Welcome
Login:   Pass:     Register - Forgot Password - Resend Activation

Turkish Class Forums / Turkey

Turkey

Add reply to this discussion
Moderators: libralady, sonunda
The old history
(25 Messages in 3 pages - View all)
1 [2] 3
10.       alameda
3499 posts
 29 Nov 2009 Sun 03:19 am

 

Quoting vineyards

 

American civilization has made undeniable contributions to the entire world but it is not a unique civilization. Instead, it is a product of the strong winds of change that led to the realization of great geographical discoveries. The riches of the new continents were immense and were waiting to be utilized by an advanced society. It was Europeans who capitalized on this new opportunity to form wealthier lives.

 

 

Hmm....well I may say the Amerindians have another view about that.....and just how "advanced" those Europeans were anyway.....There are places here in CA that are sacred to them....the "Americans" want to develop those areas. Harnass the energy.............like they did other areas.............

 

I am old enough to have seen the destruction that has taken place..........and I am not at all happy about it, and I do not think it has been much benefit in the long run.....I know and have relatives who were able to live off the land...........now it´s all contaminated........advanced???

 

It has more to do with values and what is considered wealth...........I don´t need a diamond to appreciate the beauty of light....the beauty of a dew drop is more beautiful to me.......and more accessable as well.......and does not demand the destruction of resources....

11.       vineyards
1954 posts
 29 Nov 2009 Sun 04:08 am

A few posts ago I refered to dialectical materialism which presents an explanation to how and why society develops in a perpetual chain of transitions from one state to another. Accordingly, there are theses and antitheses. One understands wealth in one way and the other in another. Happiness, joy, pride, advancements etc are all such concepts. History keeps an account of the various consequences of this fight between theses and antitheses.

 

Just remember the clash between the defenders of AC and DC, steam engine and combustion chamber engine, Ghandhi and Britain. In each one of these cases there was a thesis and an antithesis. The world would evolve in exactly the opposite direction had anyone of the dropped alternatives were chosen. This applies to ideas, opinions, philosophies and economic models too. In other words, the winner determines the outcome. It is not enough to have a more benign point of view. One needs to find a way to enforce it. There is no way to affect any changes in the world unless you have coercion and there seems to be no way to get it when all your intentions are humane and benign. Exceptions of course do not count.

 

This is why the good is always at the mercy of the bad.

12.       alameda
3499 posts
 29 Nov 2009 Sun 05:34 am

 

Quoting vineyards

A few posts ago I refered to dialectical materialism which presents an explanation to how and why society develops in a perpetual chain of transitions from one state to another. Accordingly, there are theses and antitheses.

 

One understands wealth in one way and the other in another. Happiness, joy, pride, advancements etc are all such concepts.

 

and those concepts are vulnerable to manipulation....

 

History keeps an account of the various consequences of this fight between theses and antitheses.

 

And is it not said history is written, and rewritten,  by the victor....?

 

Just remember the clash between the defenders of AC and DC, steam engine and combustion chamber engine, Ghandhi and Britain. In each one of these cases there was a thesis and an antithesis. The world would evolve in exactly the opposite direction had anyone of the dropped alternatives were chosen. This applies to ideas, opinions,  philosophies and economic models too. In other words, the winner determines the outcome.

 

To some extent, but the other side exerts a great deal of influence.  How much of US culture comes from Africa? African culture has become so entwined in all aspects of American culture it is impossible to remove it.  There was no sushi available in restraunts in the USA until after WWII. Now it´s all over the place.  Many became involved with Zen........and of course....Japanese martial arts became the rage.......

 

It is not enough to have a more benign point of view. One needs to find a way to enforce it. There is no way to affect any changes in the world unless you have coercion and there seems to be no way to get it when all your intentions are humane and benign.

 

I would disagree with you on this point......however it is unfortunate that´s the popular opinion.  The reality is altruism is still greatly admired.  If things were truly as you present, we would be a savage barbaric bunch of beasts for whom strength and power were the only things that mattered......the strongest males would drag females they desired off at will, disposing of those unwanted in any manner they wish.  I must admit, there are still some who operate in such a manner, but not that many, and they don´t have a great deal of success.

 

We need to make peace with the fact that in order for our physical existance to continue, other things have to die. How that comes about is the issue. Is that which sustains us harvested in the most humane and ethical manner possible?  Greed and gluttony are not efficient methods.....the current swine flu is an example.  Had those poor animals not been treated in such a barbaric and inhumane manner, it probably would not have come about.

 

Exceptions of course do not count.

 

I´m curious why you say exceptions don´t count?

 

This is why the good is always at the mercy of the bad.

 

I do not agree with that opinion.........MLK did prevail....Ghandi did prevail.....greed and brutality are not acceptable...

 

 



Edited (11/29/2009) by alameda [edit color]

13.       vineyards
1954 posts
 29 Nov 2009 Sun 06:33 am

Rather than quoting your text I will try to list my opinions as concisely as possible:

 

* If an opinion has a popular appeal, it is a strong opinion and it has coercion.

* I am not defending the correctness of any decision taken in the way explained in my text.

* Ghandhi was surely an exception.

* I also believe African American have made a profound impact on the American civilization.

 

Two of my favourite musicians (Monk and Miles Davis) are Afro-American. American athletism scene is dominated by African Americans and finally your president is an African American. African American people have very good cultural assets but to my knowledge they are not  offered equal economic opportunities. An Afro American icon Louis Armstron would probably die in misery did he not have that stunning skill as a musician. How many great musicians does the Afro-American community have? How many of them will end up as Mohammad Ali or Michael Jordan. In this competition, you need coercion, like that offered by Obama who made it possible for a Black person to head NASA.

14.       TheAenigma
5001 posts
 29 Nov 2009 Sun 12:12 pm

 

Quoting nifrtity

Merhaba,

i want to know about the old turkish history becouse i like the history in genral.

so if any one know an site in history please reply to me

thanks

 

How far do you want to go back?

The Republic of Turkey has existed since 1922 - to go before that you should Google "The Ottoman Empire".

15.       TheAenigma
5001 posts
 29 Nov 2009 Sun 12:14 pm

 

Quoting vineyards

Rather than quoting your text I will try to list my opinions as concisely as possible:

 

* If an opinion has a popular appeal, it is a strong opinion and it has coercion.

* I am not defending the correctness of any decision taken in the way explained in my text.

* Ghandhi was surely an exception.

* I also believe African American have made a profound impact on the American civilization.

 

Two of my favourite musicians (Monk and Miles Davis) are Afro-American. American athletism scene is dominated by African Americans and finally your president is an African American. African American people have very good cultural assets but to my knowledge they are not  offered equal economic opportunities. An Afro American icon Louis Armstron would probably die in misery did he not have that stunning skill as a musician. How many great musicians does the Afro-American community have? How many of them will end up as Mohammad Ali or Michael Jordan. In this competition, you need coercion, like that offered by Obama who made it possible for a Black person to head NASA.

 

 Give up Vineyards - you are the balanced one sitting beside two extremes (AlphaF with his overt nationalism and Alameda with her dislike of all things modern)

 

 

16.       vineyards
1954 posts
 29 Nov 2009 Sun 02:10 pm

 

Quoting TheAenigma

 

 

 Give up Vineyards - you are the balanced one sitting beside two extremes (AlphaF with his overt nationalism and Alameda with her dislike of all things modern)

 

 

 

This world is composed of Alamedas, Vineyards, Aenigmas and AlfaF´s. I would be happy if I can contribute to them in any way I can. The beauty of the world lies in its diversity...

17.       TheAenigma
5001 posts
 29 Nov 2009 Sun 02:47 pm

 

Quoting vineyards

 

 

This world is composed of ...... Aenigmas

 

 Ahh if only

What a perfect world that would be! lol

18.       catwoman
8933 posts
 29 Nov 2009 Sun 06:21 pm

 

Quoting nifrtity

Merhaba,

i want to know about the old turkish history becouse i like the history in genral.

so if any one know an site in history please reply to me

thanks

 

Are you asking for someone to quote you a (1,000 page) history book here?

19.       alameda
3499 posts
 30 Nov 2009 Mon 03:45 am

 

Quoting TheAenigma

 

 

 Give up Vineyards - you are the balanced one sitting beside two extremes (AlphaF with his overt nationalism and Alameda with her dislike of all things modern)

 

 

 

Excuse me???? Where do you get the idea I dislike all things modern?  I am here on the Internet, use various "modern" things, but I choose what modern thing to embrace........and do not throw out whatever is old or traditional. If it´s lasted a long time, maybe it should be looked at carefully to understand why it lasted so long........if, after research and reflection shows  it´s just clutter and of no use any longer, out it goes.........

 

As for modern things, remember, they have not had the test of time.  Too many times we rush to embrace new technology only to discover later, maybe we should have been slower in the whole hearted embrace........maybe we should not have thrown out the baby with the bath water...

 

There are just too many things that have been shown later to be bad choices........like Vioxx....Hormone Replacement Therapy....DDT...............PCBs..........and the multitudes of hormone disruptors we have released............now we are producing  Genetically Modified Food which I´d rather not injest. Give me slow food and good old time vegetables and fruit.  I do confess to a love for heirloom vegetables........

 

 

 

 



Edited (11/30/2009) by alameda [add & subtract]

20.       alameda
3499 posts
 30 Nov 2009 Mon 04:20 pm

 

Quoting vineyards

* If an opinion has a popular appeal, it is a strong opinion and it has coercion.

 

The popuarity of an opinion is very often determined by the presentation...put a diamond on a piece of paper bag ........or put it in a velvet lined box....and see which one gets a better reception.  How things are preceied and the reception they get is too often manipulated aka think propaganda....also known as "public relations"


* Ghandhi was surely an exception.

 

History has many exceptions....your Yunus Emre is another one

 

* I also believe African American have made a profound impact on the American civilization.

 

Yes they did, and they still are..........

 

Two of my favourite musicians (Monk and Miles Davis) are Afro-American. American athletism scene is dominated by African Americans and finally your president is an African American. African American people have very good cultural assets but to my knowledge they are not  offered equal economic opportunities. An Afro American icon Louis Armstrong would probably die in misery did he not have that stunning skill as a musician.

 

It was not only his skill as a musician, it was being in the right place at the right time and making the right connections.......I´m more curious how many other artists are/were never known.  Skill and talent are small parts of the equation.


 How many great musicians does the Afro-American community have? How many of them will end up as Mohammad Ali or Michael Jordan.

 

I´m not sure what you are referrng to, Mohammed Ali´s Parkenson´s syndrome?

 

In this competition, you need coercion, like that offered by Obama who made it possible for a Black person to head NASA.

 

If by coercion you mean the presentation of a better idea, a more humane idea, not more bute force.....I agree........I think we need some sort of international movement to stop the insanity of destruction and devastation "advanced" civilization is visiting on the World......Universe...as we are now expanding and distributing our trash and  "harvesting" resources in throughout the Galaxy......



Edited (11/30/2009) by alameda [error]
Edited (11/30/2009) by alameda

(25 Messages in 3 pages - View all)
1 [2] 3
Add reply to this discussion




Turkish Dictionary
Turkish Chat
Open mini chat
New in Forums
-midir nedir
admin: The closest ... I can think of is "or ... O ... midir nedir -&g...
Hire professional hackers! (Telegrram: @Bl...
EmirKaplan77: We are a team of ... hackers. Our expertise is ... running exploits,...
Turkish Learning Books
qdemir: are you a new learner or do you want to take your Turkish to the next ...
TLC servers hacked, all user emails & pass...
admin: The problem with angle brackets in messages should be resolved no...
Travelling to Turkey - personal experience...
Glovol: Turkey is a great country.
T-E
Sagredo: Rose Garden Make an effort to get into the rose garden. Because those...
E-T: It´s one of the things on my bu...
gokuyum: No. It doesnt make sense. You can say ... yapmak istediğim bi...
T-E
og2009: DÜNYA TOPLUMU VE FELSEFE ... okul ... felsefe ... ....
24 HOUR FLASH SALE for learning Turkish e-...
qdemir: ...
Grammar Textbook
qdemir: ...
E-T: I see you have done this before?
harp00n: Bunu ... daha önce de ... Bu konuda iyi olduğun ç...
Random Pictures of Turkey
Most liked
Alphabet

Turkish lesson by admin
Level: beginner
Introduction

Turkish lesson by admin
Level: beginner
Numbers

Turkish lesson by admin
Level: beginner
Pronouns 1

Turkish lesson by admin
Level: beginner