Turkey |
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Families in Turkey accused of forcing young women to take their own lives
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| 1. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 03:12 pm |
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http://www.guardian.co.uk/turkey/story/0,,2154288,00.html
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| 2. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 03:33 pm |
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thats really the one of most sad reality some parts of Turkey,and noone can't deny that woman rights not enough in our country about the still some tough traditions,and pity women no have name still in soicety on the some areas of Turkey..still deep social,economical and educational problems in Turkey and pity mostly women and kids effecting with this problems more then men,and i hope things become better by the efforts of we men...Thx for shared Rose..
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| 3. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:00 pm |
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but i thino women have the problems on all over the word with the different shapes,so i think noone of country not all innocent about that....
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| 4. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:05 pm |
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Quoting MrX67: but i thino women have the problems on all over the word with the different shapes,so i think noone of country not all innocent about that.... |
Yes yes I agree, its important that we just do nothing and accept no blame for anything because horrible things happen everywhere, so why worry? The main thing is for everyone to think we have no problems in our country, right?....
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| 5. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:07 pm |
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Quoting AEnigma III: Quoting MrX67: but i thino women have the problems on all over the word with the different shapes,so i think noone of country not all innocent about that.... |
Yes yes I agree, its important that we just do nothing and accept no blame for anything because horrible things happen everywhere, so why worry? The main thing is for everyone to think we have no problems in our country, right?.... |
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| 6. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:08 pm |
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OMG! I read that article. Very scary and I thought about going to east turkey too  . It's stuff like this that worries me plus pkk threat. Well my family will be in US. You don't think that the families there will force a tourist to kill herself or kill her if she wears jeans or a short sleeve shirt?
I want to live in Van for 3-6 months but everyone thinks I'm crazy, stupid, and foolish for leaving Hawaii to go to such a place.
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| 7. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:12 pm |
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Quoting AEnigma III: Quoting MrX67: but i thino women have the problems on all over the word with the different shapes,so i think noone of country not all innocent about that.... |
Yes yes I agree, its important that we just do nothing and accept no blame for anything because horrible things happen everywhere, so why worry? The main thing is for everyone to think we have no problems in our country, right?.... |
I totally agree with you Aenigma...we've seen this attitude before on this site! Seems a bit like a broken record!
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| 8. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:13 pm |
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Quoting kat007:
I want to live in Van for 3-6 months but everyone thinks I'm crazy, stupid, and foolish for leaving Hawaii to go to such a place.
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hey hey Van is my hometown..it is a beautiful place you can go there but you had better live in the cenral Van Villages are too traditional for you
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| 9. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:15 pm |
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Quoting kat007: OMG! I read that article. Very scary and I thought about going to east turkey too . It's stuff like this that worries me plus pkk threat. Well my family will be in US. You don't think that the families there will force a tourist to kill herself or kill her if she wears jeans or a short sleeve shirt?
I want to live in Van for 3-6 months but everyone thinks I'm crazy, stupid, and foolish for leaving Hawaii to go to such a place.
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| 10. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:19 pm |
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Quoting MrX67: Quoting kat007: OMG! I read that article. Very scary and I thought about going to east turkey too . It's stuff like this that worries me plus pkk threat. Well my family will be in US. You don't think that the families there will force a tourist to kill herself or kill her if she wears jeans or a short sleeve shirt?
I want to live in Van for 3-6 months but everyone thinks I'm crazy, stupid, and foolish for leaving Hawaii to go to such a place.
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yes.. the first time i agree with MrX67 only thing you wont like in van is that people there are even more religious..but but there is a university in Van.therefore people are used to see modern women in the town..dont worry so much you wont be killed
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| 11. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:23 pm |
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Quoting ciko: yes.. the first time i agree with MrX67 |
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| 12. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:25 pm |
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Quoting ciko: Quoting MrX67: Quoting kat007: OMG! I read that article. Very scary and I thought about going to east turkey too . It's stuff like this that worries me plus pkk threat. Well my family will be in US. You don't think that the families there will force a tourist to kill herself or kill her if she wears jeans or a short sleeve shirt?
I want to live in Van for 3-6 months but everyone thinks I'm crazy, stupid, and foolish for leaving Hawaii to go to such a place.
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yes.. the first time i agree with MrX67 only thing you wont like in van is that people there are even more religious..but but there is a university in Van.therefore people are used to see modern women in the town..dont worry so much you wont be killed |
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| 14. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:30 pm |
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more education (quality education)>>>more tolerance>>>more understanding>>>>more rights>>>>more equality>>>more peace>>>more happiness
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| 15. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:34 pm |
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Quoting MrX67: more education (quality education)>>>more tolerance>>>more understanding>>>>more rights>>>>more equality>>>more peace>>>more happiness |
you must be cyber version of jesus..you always sound so peaceful and tolerant. i wonder if you are really like this in real life
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| 16. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:34 pm |
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Quoting MrX67: more education (quality education)>>>more tolerance>>>more understanding>>>>more rights>>>>more equality>>>more peace>>>more happiness |
Agree a million times.
For years governments haven't invested enough in parts of the country, and the girls are paying the price for this.
We need to realise Turkey is more than Istanbul+Ankara+Izmir+Aegean coast resorts + Mediterranean coast resorts when it comes to investing in hospitals, roads, schools, jobs etc.
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| 17. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:36 pm |
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Quoting MarioninTurkey: Quoting MrX67: more education (quality education)>>>more tolerance>>>more understanding>>>>more rights>>>>more equality>>>more peace>>>more happiness |
Agree a million times.
For years governments haven't invested enough in parts of the country, and the girls are paying the price for this.
We need to realise Turkey is more than Istanbul+Ankara+Izmir+Aegean coast resorts + Mediterranean coast resorts when it comes to investing in hospitals, roads, schools, jobs etc. |
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| 18. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:39 pm |
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Don't even get me started on clothes for east turkey. I'm mostly a jeans/blouse kind of girl but I bought 2 weeks of long dresses for my trip. His family can't accuse me of not being respectful.
Anyways, they are really religious and traditional... even minor issues give me stress/headaches.
I think I'll only stay in the east for 2 weeks and spend 10 weeks in west turkey hehe.  (That's a tempting idea.)
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| 19. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:44 pm |
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Quoting MarioninTurkey: Quoting MrX67: more education (quality education)>>>more tolerance>>>more understanding>>>>more rights>>>>more equality>>>more peace>>>more happiness |
Agree a million times.
For years governments haven't invested enough in parts of the country, and the girls are paying the price for this.
We need to realise Turkey is more than Istanbul+Ankara+Izmir+Aegean coast resorts + Mediterranean coast resorts when it comes to investing in hospitals, roads, schools, jobs etc. |
+10000 I agree!
But I also think that investors/companies/businesses should try to invest in the east and create some jobs and better economies there. That way people in the east can get educated and find decent work. It also wouldn't hurt for some philanthropists to open up some private schools for women or charity organizations (orphanages, women's shelters, support groups, small business admin. office, etc.)
If government works in partnership with these private companies/individuals changes can happen quicker.
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| 20. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:44 pm |
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pity goverments never give enough attnetion to east of Turkey ,they prefered to govern there with feudal rules and feudal powers while west of Turkey meeting and facing with more modern govern ways,so why east and west of Turkey as the step kids of a great family during of ages,so why inncoent Turkish people still paying price still sadly about to mistakes of real responsibles of this deep problems
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| 21. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:46 pm |
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Quoting ciko: Quoting MrX67: more education (quality education)>>>more tolerance>>>more understanding>>>>more rights>>>>more equality>>>more peace>>>more happiness |
you must be cyber version of jesus..you always sound so peaceful and tolerant. i wonder if you are really like this in real life |
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| 22. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:50 pm |
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Sure governments have to do something and they must.
But I think first, the people in the East must NOT accept their living conditions and should not tolerate that kind of life. They need to do something about it and get together to create positive changes. People think that "oh I'm just one person and I can't do anything" but when one person with vision and goals step forward, a crowd will follow. And they can move mountains (so these changes will seem small). It may take 15-50 years but at least the next generation of women and children won't have to go through these kinds of things.
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| 23. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 04:53 pm |
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Quoting kat007: Sure governments have to do something and they must.
But I think first, the people in the East must NOT accept their living conditions and should not tolerate that kind of life. They need to do something about it and get together to create positive changes. People think that "oh I'm just one person and I can't do anything" but when one person with vision and goals step forward, a crowd will follow. And they can move mountains (so these changes will seem small). It may take 15-50 years but at least the next generation of women and children won't have to go through these kinds of things. |
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| 24. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 05:01 pm |
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if you mean resorts by west of Turkey..yes you are right but if you have seen towns which native people live in west you would see that they are not so different to east. you cant not see any big factory from Bursa to Izmır.. am i wrong? you can not see any highway. it is not only about education and money. unemployment rate in west is not less than it is in the east.
problem in the east is about traditions and feudal system as mrx67 said. i dont know what the solution is. current government does everything they can do..like reducing the taxes for companies that invest in the east but as you know Turkey is not a communist counrty and it doesnt seem logical to me to expect government to invest in the east when most of factories that used to belong to the government are being privatized!
i wish i knew the solution
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| 25. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 05:05 pm |
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Quoting ciko: if you mean resorts by west of Turkey..yes you are right but if you have seen towns which native people live in west you would see that they are not so different to east. you cant not see any big factory from Bursa to Izmır.. am i wrong? you can not see any highway. it is not only about education and money. unemployment rate in west is not less than it is in the east.
problem in the east is about traditions and feudal system as mrx67 said. i dont know what the solution is. current government does everything they can do..like reducing the taxes for companies that invest in the east but as you know Turkey is not a communist counrty and it doesnt seem logical to me to expect government to invest in the east when most of factories that used to belong to the government are being privatized!
i wish i knew the solution |
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| 26. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 05:07 pm |
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Quoting MrX67: Quoting ciko: Quoting MrX67: more education (quality education)>>>more tolerance>>>more understanding>>>>more rights>>>>more equality>>>more peace>>>more happiness |
you must be cyber version of jesus..you always sound so peaceful and tolerant. i wonder if you are really like this in real life |
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no no it is not bad..keep dreaming whatever you want
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| 27. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 05:30 pm |
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Quote: But I also think that investors/companies/businesses should try to invest in the east and create some jobs and better economies there. That way people in the east can get educated and find decent work. It also wouldn't hurt for some philanthropists to open up some private schools for women or charity organizations (orphanages, women's shelters, support groups, small business admin. office, etc.)
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Kat007 - the problem with what you mention above is that when the media outside Turkey, i.e. BBC/CNN etc... insist on portaying Turkey with images of covered up women, and stories like this - who would want to come here and invest. It is about time, that the many good points of this country were used to lure in investors.
Everytime, you see any news aboout Turkey, it is always accompanied with an image of a covered up woman. I am NOT against the headscarf, I just wish it was not the only way used to potray this country - do you know what I mean ??? :-S
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| 28. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 05:34 pm |
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our country has enough power to be a good sample to west and to east with the deep historical and cultural wealth and diversities,but pity our people and goverments never aware of that,and pity we don't know how to move our advantages for the betters...
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| 29. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 05:39 pm |
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Quoting Cacık: Quote: But I also think that investors/companies/businesses should try to invest in the east and create some jobs and better economies there. That way people in the east can get educated and find decent work. It also wouldn't hurt for some philanthropists to open up some private schools for women or charity organizations (orphanages, women's shelters, support groups, small business admin. office, etc.)
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Kat007 - the problem with what you mention above is that when the media outside Turkey, i.e. BBC/CNN etc... insist on portaying Turkey with images of covered up women, and stories like this - who would want to come here and invest. It is about time, that the many good points of this country were used to lure in investors.
Everytime, you see any news aboout Turkey, it is always accompanied with an image of a covered up woman. I am NOT against the headscarf, I just wish it was not the only way used to potray this country - do you know what I mean ??? :-S |
Again outside media and foreigners are guilty and i dont agree with you about BBC.. you can find lots of articles about modern Turkey..and most of English newspapers indicate Turkey as a modern country who can lead islam world for being more democratic.
i think we should stop blaming others and start to criticize ourselves!!
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| 30. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 05:40 pm |
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Quote: pity we don't know how to move our advantages for the betters... |
The only reason we don't know is because there isn't enough education 
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| 31. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 05:46 pm |
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Quote: Again outside media and foreigners are guilty and i dont agree with you about BBC.. you can find lots of articles about modern Turkey..and most of English newspapers indicate Turkey as a modern country who can lead islam world for being more democratic.
i think we should stop blaming others and start to criticize ourselves!! |
Oh Ciko - don't get me wrong, I don't only blame outside media and foriegners for everything - no not at all and you have a point about looking in the mirror at ourselves. It is a good mixture of both. As I said in another post, education needs to be greatly improved, students need to learn to question the system, question their teachers & professor (without worry about their grades being affected), question our country - then we could move forward. The talent in the younger generation is immense, but they often can't use it, that is why many talented young Turks leave. Look at the EU, one of heads of Education in the EU was a Turkish lady !!! Why couldn't she be here working on Turkish education ?
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| 32. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 05:59 pm |
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Quoting ciko: Again outside media and foreigners are guilty and i dont agree with you about BBC.. you can find lots of articles about modern Turkey..and most of English newspapers indicate Turkey as a modern country who can lead islam world for being more democratic.
i think we should stop blaming others and start to criticize ourselves!! |
Ciko you are like a breath of fresh air! 
I agree, certainly in the UK,Turkey are usually reported in the media as being progressive and a modern country.
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| 33. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:00 pm |
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Quoting Cacık: Quote: Again outside media and foreigners are guilty and i dont agree with you about BBC.. you can find lots of articles about modern Turkey..and most of English newspapers indicate Turkey as a modern country who can lead islam world for being more democratic.
i think we should stop blaming others and start to criticize ourselves!! |
Oh Ciko - don't get me wrong, I don't only blame outside media and foriegners for everything - no not at all and you have a point about looking in the mirror at ourselves. It is a good mixture of both. As I said in another post, education needs to be greatly improved, students need to learn to question the system, question their teachers & professor (without worry about their grades being affected), question our country - then we could move forward. The talent in the younger generation is immense, but they often can't use it, that is why many talented young Turks leave. Look at the EU, one of heads of Education in the EU was a Turkish lady !!! Why couldn't she be here working on Turkish education ? |
yes absolutely we need to learn question our country instead of blaming other countries whatever happens in Turkey. you are right about education and questioning.
we have no right to expect our children to question the system as long as we dont give them right to question their fathers at home. i personally was always afraid of my father. and i am sure 90 % are same
and ok forget family for a while....do you remember we used to take oath to be loyal to the system and Ataturk's elements..how can we expect these poor children to question system after we make him think that the system ( or the state) is as important as God..
we first need to change ourselves to change the destniy of our country
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| 34. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:00 pm |
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Quoting ciko: i wonder what Catwoman will post about this ouh i am scared  i expect at least two long posts from her |
Why do you keep making such unpleasant jokes about me!  If you have a personal problem, say it openly, ok?
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| 35. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:02 pm |
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Quoting AEnigma III: Quoting ciko: Again outside media and foreigners are guilty and i dont agree with you about BBC.. you can find lots of articles about modern Turkey..and most of English newspapers indicate Turkey as a modern country who can lead islam world for being more democratic.
i think we should stop blaming others and start to criticize ourselves!! |
Ciko you are like a breath of fresh air!
I agree, certainly in the UK,Turkey are usually reported in the media as being progressive and a modern country.
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like a breath of fresh air?  finally someone said something good about me in Turkishclass 
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| 36. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:05 pm |
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Quoting catwoman: Quoting ciko: i wonder what Catwoman will post about this ouh i am scared i expect at least two long posts from her |
Why do you keep making such unpleasant jokes about me! If you have a personal problem, say it openly, ok? |
why would i have a personal problem with you catwoman.it was just a joke. i wont repeat that.sorry.
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| 37. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:10 pm |
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Quoting ciko: and ok forget family for a while....do you remember we used to take oath to be loyal to the system and Ataturk's elements..how can we expect these poor children to question system after we make him think that the system ( or the state) is as important as God..
we first need to change ourselves to change the destniy of our country |
Ciko, this is a really interesting point that I had never considered before....
....just stop criticising Catwoman!
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| 38. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:14 pm |
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Quote: do you remember we used to take oath to be loyal to the system and Ataturk's elements..how can we expect these poor children to question system after we make him think that the system ( or the state) is as important as God..
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This is the trickiest and hardest point of it all Ciko - on the one hand, I agree that Ataturk must never be forgotten - what he did was an incredible feat and even Winston Churchill said something like "every century a genuis is born, this time he was born to Turkey" (I read that in the Ataturk museum in Ankara). But to idolize someone and make it part of the blood is also wrong in a society that has not enough education to truly understand the difference between patrotism and nationalism - two very different meanings. If I had children, I would definitely teach them about Ataturk, who he was and all the great things he did (after all many of us yabanci gelin/damats wouldn't be here if he hadn't made such changes) - but I would also encourage them that progress and developments on the things previously achieved can be made, to beleve that things can change and develop without tipping the historical balance.
Oh gosh - am I making any sense at all
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| 39. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:17 pm |
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Quoting Cacık: Oh gosh - am I making any sense at all |
On the contrary, you and Ciko are both making a lot of sense. It is unusual to have such thoughtful and honest posts here!
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| 40. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:17 pm |
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Quoting AEnigma III: Quoting ciko: and ok forget family for a while....do you remember we used to take oath to be loyal to the system and Ataturk's elements..how can we expect these poor children to question system after we make him think that the system ( or the state) is as important as God..
we first need to change ourselves to change the destniy of our country |
....just stop criticising Catwoman! |
i wont do that mistake again
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| 41. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:20 pm |
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Hey AEnigma
It is refreshing to actually be able to voice these views and moreover, to voice them to a mixture of nationalities and hear the Turkish voice ! How lovely. Is this forum always like this, I have only just joined.
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| 43. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:27 pm |
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Quoting Cacık: Quote: do you remember we used to take oath to be loyal to the system and Ataturk's elements..how can we expect these poor children to question system after we make him think that the system ( or the state) is as important as God..
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If I had children, I would definitely teach them about Ataturk, who he was and all the great things he did (after all many of us yabanci gelin/damats wouldn't be here if he hadn't made such changes) -
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if i had children, the first thing i would teach them is that who is their father and how great he is
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| 44. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:27 pm |
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Quoting Cacık: Hey AEnigma
It is refreshing to actually be able to voice these views and moreover, to voice them to a mixture of nationalities and hear the Turkish voice ! How lovely. Is this forum always like this, I have only just joined.
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Welcome Cacik
Yes it is usually like this (sometimes a bit fiesty!!!). But highly addictive. Hope you stay around awhile
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| 45. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:29 pm |
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Quoting ciko: if i had children, the first thing i would teach them is that who is their father and how great he is |
It's so sad that your children would have to be TAUGHT how great you are, without noticing it themselves
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| 46. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:29 pm |
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Quoting catwoman: Quoting ciko: i wont do that mistake again |
However, at the same time I am very impressed how open minded you are. Great job!  |
i wonder if you are being sarcastic or really liked my posts
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| 47. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:30 pm |
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Yes, think I will stay around for a while !!! Looking forward to getting to know you all !
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| 48. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:30 pm |
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Quoting AEnigma III: Quoting ciko: if i had children, the first thing i would teach them is that who is their father and how great he is |
Its so sad that your children would have to be TAUGHT how great you are, without noticing it themselves |
ehehehe am i being narcissist??
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| 50. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:38 pm |
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hehehehe thank you
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| 51. |
23 Aug 2007 Thu 06:43 pm |
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Good night - I'm off now but have a great evening everyone.
Bye 
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