What do you know about imigrants really?

20-30 years ago, it was german and some other countries, asked for workers from different countries mostly from Turkey. now there is a big turkish community in europe and with time it is increasing. of course some come with illegal ways but mostly they went there with legal ways with the agreement between governments. maybe They still see them as immigrant.

Actually what europe has now? We see the economic status of EU, recently we saw Greece , I dont think it will go long. this big community will collapse one day. Turkey is in the middle of most important energy sources, and one of the biggest economy and one of the the fast growing economy in the region. I dont know if europe has a big energy source for long term?  

EU rules? I do not think they have rules. Turkey is a candidate for about 50 years, still a candidate, they just want us wait at the door, they will call when they need. there is a reality that they will never accept Turkey even if turkey implement them.

But a few weeks ago EU showed their real face and they abolished Visa application to Serbia and some other countries  except Bosna which are not EU member or a candidate. so, what kind of rules do these countries implement? Turkey and Bosna couldnt? why serbia why not Bosnia and Herzegovina (40 % of the population is muslim!).

Lastly, Of course countries are free to apply Visa to some countries BUT application procedure is really a torture and insulting. For me it is strange when u complain about some small procedures about turkey, which can not be compared what turkish ppl meet. 

The Turkish immigrants came, earned money. They were happy, the receiving countries were also happy. Most of the next generations Turkish people in Holland have good jobs. They are not "immigrants" pushed into bad jobs. Compared to other immigrant groups that arrived at the same time, Turkish people have put a lot of stress on getting a good education after their children joined them. The Turkish people in Holland with horrible underpaid jobs are mostly illegals. Often they run away for Turkish army-duty. These immigrants cost the country a lot of money. Think about lost taxes, lost legal jobs, police costs of tracking people down.

Turkey is not heaven. No country in the EU is heaven. Rules are not made up to tease people, or torture people. They are made up because of past experiences. Yes, these rules do not work that well all of the time. They often hit the good people the hardest, and the worst people find ways to avoid them. But if you can think of a system that works better, go work for the government and bring upon some chances.

 I havent heard anyone who escaped from turkey due to army-duty, but mostly being involved in terrorist actions. there are some organisations which help such ppl to escape and work for their group and pay to them. Going a country is not easy unless some ppl help you. that why they work in such places.

If I worked for to make the system better, I would first finish membership actions with europe and look on my way

What do I know about immigration? Well, first of all I am an immigrant myself so I suppose I have an idea. What you wrote basically agrees with my point - nobody FORCED people to immigrate, they did it because their homeland didn´t give them the same opportunities. So, they made a conscious decision to swap patriotic blah blah blah for a fair amount of deutsche marks. Simple. They gave their children an easier start, got jobs, often social housing as well. Is that what you call abuse?

The "we didn´t get visas abolished because we´re Muslims" slogan is tiresome. The USA hasn´t abolished visas for Poles athough it did so for The Czech Republic because of what? Are we too Muslim for them? It´s nonsense.

As for Turkey becoming a world power (I mean a generally recognised world power, not the world power Turks only consider themselves), you´ve got my best wishes. If it comes true, that´s great. You´ll be happy and wealthy and then you´ll get flooded with evil westerners looking for jobs

last night i watched a documentary about illegal immigrants in uk. a sad thing to watch. desperate people hiding in lorries. or the ones who work in hotels illegally. im really sorry for them.

a lady from moldova (pretending to be from lithuania) begged on her knees. and i cried with her.

i know what she had to pay to get to UK, i know what she has gone through. and then humiliations. such a shame their own countries (including mine) make people immigrate.

thank you for another excellent post.

Some ppl moved for to earn more, they accepted to be an immigrant, what about their chidren who was born there? lets look other thread about norway (turkish family who asked for ambulance)

 We are talking about European Union, not another continent, Thank to your god that u can travel most of the world easily. It is not a slogan, it is a reality that you do not wanna see canım. you or anyone else can not explain me how did serbia got this right and bosna could not.

For becoming a world power, Turkey has not an aim like this. maybe we will have same economical standarts, it is enough for us. we are used to live and be happy with these conditions. we dont want more as you wanted to travel USA without any obstacle.

I do not think poland got better with EU membership şekerim.

Well, I happen to know people who escaped Turkey for army duty. There are certain areas in which the illegals are heavily represented. Most of them have problems with their identity as Turkish Kurd, and the army duty. It doesn´t need a lot of work to escape Turkey, if you are willing to bribe some people to get a university registration.

strange thing, scandinavian countries accepted and embraced so many eastern, middle asian, african immigrants, sheltered them, employed them, and now their generation 2nd or 3rd still doesnt speak the language of the given country. they cant communicate themselves which they blame nazi scandinavians for.

turks dont escape army. its an honor to serve a country dont be silly.

 The easiest way to get permission for living in a country is political asylum, and they use kurdish card and PKK terrorism. University registration is not free no one gives you money to registre a university. most of the community organisations work for to help terrorists. and it was proved that terrorist groups are mostly supported from Europe (From these organisations), they send money or help terrorists to escape europe.