Thanks Ali for the quick answer.

Can I ask another question please?

In the ´Teach Yourself Turkish´ book under the -ki section it says that -ki does not change because of vowel harmony, and it give examples of ´masadaki çiçekler´ - ´the flowers on the table´ and ´onlarınki´ - ´theirs, their one´... among other examples, and it states quite clearly that it does not change.  Yet here in this thread there are examples when it quite obviously does change, so as you can imagine I´m quite confused!  Can you tell me if the examples they use in the book are right?  Or maybe this is a different part of using -ki?................ this -ki is very complicated! haha

It´s true; -ki doesn´t meet Vowel Harmony, so it doesn´t change.

I think you are talking about these three exceptions:

dünkü

bugünkü

günkü

If you are talking about these, it is because of creating easiness in pronunciation. Saying dünki is harder than saying dünkü. This is because of general speech and doesn´t break the rule. -ki does not change for Vowel Harmony. Dünkü, bugünkü and günkü are exceptions.

thx

turkishcobra //

 Thank you again Ali for clearing that up for me, I just learnt it form the book and I learned it as -ki doesnt follow vowel harmony, I hadn´t realised words like ´cünkü´ were suffixed with -ki, I learnt the word just as a word before I even knew there was a -ki suffix!

Your welcome, Ally, hope I could help you.

-ki is a complicated structure and a lot of learners meet problems. I´m always ready for any other question and help,

thx

turkishcobra // 

Thank you very much, upsy_daisy! Sorry for bothering, but I´m not sure if I understand all your examples. May I ask if my translations below are correct ?

I left them untranslated on purpose to make you think about them. Don´t let ki confuse you. In the examples, ki has no other function than showing surprise, conflict, suspicion,etc. They can be easily rewriten without ki, if you don´t want those extra things expressed. Let´s study on the examples.

b) used to show surprise:

kapağı kaldırmış ki tencere bomboş. -> A lid has been taken and saucepan is empty! (surprise / shock )

You can also say, " Kapağı kaldırmış. Tencere bomboşmuş." (s/he took off the lid.The saucepan was all empty) But there is no surprise in saying it this way. Putting ki after kaldırmış tickles the curiosity of the reader or listener about what will happen next. 

c) used to show conflict:

ben görmedim ki anlatabileyim -> I haven´t seen and I can´t explain (something like: "I haven´t seen that much to be able to explain (it)")

You can rewrite the sentence as follows: "Görmedim. Anlatamam" (I didn´t see(it). I can´t tell (about it )) But there is no conflict between the two sentences, on the contrary, there is harmony. Putting ki after görmedim creats a conflict between "not seeing" and "being able to tell about". (=> you want something from me that I can´t)

c) complaining, blaming:

sana da hiç güvenilmez ki! -> Nothing can be entrusted to you!

You can say it without ki:"sana da hiç güvenilmez". But if you put ki in the end of the sentence,it also expresses that you are, in the same time, blaming him/her because s/he is not trustworthy and reliable.

d) when placed in the end of a question sentence it shows suspicion or anxiety:

acaba ceza verirler mi ki? -> I wonder, will they (actually) punish ?

If you remove ki from the sentence, the meaning doesn´t change but showing suspicion or anxiety get lost. Putting ki after mi shows speaker´s suspicion or anxiety about the punishment.

Unfortunately, I don´t know what the following sentence means. Could you (or someone else) translate it to English?

a) makes the following clause an adjective in meaning:

sen ki beni tanırsın, öyle davranabileceğimi nasıl düşünebildin?

You can remove ki from the sentence: "Sen beni tanırsın. (+) Öyle davranabileceğimi nasıl düşünebildin". (You know me. (+) How could you think that I would behave like that). Here ki also expresses that the speaker is a bit offended or hurt by one who knows him/her well, and yet s/he can expect a wrong behavior from him/her that s/he never does. 

I would translate it as follows:

How could you, who knows me well, think that I would behave like that.

But I am not sure, for my English is not that good, if it makes the same sense in English as it does in Turkish.