I have just finished watching this movie and I have to say that I loved it. I was initially a little bit uninterested, but Daydreamer said that she loved it, so I decided to give it a try.

I don´t want to spoil the plot for anybody who hasn´t seen it, but I would be interested to see what other people thought of the movie! It was soooo full of surprises for me...

 I immediately went to buy the DVD as soon as I heard it was out. Fatih Akýn is a very successfull director if you ask me. I thought the film was awesome, it is a good attempt to show the compromises (rather the lack of!) and the conflicts of the two different cultures that the characters are caught in between. There are lots of stereotypical things in the film, but they are put in a way that you can understand them without the prejudging context of the notion ´stereotype´. It has a strong underline of no compromises, destruction and fate. I also think Fatih made a good usage of language: where the characters, who are German Turks, feel immense feelings, for example when a character realizes he is in love, he suddenly speaks Turkish again. Its in every sense a nice work of two cultures, with both Sezen Aksu and punk music to underline the storyplot.

Despite what I said above, it is a commonly made mistake, (especially in Turkey! where the film wasnt praised as much as it was in Europe, because they misinterpret the idea of the film): the story is not meant to be political or about immigration problems, it is mainly a dramatic lovestory. The Turkish ´cultural industry´ (cult films, literature), have the tendency not to take any work seriously unless it is society-critical and realistic. Turkish literature history knows a strong tendency where literature came up as a means to comment on society, say what was wrong and how it was supposed to be. Literature has followed strong relations with major happenings in Turkish society, such as leftist-rightist clashes and coupe d´états. Some books have been, for this reason, in the past seen as unsuccesfull, just because they were not society-critical or realistic. I think the same counts for this film: it has been interpreted as a society-describing piece of art, and in that way has been seen as unsuccesfull. But the film was never aimed to be so, it was from the start a love story. Another point that it was unsuccesfull for them, int he sence of a society-describing work, was the fact that the female main character is a former porn-star, so ´hardly´ a ´good representative´. But again, it is meant to be a dramatic love story rather than to describe the clash between east-west, cultural differences, politics etc etc.

Anyway, to cut a long story short: I can advice everyone to watch it. The film has rather shocking moments (its not a romantic comedy!), is surprising and strong in both story and acting. Its really nice

It is kind of old now. I can´t even remember the plot. It is a cool movie though. Actually, all of Akin´s movies are worth watching. Turkish directors like Ferzan Ozpetek, Nuri Bilge Ceylan have produced excellent works over the last few years.  I recommend La Finestra Fronte (Karþý Pencere) directed by Özpetek. If you are a hardcore movie lover, you should try Ceylan´s movies too. There are many other talented directors in the new generation like Demirkubuz. His two versions of Kader are among my favourite ones.

 I guess I am a ´hardcore movie lover´. I havent watched anything from Özpetek I think, but I can add to the advice to watch other films of Akin and of Nuri Bilge Ceylan.

Though I think Turkish ´dizi industry´ (soap operas mainly) is rather behind and oldfashioned (Dutch one is even worse though!), I think Turkish cinema is of outstanding quality and a must for anyone who likes to see a good movie. Depends on the genre though, I watched Musallat a few days ago (I realise this is quite different from the type of films produced by Akýn and Ceylan, but to addition of other ´hollywood´ kind of films in turkey, which I think are quite good too, I watched this one as well), and was highly disappointed in the rubbish they produced. Im not a fan of horrorthrillers anyway, but this was almost laughably sad.

Somehow I got the impression that this film was a documentary of musical styles in Istanbul... but from what you´re writing I´ll head out to rent it. Sounds interesting

 You are confusing two films of Fatih Akin here Gegen die Wand / Duvara karþý (head on, in english I guess?) is a dramatic lovestory, and Crossing the Bridge is a musical documentary.

Actually the movie is highly critical of Turkish society! that´s the main point of the movie... I would not call the movie a love story at all... it´s more like a story about people who are completely lost in life and trying to survive... to find their place in life and despite giving up many times on their lifes, they are taken into new, unexpected places...

 Yes it is critical, but it is not the aim of the film.

As for calling it a love-story, I based that on an interview with Fatih Akin himself But I can find myself more in your description. It is totally about fate and destruction, in a raw and pure sense. But if you see the context in which this happens (see how the female character changes in her time in Istanbul, she becomes like the man she loves because she misses him), the changes in life are tied up with the love relationships they go through.

Oh, I see what you mean, that´s a good point! But why do you think she becomes like the man she loves? She seemed like him before... not after.. maybe you could clarify that?

 Ah yes of course, you´re right Nevermind then

Well, at the beginning (I dont mean the beginning where they meet each other, because I agree, they are the same type of person tehre, though Sibel seems a bit more structuralized and knows hwat she wants, where Cahit is a total ´piece of shit´ it is sort of a stereotypical conflict inside her, i remember her shouting ´Ãch will leben, ich will ficken´ if I remember my german well (I want to live, I want to screw around) , but then she gets angry at some point when someone comes too close ´Im a married Turkish woman´. Yani, there is no way that the German and Turkish identity get together, it is one or the other, not a mix.

Cahit was the drunk guy who didn´t know where to stop, an alcoholist and a drugaddict. He remains that way for a while when they are married, where is Sibel, though wanting to live freely, also tries to tidy up the house, cook food and create a more structuralized as opposed to the anarchistic Cahit. When Sibel comes to Istanbul, (before she gets married and settles down!) she is leading a streetlife, she becomes the ´rubbish´ that Cahit was before (who now only drinks water and doesnt take alcohol anymore)

Akin plays with Turkish and west-European styled stereotypes of love. They dont identify themselves with their turkish background, Cahit barely speaks Turkish and Sibel wants to lead a free, western live. But they cant escape their traditional turkish background.

You could see the film as a ´tribute´ to the hard ´love-hate relationship´ of Turkey and EU, and many column writers have done this in their reviews, but as far as I read from Fatih Akin that wasnt his aim.

But I got that feeling too, especially in combination with the film Im Juli, I can also recommend that one.

Interesting...well...if you were members of my library...you´d get to watch all the recent Turkish movies

Anyway....if you´re in London..watch out for the Turkish film festival 5th-18th December 2008 !

Hmmm... DK, I don´t actually see it as her becoming like the man she loved... it was more of an incident in my view. 

And.. I´ve seen the movie "Im Juli" long time ago and sorry... but I thought it was the most boring movie ever!

 Well thats the nice thing baout cinema and art right, you can see in it as you please

I enjoyed im Juli but it was no way near as sublime as Gegen die Wand. I dont think it was boring or particularly bad, it just wasnt particularly awesome. Zevkler, renkler

Again... good point...

Ok....film buffs and Fatih lovers... There´s another film co-produced by Fatih´s company, Corazon, which Fatih himself mentioned to me.. called ´Takva´ . It may not be for everyone, but I personally thought it was well researched and well made. I´ll let you find out about it yourselves..

 Another ´reason to use Turkish Class´: you can get in contact with famous Turks You have become our new link to Fatih today, where Vineyards has become the link to Mercan Dede. Keep it coming! Anyone who knows Sezen Aksu please feel free to let me know, so that I can persuade her to come sing at my yet undetermained wedding

Esther, you might also like to see this  critically acclaimed  Turkish drama

by Yilmaz Arslan who explores the emotional journey of two young Kurds Nurretin Celik and Erdal Celik who leave their turbulent homeland behind and relocate to Germany, only to encounter a harsher reality. Is the brotherly friendship between one of the young men and a small boy Xevat Gecgtan he takes under his wing enough to rage against the bitterness around them?

Thanks, I´ll have a look at it my next trip to Turkey (hopefully around Christmas!). Kadir is a cinema-fan as well so.

I will never! forget this Turkish movie, it still haunts me!!

Journey of Hope

 Thanks Ros...I will have to rent this..

Susan, you also must rent  YOL

 Is this something Blockbuster would have?

Netflix has it

Quoting Roswitha

Netflix has it

 Oh good...I´ll rent it then.  Thanks..

and also rent this one:

The Edge of Heaven

(Auf der anderen Seite)

by Fatih Akin

Maybe he is Fatih Akin himself and he´s advertising his work here!

Ros, this is a thread for "Gegen Die Wand"!!!