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Ýlker Baþbuð
(35 Messages in 4 pages - View all)
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1.       SuiGeneris
3922 posts
 14 Oct 2008 Tue 09:37 pm

He is the new president of Turkish Army, but he is different than the others...

 

I was watching a program called Neden? (Why?) in the turkish channel NTV, the program is represented by one of the best -according to me- Turkish writers Can Dündar...

 

In that program, there was a video file about Ýlker Baþbuð, his speeches, what he has done so far...

he is very brave, in one speech he says: "You need to decrease or end the participation to the mountains, and what the government do to decrease it now is nothing."

Which impressed me very much...

 

As a summary, he is in the way of "communication", he has gone to all political parties to have information about how they think and their way of solution... He also not only talks with politicians and soldiers, he is in contact with civillians... He is the first one who has invited civil experts about solving and analysing social problems...

 

I started to feel that something good is going to be started... i hope it continues...

2.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 15 Oct 2008 Wed 01:43 am

 

Quoting SuiGeneris

He is the new president of Turkish Army, but he is different than the others...

 

I was watching a program called Neden? (Why?) in the turkish channel NTV, the program is represented by one of the best -according to me- Turkish writers Can Dündar...

 

In that program, there was a video file about Ýlker Baþbuð, his speeches, what he has done so far...

he is very brave, in one speech he says: "You need to decrease or end the participation to the mountains, and what the government do to decrease it now is nothing."

Which impressed me very much...

 

As a summary, he is in the way of "communication", he has gone to all political parties to have information about how they think and their way of solution... He also not only talks with politicians and soldiers, he is in contact with civillians... He is the first one who has invited civil experts about solving and analysing social problems...

 

I started to feel that something good is going to be started... i hope it continues...

 

I think one of the biggest problems in Turkey is that the army acts as if it is a political party.

You can not find these type of incidents in any developed countries. I mean, the head of the army does not go and discuss politics with the parties, they dont publicly interfere with the politics.

It seems like we have still long way to go on the road to democracy.

Anyway, there are some news specially from the newspaper  taraf about the latest attack where 17 soldiers died.

They are showing the documents and saying that the army KNEW the latest attack up to every single detail.

The names of the terrorists, their location, their weapons even the number of mules (which were used  for transporting the weapons) and their locations. (Even there was an unmanned aerial vehicle locked into the area during the attack)

I wonder what the army will say about this..

(The same newspaper, proved that the army new daglica attack in advance which was a year ago and resulted the army having the permission to enter northern Iraq)

3.       SuiGeneris
3922 posts
 15 Oct 2008 Wed 02:34 pm

 

Quoting thehandsom

I think one of the biggest problems in Turkey is that the army acts as if it is a political party.

You can not find these type of incidents in any developed countries. I mean, the head of the army does not go and discuss politics with the parties, they dont publicly interfere with the politics.

It seems like we have still long way to go on the road to democracy.

Anyway, there are some news specially from the newspaper  taraf about the latest attack where 17 soldiers died.

They are showing the documents and saying that the army KNEW the latest attack up to every single detail.

The names of the terrorists, their location, their weapons even the number of mules (which were used  for transporting the weapons) and their locations. (Even there was an unmanned aerial vehicle locked into the area during the attack)

I wonder what the army will say about this..

(The same newspaper, proved that the army new daglica attack in advance which was a year ago and resulted the army having the permission to enter northern Iraq)

 

 The thing i was specifying here was the radical movements of the new president of Army, rather than the others were doing...

 

And to me there is no bad thing about being in contact with the political parties and civillian societies...

 

From what i wrote, it is very unfortunate that you understand army has an effect on the politics... which is not true for now... ofcourse what you say is generally true... but these powers has to be linked to eachother and have to give and take informations for a better future...

 

What taraf wrote was on the news also yesterday evening... So if army knew that there would be an attack, i can only say that, there was some people from army or has an effect to army from outside that said "no" to give any response...

 

I only state these things in also the other article i posted, The PKK doesnt have kurdish problem only... but this sounds to you as only a "conspiracy theory"...

4.       TheAenigma
5001 posts
 15 Oct 2008 Wed 02:44 pm

 

Quoting SuiGeneris

And to me there is no bad thing about being in contact with the political parties and civillian societies...

 

 Do you really believe this?  You seriously see nothing wrong with armed forces getting involved politically?

5.       libralady
5152 posts
 15 Oct 2008 Wed 03:00 pm

Can this be moved to Turkey section please?

6.       SuiGeneris
3922 posts
 15 Oct 2008 Wed 03:17 pm

 

Quoting TheAenigma

 Do you really believe this?  You seriously see nothing wrong with armed forces getting involved politically?

 

 It is not involved politically... everybody cannot see everything in the correct way... why do you create different meanings...

So that having meetings wouldnt be bad... I dont say army should have a force in political decisions but in some cases you need their ideas aswell...

7.       mltm
3690 posts
 15 Oct 2008 Wed 03:52 pm

 

Quoting thehandsom

I think one of the biggest problems in Turkey is that the army acts as if it is a political party.

You can not find these type of incidents in any developed countries. I mean, the head of the army does not go and discuss politics with the parties, they dont publicly interfere with the politics.

It seems like we have still long way to go on the road to democracy.

 

And let me remind you that in any of those democratic countries there is not currently a problem of a war or a terrorist organization so active in their territories.

8.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 15 Oct 2008 Wed 04:05 pm

 

Quoting mltm

And let me remind you that in any of those democratic countries there is not currently a problem of a war or a terrorist organization so active in their territories.

 

I dont think it is a winning argument.

There have been many terrorist organizations in developed countries (uk, germany, italy, spain etc)

And when you check the history of our republic, you will see that the army has been in politics all the time. 

Do i need to give examples?

9.       mltm
3690 posts
 15 Oct 2008 Wed 04:14 pm

 

Quoting thehandsom

I dont think it is a winning argument.

There have been many terrorist organizations in developed countries (uk, germany, italy, spain etc)

And when you check the history of our republic, you will see that the army has been in politics all the time. 

Do i need to give examples?

 

The position of the army in the Republic of Turkey is particular since it has social duties given by the constitution as well, and I dont think that in any other europen country there is a active threat as big as PKK in their soils.

And secondly the culture of democracy is not very rooted in Turkey, so in order that we make Turkey as democratic as some other european countries, we need much more time and we should not let it be imposed to us by external forces.

And lastly I dont think that currently Turkey is very far away from being a democratic country since AKP has been in power since 2002 despite the fact that their many acts and opinions contradict with the armys.

10.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 15 Oct 2008 Wed 04:25 pm

 

Quoting mltm

The position of the army in the Republic of Turkey is particular since it has social duties given by the constitution as well, and I dont think that in any other europen country there is a active threat as big as PKK in their soils.

And secondly the culture of democracy is not very rooted in Turkey, so in order that we make Turkey as democratic as some other european countries, we need much more time and we should not let it be imposed to us by external forces.

And lastly I dont think that currently Turkey is very far away from being a democratic country since AKP has been in power since 2002 despite the fact that their many acts and opinions contradict with the armys.

 

But constitutions were made by the army itself.

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