Turkish Politics |
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Why most 'educated' Turks are more close-minded!!
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80. |
14 Jun 2008 Sat 03:43 am |
Quoting catwoman: Explain that more please. I'm really curious what you think his 'agenda', other then just saying what he thinks, is. |
Ask Mr.thehandsom , im sure he knows what im putting forward moderator . Im too lazy to find some articles to post here at the moment.
Quoting Daydreamer: Guys, you're free to disagree with him and anyone you wish in the forum, but accusing people of having secret agendas is simply ridiculous and weakens the message of your posts. |
Yeah i am free to disagree but i am not accusing anyone, i just voiced what i sense and it has nothing to do weakening the message of my posts.
Quoting Daydreamer: If Handsom's agenda is to corrupt Turkey's image then yours must be showing how wonderful, non-nationalistic, non-brainwashed, allowing everyone express their opinions in public your country is. |
, simple thinking, im not trying to show anything to anyone, i just try to response the posts here. Have u ever seen me starting a thread like u mentioned in this biased forum?
Quoting Daydreamer: What I gather from discussions like yours is that the fear and hatred towards 'the others' (those who dare to express their thoughts freely) is a proof of your nationalism. You just have to have enemies...How sad... |
Dont I express my thoughts freely? Ahh i forgot, im narrow-minded, here who says Kurds/PKK are freedom-fighters express their thoughts freely but when i say Kurds are nothing but new petrol guardians of Yankees then i became nationalist/racist. But in fact in my entire life i have no connection with the nationalists or ülkücü thats the ironic part . Also i have to add that it is impossible for an ordinary Turk become more patriot among you. And what i gather from the discussions like yours is that the fear and hatred towards the people who love their country even the girls here who has Turkish/Kurdish lovers. I have problems with the ones who think instead of Turks as they try to mention that they know everything better, arrogantly and i have problems with the domestics who are flatterers and who are ungratefuls.
Quoting thehandsom: The concept of 'foreign powers, dark forces, foreign elements, pressing of a button, secret agenda, seeds of discord etc' were invented long time ago in 70s and 80s.
*They are the ones trying to divide Turkey
*They are the ones made us lost the WWI when Germany lost
*They are the ones made Turks and Kurds enemy of each other while we were living peacefully.
*They caused the entire ermenian thing
*They are the ones who are trying to enter the unis with their turbans
*They are trying to convert our people to cristianity with those missionaries.
*They placed the entire left/right problem into Turkey years ago
*They are the people having a button somewhere in EU and USA and pressing on when Turkey does well.
*They have budgets and pay the enemy of Turks in other countries.
*They killed Ugur Mumcu, Hrant Dink etc
*They are behind the energy problem of Turkey and the death of labours in Tuzla Dockyard-It is a recent invention btw- |
This is one of the current trends which foreign admirer liberals began to voice in media during the past several years. They are taking lessons for this in Europe . A propaganda method to develop insensible, unconcerned people who are kept sleep with TV series or any kind of pursuit.
Quoting thehandsom: I am still expecting, somebody will come up with the idea that 'farting problem after eating too much kuru fasulye' is the result of 'dark forces' as well. |
, no it is the result of nationalism , well-leveled expression btw Mr.thehandsom.
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81. |
14 Jun 2008 Sat 03:51 am |
Quoting thehandsom: You seem to forget what we have done to Kurds/Armenians/Greeks and what we are still doing to the kurds which seems to the only crowded ethnic group. |
You again seem to forget what they have done to Turks, thehandsom .
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82. |
14 Jun 2008 Sat 03:51 am |
Quoting cynicmystic: Sure that many has disappeared.
What I would like to ask you is this.
In other places, such as North America, Western Europe and China, haven't people been dissappearing as well. Authoritarianism is everywhere, and criticisizing Turkey as if it is the only country in the worlds suffering from this is pointless.
How do you feel about the UK deriving 1/3 of its income from international arm sales, which eventually leads to war & oppression? Do I need to mention Guantanamo Bay? The Brazilian shot to death in the London subway, the Polish guy tasered to death by the Canadian airport police, or the numerous cases of police brutality from Europe or north America. There people going missing all over the world. Whenever you challenge or pose a risk to the established status-quo, you are eliminated.
Talking about these problems as if they are political issues that can be resolved with the right kind of legislation is not only annoying, but is naive.
If you live in a glass house, don't cast stones at your neighbour! The social issues you highlight are happening all over the world. So, don't single out Turkey as an example. All of our governments are equally involved in everything at the upper levels.
Perhaps it is about time to wake up...
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Sorry but there is nothing to wake up..
This is turkish language website and mainly the subjects are related to Turkey.
I think from time to time, the subjects you mentioned in your posts like Guantanama Bay , USA internal/foreign politics come up and we all comment including me.
I dont think Turkey is being singled out.
But not talking about 'what is wrong' is not negotiable in my terms.
They have to be talked about, they have to be critisized.
In the end, personally I believe that 'finding the wrongs' is the first but crucial step to make them right.
Without critisism nothing gets better!!
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83. |
14 Jun 2008 Sat 03:57 am |
Quoting armegon: Quoting thehandsom: You seem to forget what we have done to Kurds/Armenians/Greeks and what we are still doing to the kurds which seems to the only crowded ethnic group. |
You again seem to forget what they have done to Turks, thehandsom .
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Tell us then.. Go on..
Tell what Kurds have done to Turks.
So we all learn.
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84. |
14 Jun 2008 Sat 04:17 am |
Talk about what ever you like...
It is just that those things that you relate to Turkey are not unique to Turkey. The examples that you suggest as role models are suffering from the exact same problems.
That's what i meant by it is perhaps time to wake up...
The world has gone to "shits" my friend. There is no European model, or the American Dream in a world smeared with hypocrasy. Your examples serve no social purpose. You are just renaming a global epidemic.
Quoting thehandsom: Quoting cynicmystic: Sure that many has disappeared.
They have to be talked about, they have to be critisized.
In the end, personally I believe that 'finding the wrongs' is the first but crucial step to make them right.
Without critisism nothing gets better!!
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85. |
14 Jun 2008 Sat 04:29 am |
Quoting armegon:
Ask Mr.thehandsom , im sure he knows what im putting forward moderator . Im too lazy to find some articles to post here at the moment.
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I simple asked you a question about what you think my agenda is..
Can you answer? do you have an answer? can you possible have an answer?
Look.. This 'secret agenda' thing is not your idea..it is 'embeded' into your head by years and years of listening pathetic statements of the army generals and disfunctional politicans.
The sad thing is, you DONT EVEN REALISE IT.
Quote:
This is one of the current trends which foreign admirer liberals began to voice in media during the past several years. They are taking lessons for this in Europe . A propaganda method to develop insensible, unconcerned people who are kept sleep with TV series or any kind of pursuit.
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Now look above, you are unable take this 'foreign element' out of your brains. You have no answers without 'foreign hands or dark forces'.
What lessons do you think I am taking here?
who are they you think giving lessons?
what are they? be specific!!
This is pathetic man..
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86. |
14 Jun 2008 Sat 04:38 am |
Quoting cynicmystic: You ought to be kidding...
First, you post replies to people (that's me in this case) without even bothering to read what they have written (what I had written in this case.) Then, having realized how ridicuolous you must have sounded with your first post, you confess to not having read my post in the first place, go back to read it, and with your half-understanding, you still attempt to shove words down people's throats. Do you really expect people to take you seriously when you post responses without knowing what you are responding to, since you haven't bothered to read?
On the contrary to your comprehension, what my post shows is not dissidence against anyone who criticizes Turkey. I am under the impresion that you still haven't bothered to read the post.
Regarding your fine example of comparing Turkey to Russia, where dissidents disappear over night, I regret to say that I don't agree with that statement either. Anyone who has ever been to Russia & Turkey knows very well that Turkey has never been as oppressive as the Cold War Era Russia.
I also love the way you make all these phoney assumptions about how we have been taught to "hate" each other.
You sound like you have been taught to hate a lot more than we do. |
You said you weren't going to flirt with me, and what is this, eh?
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87. |
14 Jun 2008 Sat 04:40 am |
Quoting cynicmystic: Talk about what ever you like...
It is just that those things that you relate to Turkey are not unique to Turkey. The examples that you suggest as role models are suffering from the exact same problems.
That's what i meant by it is perhaps time to wake up...
The world has gone to "shits" my friend. There is no European model, or the American Dream in a world smeared with hypocrasy. Your examples serve no social purpose. You are just renaming a global epidemic.
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I am not sure the world has gone to shits will be a right statement.
I find it a bit unsophisticated.
Those type of conclusions should not be made by looking at past 5/10/15 years of the world.
You should learn to look at the events and the developments of the civilization from a wider angle and larger time scale.
This is just a phase which was triggered by 9/11.
It will pass.
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88. |
14 Jun 2008 Sat 05:02 am |
he is here
http://www.thewhitepath.com/archives/2004/01/about_mustafa_akyol.php
although he is an islamist, but I like his ideas when he is not talking about religion or 'intelligent desing'.
In a nut shell: He is a young guy (1972), breed of istanbul education, islamist, somehow worked in the usa for intelligent desing theory, clever, good knowledge of kurdish issue. I think he will produce many things in the coming years.
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89. |
14 Jun 2008 Sat 10:40 am |
Quoting armegon:
Yeah i am free to disagree but i am not accusing anyone, i just voiced what i sense and it has nothing to do weakening the message of my posts. |
Absolutely right about the former, and wrong about the latter. Perhaps you fail to notice that the whole idea of "they're here to get us" is a bit like warning people against the UFO. Everybody is there to get you - USA, UE, and Handsom with his Secret Agenda.
Quoting armegon:
, simple thinking, im not trying to show anything to anyone, i just try to response the posts here. Have u ever seen me starting a thread like u mentioned in this biased forum? |
No, you're not trying to show anything. Good point. You just come looking for conspirators. As for this forum being biased, I don't see how. Everybody is free to post what they like, how other members respond is everybody's individual business. As long as you don't get vulgar and rude, you may have any opinion you like. Biased forums allow only one-sided view, here you may speak what you like. In case you haven't noticed, there are many positive things written about Turkey here. You just have to get used to the fact that people have different opinions about your country's policies than you.
Quoting armegon:
And what i gather from the discussions like yours is that the fear and hatred towards the people who love their country even the girls here who has Turkish/Kurdish lovers. I have problems with the ones who think instead of Turks as they try to mention that they know everything better, arrogantly and i have problems with the domestics who are flatterers and who are ungratefuls. |
Now that's a bit of an overstatement, don't you think? Nobody here fears or hates those who love their country. I dearly love my homeland and I'm sure so do most of the users here. It is the paranoia and nationalism that we find ridiculous. Even joking about A La Turka toilets results in us being accused of being enemies of Turkey. Isn't that silly?
As for experts or those who arrogantly claim to know better. If people write about their conclusions based on some material they read or experiences they were through what makes their logic worse than yours? For me it's hard to understand Turkish justice if a person is banished for what he writes (not talking about whether he is right or wrong but merely about the fact that in 21st century somebody is banished for intellectual crimes), or when a person faces a trial for saying that she wouldn't like her son to die on war. Or when Turks say there's no problem with Kurds but Kurds say otherwise - well...somebody must be lying. If Kurds felt fine, PKK wouldn't stand a chance to exist.
Quoting armegon:
This is one of the current trends which foreign admirer liberals began to voice in media during the past several years. They are taking lessons for this in Europe . A propaganda method to develop insensible, unconcerned people who are kept sleep with TV series or any kind of pursuit. |
Liberal is wrong? National-militaristic is better? Sure, a police state has les problems, not because they don't exist, but because those who speak about them disappear. People are taught to think in line, work in line and act in line. No perverts like homosexuals, no ethnicity problems (as you either exterminate them or force to assimilate). Welfare of the country is better than the welfare of an individual. Oh, and there's always "THEM" that we need to take measures against. A war and enemies of the state. Right. That's the way. That's unacceptable for me as I've been there. And I don't want to go back. Whether it is German national socialism (ok, I haven't been there but my family experienced it) or Soviet socialism, they're the same. And I am sorry to say, Turkey in some aspects reminds me of that. It doesn't mean though that I don't see differences between Turkey and Germany or the Soviet Union.
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90. |
14 Jun 2008 Sat 10:57 am |
Quoting thehandsom: Quoting catwoman:
... and paranoid that handsom and his extraterrestial army will wipe Turkey off the map, establish Handsomye instead and elevate himself to the ranks of Ataturk/god, the father of all Handsoms. You will have to sing hymns every morning to praise his greateness and your foremost duty will be to defend Handsomye from every foreigner, either with words or your own blood. |
Once I am in that position , do you think DD will answer all my pms and I will get an msn invitation from her? |
Why of course, there's nothing I like more about men than ambition! Oh and a big........bank account But here one means the other Become a Handsomurk and my MSN is yours
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