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30.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 17 Oct 2008 Fri 10:08 am

 

Quoting tamikidakika

{#lang_emotions_laugh_at}

it seems like you`ve never been to Bulgaria,

and at least these countries don`t have terrorist exporting neighbors, a big difference.

 

You DO wholeheartedly  believe what you are told by the army..dont you?

I have explained here hundred times.  It is not much to do with our neighbours.

We ARE genereting those terrorists in Turkey by not providing an enough democratic environment where people will not require to take arms.

And almost every democratic step is blocked by the ruling class with the reasons we have been talking above: ´Our geographical and strategical position, look at our neighbours, not now´ etc.

This is a vicious circle. Dog chasing its tail..

Our problem is  internal. We should stop looking for excuses.

 

31.       tamikidakika
1346 posts
 17 Oct 2008 Fri 10:17 am

 

Quoting thehandsom

You DO wholeheartedly believe what you are told by the army..dont you?

I have explained here hundred times. It is not much to do with our neighbours.

We ARE genereting those terrorists in Turkey by not providing an enough democratic environment where people will not require to take arms.

And almost every democratic step is blocked by the ruling class with the reasons we have been talking above: ´Our geographical and strategical position, look at our neighbours, not now´ etc.

This is a vicious circle. Dog chasing its tail..

Our problem is internal. We should stop looking for excuses.

 

don`t tell me what I believe. what the terrorists want is not democracy but partition, don`t fool yourself. these terrorists are represented even in the parliement, so what  democratic rights are you asking for? can you imagine al qaida`s being represented in the American house of representatives? you can`t deny the fact that the North Iraq is a sanctuary for the terrorists under the protection of America.

32.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 17 Oct 2008 Fri 10:35 am

 

Quoting tamikidakika

don`t tell me what I believe. what the terrorists want is not democracy but partition, don`t fool yourself. these terrorists are represented even in the parliement, so what  democratic rights are you asking for? can you imagine al qaida`s being represented in the American house of representatives? you can`t deny the fact that the North Iraq is a sanctuary for the terrorists under the protection of America.

 

Talking about Kurdish problem as just ´they are terrorists and they are asking for seperation´ is ignoring the facts since the beginning the republic. We are talking about a problem at least 100 years old and our 100 years of wrong doings  here.

As long as you are not a fully democratic state which we still are not, you wont be able to stop people joining to those terrorists. 

Dont tell me that kurds dont have any discrimitation in Turkey and free to use their language and free to take anybody into to the court when somebody insults them etc etc.

They are represented in  the parliment? do you have any idea how many kurdish party have been closed in last 20 years? do you know the court case against the latest one?

How many of their mps gone into jail for how many years?

 

 

33.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 17 Oct 2008 Fri 10:41 am

 

Quoting tamikidakika

don`t tell me what I believe. what the terrorists want is not democracy but partition, don`t fool yourself. these terrorists are represented even in the parliement, so what  democratic rights are you asking for? can you imagine al qaida`s being represented in the American house of representatives? you can`t deny the fact that the North Iraq is a sanctuary for the terrorists under the protection of America.

 

I think this article will answer you about "why democracy is necessary for our kurdish problem" and why this problem will continue without it and as long as we avoid the real problem. 

 

So, here is the summary: In this country, you cannot say “Happy Bayram” in Kurdish. But you can say “cleanse the Kurdish microbes” in Turkish.

 

http://www.turkishdailynews.com.tr/article.php?enewsid=116666

34.       tamikidakika
1346 posts
 17 Oct 2008 Fri 10:53 am

 

Quoting thehandsom

Talking about Kurdish problem as just ´they are terrorists and they are asking for seperation´ is ignoring the facts since the beginning the republic. We are talking about a problem at least 100 years old and our 100 years of wrong doings here.

As long as you are not a fully democratic state which we still are not, you wont be able to stop people joining to those terrorists.

Dont tell me that kurds dont have any discrimitation in Turkey and free to use their language and free to take anybody into to the court when somebody insults them etc etc.

They are represented in the parliment? do you have any idea how many kurdish party have been closed in last 20 years? do you know the court case against the latest one?

How many of their mps gone into jail for how many years?

so how should we refer to these terrorists if not as "terrorists"? this reminds me of a quote from Can Yucel, I`m sure you know what I`m talking about. what has happened in the past is not my concern, but if you`re so obsesssed with the past, let me tell you this, in the past the Kurds genocided my ancestors and got revarded for this genocide with special autonomous rights by the ottoman empire. that`s the reason why you`re referring to the "Kurdish problem" as a problem of the republic but not the Ottoman empire. This not a problem of the past 100 years but 500 years, and it dates back to the time when the shiate Turks got wiped out from Anatolia by the Sunni Kurds. ever wondered how Turkey became a sunni dominated country wheras the Turks of Azerbaijan are still Shiate? You will never be able to read about this stuff in taraf unfortunately.

 

coming back to the present, pkk is represented in the parliement, and the Kurds can speak their language or whatever language they want to speak.

 

35.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 17 Oct 2008 Fri 12:02 pm

 

Quoting tamikidakika

so how should we refer to these terrorists if not as "terrorists"? this reminds me of a quote from Can Yucel, I`m sure you know what I`m talking about. what has happened in the past is not my concern, but if you`re so obsesssed with the past, let me tell you this, in the past the Kurds genocided my ancestors and got revarded for this genocide with special autonomous rights by the ottoman empire. that`s the reason why you`re referring to the "Kurdish problem" as a problem of the republic but not the Ottoman empire. This not a problem of the past 100 years but 500 years, and it dates back to the time when the shiate Turks got wiped out from Anatolia by the Sunni Kurds. ever wondered how Turkey became a sunni dominated country wheras the Turks of Azerbaijan are still Shiate? You will never be able to read about this stuff in taraf unfortunately.

 

coming back to the present, pkk is represented in the parliement, and the Kurds can speak their language or whatever language they want to speak.

 

I was not trying to say that we have to call terrorists with different names.

All I was trying to say was there is a ´Kurdish problem´ within our borders.

Reducing the entire problem into ´no. it is just terrorism´ is a  MISTAKE.

yes..Speaking kurdish  is officially not a criminal act right now by the law...

But it has been like ´just changing the law for the sake of changing it´ really..

But I would agree, it is a  step for the right direction. But it does not change the fact that ´16 kurdish news papers were closed 39 times´ since 2006. 

It is almost like adding a new line into constitution and saying that ´turture is not allowed´ but in practice as habits dont die easily, torture still continues..

As far as representation in the parliament, any idea how many kurdish mps sent to jail in last 20 years? how many years did they serve? how many party were closed? the closure court case against the last one?

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