Imagine someone bad, very very bad, with no heart and brain. And assume that this person made a big, very very big, mistake, and comitted a severe, very very severe, sin. Assume he killed a human or many humans or invaded a woman or committed a genocide. Still assume he is punished in a prison as much as he deserved, and afterwards felt guilty, deeply regreted for what he did, and has suffered a great deal, felt twinge of conscience, and begged in order to be forgiven and asked people for mercy. Assume you are one of his victims or the only victim.

The questions are, would you forgive him? How would you act toward him? How would you behave him? What would you think about him? Would you detest him? Would you keep being angry with him?

Hmm, that's a hard one to answer. I believe in capital punishment, but I also know how to forgive. Are we talking about the devil here?

Thank you, teaschip. He had no right to do the "badness" in question to person(s). This is so obvious! But do you have right for capital punishment?

And yes, we are talking about, even, the devil of the devil here.

I don't believe in capital punishment- but I would struggle much with forgiveness. It is natural to feel deep hate and pain when a crime is committed against you, but hate is a bond. A way not to let go and move on with your life. Forgiveness, I believe, is the only true answer.

Easy to say, but I think much harder to live by...

Dear teaschip,

Actually it is me who am sorry. The tone of my reply must have given you a wrong impression. (It is not that I didn't like your response). Again, I thank you for expressing your opinion.

I do understand your reasonings, probably I, too, would think in the same way if I were in place of you. It is very hard to give an reasonable and commomsensical answer about any of the cases we mentioned; so I can't say anything unless "a cold blooded killer took the life of" my "child or family member". Would I forgive the killer? I (would) tend to forgive them; it is so easy, though, to make such remarks- I know this. But did you watch the movie "A Clockwork Orange" by Kubrick? There is Alex there who invades wife of a writer and make him disabled just for fun. If you were the writer, would you forgive Alex? See, he forgives Alex, despite all. Even helps him afterwards.

Suppose, I killed your son or invaded you sexually. Still suppose that I am punished enough, being in prison for my crime. Suppose I was cured and became a very good person, suffering enough, feeling pain enough, feeling twinge of conscience enough, regretting enough. And suppose that I beg you to forgive me. What would you do to or think about me? Would you forgive me?

I have seen victims forgive a sexual perpetrator before. Sometimes in a healthy way, sometimes not. I am a therapist and work with these sorts of cases. There is a whole method of how to admit what you did and not ask forgiveness. If you ask for forgiveness from a victim it is unfair, again you want something from them for yourself. Maybe they are not ready to forgive you yet. Forgiveness/being forgiven is a gift, not something one deserves. If they are not ready, then you have victimized them again. You said a 'twinge of conscience'...I think it takes a bit more than that. Your question is odd. If you really have this problem you need professional help, not a Turkish language forum. Maybe you are just asking a question just to ask (I hope). If I personally would forgive someone? I don't know if I could ever forgive someone.

Pagliaccio,
Judging from the last days of posts from you, I think Badiadancer is right....if you need to talk about something, this is not the proper forum. I think this, along with several other of your posts are just poor taste. What could you possibly have to gain accept self indulgence for either a percieved or true wrong doing on your part?

badiabdancer and Elisabeth,

Thank you both. I understand you well. You say forgiveness is a gift that someone can give, not something that one deserves (which I do agree with you here). I didn't mean I have deserved forgiveness. I want to ask and find out what will be my situation? Will I remain the same person, namely an animal, a bastard, an asshole, a pervert, and a disgust creature for people forever? Will I carry, for example, the label "PERVERT" or "ANIMAL" on my forehead forever? Will and should I suffer forever for my sin? Even if I got my head screwed on right, vowed not to commit the same sin again, became REALLY good person and so on, still will I be regarded as a "PERVERT" or a "BASTARD" by people forever?

Do you want to tell us what crime you exactely committed? I think a better explanation from you is necessary in order for us to provide feedback.