Is it possible to be a true religious believer and at the same time enjoy good relations with people of other faiths or none? Moreover, can you remain open to new ideas and new ways of thinking?

The Turkish cleric Fethullah Gülen, winner of our intellectuals poll, is the modern face of the Sufi Ottoman tradition. At home with globalisation and PR, and fascinated by science, he also influences Turkish politics through links to the ruling AK party.(Ehsan Masood)


Fethullah Gülen, a 67-year-old Turkish Sufi cleric, author and theoretician, has dedicated much of his life to resolving these questions. From his sick bed in exile just outside Philadelphia, he leads a global movement inspired by Sufi ideas. He promotes an open brand of Islamic thought and, like the Iran-born Islamic philosophers Seyyed Hossein Nasr and Abdolkarim Soroush, he is preoccupied with modern science (he publishes an English-language science magazine called the Fountain). But Gülen, unlike these western-trained Iranians, has spent most of his life within the religious and political institutions of Turkey, a Muslim country, albeit a secular one since the foundation of Mustafa Kemal Atatürk’s republic after the first world war.

Unusually for a pious intellectual, he and his movement are at home with technology, markets and multinational business, and especially with modern communications and public relations—which, like a modern televangelist, he uses to attract converts. Like a western celebrity, he carefully manages his public exposure—mostly by restricting interviews to those he can trust.

Many of his converts come from Turkey’s aspirational middle class. As religious freedom comes, falteringly, to Turkey, Gülen reassures his followers that they can combine the statist-nationalist beliefs of Atatürk’s republic with a traditional but flexible Islamic faith. He also reconnects the provincial middle class with the Ottoman traditions that had been caricatured as theocratic by Atatürk and his “Kemalist” heirs. Oliver Leaman, a leading scholar of Islamic philosophy, says that Gülen’s ideas are a product of Turkish history, especially the end of the Ottoman empire and the birth of the republic. He calls Gülen’s approach “Islam-lite.”

http://www.prospect-magazine.co.uk/article_details.php?search_term=G%C3%BClen&id=10263

I can't wait to buy one of his books. Thanks Roswitha..good article.

i think Mevlana said the most trues be4 ages by ''come whoever or whatever you are'',and Fetullah Gülen is one of good follower of him today

Ayhan and Teaschip, thank you both for your positive comments.

and i believe Fetullah Gülen and all others who thinking like him trying to keep alive http://www.revver.com/video/587818/seven-advice-of-mevlana/ on today by their methods..So thats more then to be İslam or Muslim..

I personally believe Fethulla Gülen is a sort of dangerous man..

Buy one of his books to see for yourself (or just rent it, dont support that man financially ): he speaks to 'us infidels' as if we are children that need to be raised, and the book drips off sentences that actually try to say 'oh please convert'. I read his book on the basics of islamic faith. His 'proof' for the existnece of Allah is just hilarious. Even I, an infidel, can do better than that! Reading his book made me believe even less

Ayhan, thanks for your encouragement! Believe me, I get hit over the head alot by some others. Have a good day!

Ayhan, wow, I love my husband, but in my next life I would chase after you for my next husband.

why we don't dreaming a place which wolfs and lambs living side by side in peace?or why we close our eyes to grey while always saying black or white?

Amaaannnn

Gulen is so dangerous, even the mention of his name causes strife . What did I tell you Rosewitha?

Fethullah Gülen, Islamist, Acquitted

Fethullah Gülen, a famous Islamist leader and source of inspiration for Turkey’s Islamists (parties and individuals), has been acquitted in a final ruling of the General Council of the Supreme Court of Appeals of Turkey yesterday.

He was ’sued over allegations that he established an illegal organization to change the secular structure of Turkey and found a state based on religious rules instead. Gülen was sued under the anti-terrorism law. Ankara’s 11th Court for Serious Crimes decided in favor of Gülen’s acquittal and the ninth branch of the Supreme Court of Appeals confirmed the decision.’

This means that he can travel to Turkey whenever he wants to. He’s free to go where he wants to go, he’s free to meet with people he wants to meet.

What can be said about Gülen (ignore this article at Wikipedia; it’s clearly written by supporters of the man)? Well, most Turks will know about him. Most Turks know who he is, and what he stands for. Most secular Turks both despise and fear him.

He has influenced a lot of people, including politicians. His agenda is clear; he wants to bring Islam back into politics. He wants to Islamize the government. (...)
PoliGazette June 25 2008
By Michael van der Galien

My, oh, my! I have read all the back and forth about Mr. F. Guelen. He seems to excite passions one way or the other. From a religious view point, one can either accept his teachings or not. That's simple. There are plenty of Christians and other religious types traipsing around the world trying to sell their brand of religious life.

From a political viewpoint it is a cheap shot to characterize him as "dangerous" without supporting that accusation with very specific facts and evidence. I see him as a moderate - one who tries to reconcile Islamic Culture with modernity. For those who insist that his approach is some kind of a "trick", I like to see your proof of that.

There always have been and always will be deep differences between all sorts of people concerning serious subjects like religion, culture, and politics. The key to a stable society is that these differences be expressed in an orderly way, e.g. in democratic processes. The alternative is violence and anarchy - which noone claims Guelen promotes.

click to go

One of his emotional exploitation seances.

The brainwashed people there just make me scared, they look like ready to do whatever.



(He gets serious and normal the moment he stops crying, what a show )

Thanks Mltm for posting this. I had never hear him speak, only read. I hate this kind of behavior!!!! It is scary! And I really don't get how people can fall for his empty words.

TOO GOOD TO BE TRUE?
Gülen´s sudden emergence on the political scene has triggered much controversy among secular intellectuals, a considerable number of whom suspect him of using different tactics to reach the same goal as the Islamists. They worry that behind his benign facade, Gülen hides ambitions to turn the country into an Iranian-style Islamic state. The insecurity and intolerance of some secularists causes them to accuse Gülen´s community of being the enemy of the Turkish republic. They also worry that secularist parties will privilege Gülen in exchange for his promises not to endorse Refah. Rusen Cakır, author of a book on the rise of Islam in Turkey, finds that "The [secular] parties are promoting him as an alternative to Welfare. They´re using their enemy´s weapon against their enemy." Another expert on Islamists, Iskender Savaşır, made similar remarks saying, "I cannot say that Fethullah Hoca is not collaborating with the state." A "radical socialist" weekly whose sometimes sensationalist and unreliable allegations were used by the Turkish military, claims that the Gülen group "acquired financial support from the state, particularly from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs" and points to former prime minister Tansu Çiller having transferred "large sums from her ministry´s secret budget" to his schools, seeing this as "one of the reasons for the close relations he has with her."

At the same time, Gülen has the support from well-known liberal intellectuals (such as the journalists Mehmet Altan, Mehmet Barlas, Mehmet Ali Birand, and Cengiz Çandar) who argue that the solution to Turkey´s problems depends on reaching a consensus and like the "soft" face of Islam he presents. Birand, for example, recently argued that Gülen has original ideas and that all segments of Turkish society—implying the military—should pay attention to this vision.31 Gülen´s critical stance toward Refah won him support from nationalist-conservative intellectuals (like Altemur Kılıç and Nazli Ilıcak). As a symbol of this support, Gülen´s Turkish Journalists and Writers Foundation hosted an iftar meal in February 1996, at which about a thousand distinguished politicians, businessmen, artists, and intellectuals turned up.
http://www.meforum.org/article/404

I don´t understand why people insult and blame a person without any proof but with some imaginary happenings which, I think, never going to happen.

I notice that some people here reveal apparent hostility against Islam and Islamic thoughts showing it like a ghost threatening people´s lives. But this is not true, Islam is not dangerous, it is not harmful. Why are you afraid of Islamic thoughts being spread in Turkey or wherever? Islam doesn´t force anybody to believe or to do what they don´t want to do. I´ve read the article sent by Roswitha www.meforum.org/article/404 that talks about Gülen and his life and I found that he is not racial, or bigot, or dangerous. Instead, he is moderate and every Muslim has the right to support him or not.

can smbdy tell me the true definition of a secular state// from my understanding i dunno if its right or wrong but is it a state that doesn´t mix religion with politics??????i think every where in the world is except like Saudi Arabia and those parts like in Egypt we don´t call ourselves a secular state and i don´t see how we mix politics with religion in anyway at all but were not so ´hot headed´ about it i mean if smbdy comes and talks about religion in turkey hes suddenly a terrorist or an anti kemalist and why cant he be a modern thinker im a muslim my dad´s modern he´s a pharmacology professor in america and he always talks about politics and hes a Muslim is it so hard to piece the 2 together???And anybody whose a Muslim doesnt go preaching ppl around everybody has the right to be and do whatever they want and Islam doesn´t force everybody to embrace it the exact opposite!!so i wonder if i went to turkey would i be a threat to the state or smthg???Smbdy plzz explain!!

thank u

 +1

Zizoo - it´s not that people criticise Islam as a religion of an individual. It is more how Islam is realised by certain groups/countries that worries and scares us. I, like many other users on the site, believe people are free to believe or not anything and worship it by any means provided that it is not harmful to other people. What I strongly object to is policy where you cannot convert to other religion because you´ll be killed, where you are socially expected to obey others only because of their gender and where you´re led to believe that blowing yourself up killing innocent people will grant you heaven.

I agree with you 99%. But also, what would be wrong with criticizing Islam as a religion? Or any other religion for that matter? Those are social ideologies and I think they have to be subject to criticism unless we all want to be stuck in the mentality and practices of the Middle Ages. I can respect somebody´s right to believe what they want if those believes don´t cause harm to others, but I don´t have to respect dogmas and beliefs if I feel they are backward, ridiculous, irrational, etc. How did we ever agree that religions are immune to any criticism? Why? Nobody cares if political views are criticised, do they? Nobody worries about subjecting other -isms to criticism. I think it´s time to stop protecting religions from criticism and it´s time to look at them objectively and question their tenets.

Well to follow on I agree with you 95%!  My only point being that there is a big difference between criticising someone´s religious beliefs and someone´s politics!!!  You CAN cause great offence because religion is a deeply spiritual, personal belief.  I am sure even you make concessions to religion at times - would you walk into a mosque wearing inappropriate clothing?  Would you walk into a Church shouting and swearing while people are praying?

However, what I can´t stand about most religions is the hypocrisy - and I think we have every right to criticise that.  Religion is personal, but if someone chooses to use it for oneupmanship, to dominate or intimidate others or demands respect for one part of their religion, while they do not follow ALL parts, then I believe we have a right to comment.

I will reduce the agreement value abit lower..

In the end, all religions were invented to dominate the masses..

I´ll disagree, but mainly in semantics. When I talk about religion, I´m referring to the whole system of dogmas, tenets, holy books, practices, the institution of it all and I feel that aspect of religion should not be immune to evaluation. To me religion is different from faith - I differentiate it from somebody´s personal beliefs (which usually are quite different from the "official" religion, as we know people pick and choose whatever fits their needs, most don´t follow their religions to a "t") and I agree it can be deeply spiritual, personal, etc. I´m not criticizing that. One´s personal relationship with the "higher power" whatever that is, is none of my business. And yes, I do make concessions, I wouldn´t disrespect mosques and churches, and my goal is not to offend people, but to get to the point where it´s ok to say, hey, let´s look at this, maybe there´s something wrong with this or that dogma here.

Or to reduce fear of the unknown ...

 Never thought of a religion as being invented.

 A couple of years ago I would have said "yes".  Since joining this website I have changed my opinion and say "generally, no it is not possible".

As an example, there is a strange view from Turks that the EU is "Christian" (when in fact, although we have "official religion" most northern europeans don´t give religion much thought at all would probably describe themselves as agnostic or atheist!!).  The perception of many Turks is that "we don´t like Turkey because they are muslim (!).  I think they give us too much credit for deep thought and caring about Turkey!!!  I am quite sure if you asked most UK citizens what religion Turkish people are, the majority would not have a clue!

In addition, most UK tourists I know who travel to countries with different faiths, are very interested in learning about that faith and their culture.  Many people I know come back from India, the Maldives, Japan etc. with a new understanding and respect of the faith of the country they visited.  This simply WOULD NEVER HAPPEN if a muslim visited a country who had a different religion - by the very nature of it´s "rules".

Therefore, going back to the original question quoted above, it is not possible for a "true religious believer to enjoy good relations with other people or other faiths or none" because in their eyes the world is divided into believers and non-believers of their faith and they assume non-believers of their faith are enemies.

(Tami - this post is dedicated to YOU! )

 I am muslim and it is always fascinating me, the culture and their customs in where i visit.

And this is like this with the many people i have known. And they are muslims

How do you like generalizing this much?

Yes it is true that in europa there are some people who looks like a weirdo to a muslim. And it was your politician in Europa that stated, EU is a christian community. It is in the arcihieves...

 A couple of years ago I would have said "yes".  Since joining this website I have changed my opinion and say "generally, no it is not possible".

As an example, there is a strange view from Turks that the EU is "Christian" (when in fact, although we have "official religion" most northern europeans don´t give religion much thought at all would probably describe themselves as agnostic or atheist!!).  The perception of many Turks is that "we don´t like Turkey because they are muslim (!).  I think they give us too much credit for deep thought and caring about Turkey!!!  I am quite sure if you asked most UK citizens what religion Turkish people are, the majority would not have a clue!

In addition, most UK tourists I know who travel to countries with different faiths, are very interested in learning about that faith and their culture.  Many people I know come back from India, the Maldives, Japan etc. with a new understanding and respect of the faith of the country they visited.  This simply WOULD NEVER HAPPEN if a muslim visited a country who had a different religion - by the very nature of it´s "rules".

Therefore, going back to the original question quoted above, it is not possible for a "true religious believer to enjoy good relations with other people or other faiths or none" because in their eyes the world is divided into believers and non-believers of their faith and they assume non-believers of their faith are enemies.

This time I am extending my portion of agreement to 95% AE (5% is just incase )

But I think xenephobia coming from Turks should be treated more differently than the one coming from  religious  beleivers as the first one very much related to other non religious factors such as education, memories of WWI etc.

But, in the end, all religions and religious people believe that theirs is devine and so they are more devine than the others..So, a true believer  would NOT enjoy good relations with other people from other faiths..

And also as far as UK population is concerned, I think more than 30% publicly declare that they dont believe in any religions, more than 80% believe in evolution.

Considering there are not much religion problems in the UK and Britons are quite interested in (and very tolerant to) other religions, we can conclude that ´religions are playing a negative role for tolerance´ (or you can say that non-believers are more tolerant to others than religious people)

 Forgive me for generalising, but we are being told these things on THIS site by Turks - should I not believe them?

 Ouh is this a first?  Well I will also make a first and say I agree with your post 98% (I deducted 2% just because you are a dudu)

 You should consider the fact that why are they telling those things? As turkey has extremists? Europa also has the same!

and you shouldnt close your ears and eyes to the comment made by the politician of yours: "EU is a christian community."

I had a hard discussion with many Austrians here about Turkey and Turkish people. For simply some groups here are showing the not correct face of Turkish culture. This never means that Turkey is like that. I have seen many people here with in a very racists and wrong behaviours but i never comment as they are like this and this...

At first you should calm down the hatred in your heart and mind, i could recommend.

Ich grusse sie!

I have been undergoing penance for a while ..

Give me my 2%!!

 I do shut my mind to such illogical comments - we have a huge population of muslims in the EU so that comment is wrong.

If I were to believe governments as "general thought" in a country, then I would believe that Turkey supported Israel in the Gaza conflict!!

Hate in my heart?  I have no such hate - you need to be religious to have that!

In principle I agree with you Aenigma, however on my fairly recent reunion with a  friend who happens to be an employee of the ´EU apparatus´ we had an innocent debate about whether or not Turkey will ever be considered to be incorporated into EU. And the answer was: ´There is a huge cultural and religious divide between EU and Turkey and EU is trying to form a block of countries based on many similar historical, cultural, religious and political values, so ultimately Turkey would not fit into that pattern. But this will be solved by some sort of a special commercial agreement.´

Is it not Europe that is at fault for the division??

 I was talking about the general populus - not EU governments.  Yes of course I can understand anger at our governments.  It is actually ridiculous to say there is a huge cultural and religious divide - as I said we have a huge population of muslims, hindus etc. in the EU. 

I think it is not religion what make people hate eacother.Our identities divide us and make us hate eachother. As a Turkish, we are supposed to hate Grek or whatever, as a muslim we are supposed to hate atheist, as a fenerbahce fan i am supposed to hate Galatasaray, as a Ýstanbulian i am supposed to hate Ankara, as a kurdish i am supposed to hate Turkish nationalists ..... i am very sure that if we didnt have religions we would still  have many other reasons to hate eachother. to blame religions for causing so much hate is ignoring human nature. we just want to have an identity and hate the "others". sad but true.

 This sounds completely reasonable to me

I think a lot of human beings mistake ´identity´ with ´loyalty´, but we always tend to forget acceptance or respect or tolerance. Sadly, not many religious leaders, politicians or football club owners refer to those terms...

If you think you are respectful and tolerant, try arguing with Tami...he will turn you into a fire breathing patriot in 60 seconds!

Take your point Aenigma. Depends if Tami is accepting, respectful or tolerant himself... only this way I am willing to find common grounds for a discussion

 Thats why you always nagging huh? You dont have any hate in your heart... you have a great hate and its obvious to be seen!

And politicals shows more about general thoughts! Because the society is electing them, am i wrong? i dont think so.

In these type of conversations and discussions you will never accept the idea from other perspective... because you are closed to them and you will fight till you make the others accept your point...

 +1

couldnt agree more. thanks

I don´t think she is fighting, do you really think that? She is merely expressing her opinion and so are you. I don´t see anywhere in her words she is trying to make you or anyone believe what she believes ....

But perhaps she doesn´t like ´dudus´ just like I don´t  (this is a joke by the way, not a fight)

 Eh?  What is this?  Some kind of PT style psychoanalysis?

Ahh ok, so I should accept that Turkey supporting Israel and US is the general thought of Turkey?  You agree all with Erdogan and everything he does?

- I think you and Tami are better taking this advice yourselves!

 Thank you theBlonde - you are right.  Unfortunately Sui prefers to see "hate in my heart"

 As I said it before You are (tamikidakika) one of the most stupid person I have ever seen in my whole life 

There are some stupid persons like tamikidakika in turkey. They always accuse religious people of terrorism. They are small-minded. I want to ask them that what kind of terrosist action you have witnessed in these people´s action. To accuse is very easy.

They do not have any religious idea of notion of God or Faith.

They do not like Muslim Christian or Jewish people. They want every one must think as they think.