same number had attended college. In many cases, illness forced breadwinners to take time off from work -- losing income and job-based health insurance precisely when families needed it most."
Harvard Study
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| 87. |
23 Jan 2008 Wed 07:53 pm |
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Quoting alameda: Quoting libralady: Quoting Elisabeth: Unfortunately, the idea of paying high taxes for everyone to have healthcare in the US is not one that most American people can be convinced is a good one. Every American wants better healthcare BUT very few are willing to pay for it. |
But your taxes are not that high? Most people here pay 22% or if you earn over £33k it is 40% plus national insurance (on our wages). |
Actually our tax is more like %30 of our gross income in the USA, whatever you make. Add to that we pay premiums for private or company group plan health insurance. We get no tax credits for paying those premiums. Add to that the fact the rate goes up depending on age (no consideration of actual health is allowed, just age). For instance $100 per month for someone under 30 to over $500 for someone over 50. Benefits are also capped. Even if you have "good" health insurance there are co-pays and deductibles.
Most cases of bankruptcy are due to medical costs incurred by persons with health insurance. When you add that up, it seems to me your system is far superior.
"Medical Bills Leading Cause of Bankruptcy, Harvard Study Finds
February 3, 2005
Illness and medical bills caused half of the 1,458,000 personal bankruptcies in 2001, according to a study published by the journal Health Affairs.
Surprisingly, most of those bankrupted by illness had health insurance. More than three-quarters were insured at the start of the bankrupting illness. However, 38 percent had lost coverage at least temporarily by the time they filed for bankruptcy.
Most of the medical bankruptcy filers were middle class; 56 percent owned a home and the same number had attended college. In many cases, illness forced breadwinners to take time off from work -- losing income and job-based health insurance precisely when families needed it most."
Harvard Study |
Employer sponsored Health Insurance programs cannot charge an employee premiums based on age, this is called discrimination in the U.S. They can design their plan to incorporate several options based on family size. Typically single, employee + 1 and family. Family always being the highest premium. The annual premium is based on previous activity, your aggregrate stop loss, claims payed out etc. set by your employer. Most employers medical & dental are done on a pre-tax basis. Most plans have a maximum lifetime amount, 1 million.
I can understand that medical bills can cause a huge hardship on families and even can cause bankruptcy. However, physicians and hospitals accept payment plans because legally they cannot report non payment to a collection agency, if they are receiving any form of payment.
Now life insurance is a seperate benefit that is based on age and logically so.. maybe the case for private as well.
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| 88. |
23 Jan 2008 Wed 10:11 pm |
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Quoting teaschip1: ............Employer sponsored Health Insurance programs cannot charge an employee premiums based on age, this is called discrimination in the U.S. They can design their plan to incorporate several options based on family size. Typically single, employee + 1 and family. Family always being the highest premium. The annual premium is based on previous activity, your aggregrate stop loss, claims payed out etc. set by your employer. Most employers medical & dental are done on a pre-tax basis. Most plans have a maximum lifetime amount, 1 million.
I can understand that medical bills can cause a huge hardship on families and even can cause bankruptcy. However, physicians and hospitals accept payment plans because legally they cannot report non payment to a collection agency, if they are receiving any form of payment.
Now life insurance is a seperate benefit that is based on age and logically so.. maybe the case for private as well. |
That is simply not true teaschip1...I have seen my health plan premiums going up as my age increases....
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| 89. |
23 Jan 2008 Wed 10:28 pm |
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Quoting alameda: Quoting teaschip1: ............Employer sponsored Health Insurance programs cannot charge an employee premiums based on age, this is called discrimination in the U.S. They can design their plan to incorporate several options based on family size. Typically single, employee + 1 and family. Family always being the highest premium. The annual premium is based on previous activity, your aggregrate stop loss, claims payed out etc. set by your employer. Most employers medical & dental are done on a pre-tax basis. Most plans have a maximum lifetime amount, 1 million.
I can understand that medical bills can cause a huge hardship on families and even can cause bankruptcy. However, physicians and hospitals accept payment plans because legally they cannot report non payment to a collection agency, if they are receiving any form of payment.
Now life insurance is a seperate benefit that is based on age and logically so.. maybe the case for private as well. |
That is simply not true teaschip1...I have seen my health plan premiums going up as my age increases.... |
Is your Employer sponsored Health Insurance self funded or not? This could also explain why it's based on age.
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| 90. |
23 Jan 2008 Wed 11:41 pm |
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