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A modern Ottoman
(83 Messages in 9 pages - View all)
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60.       Melek74
1506 posts
 13 Mar 2009 Fri 02:39 pm

 

Quoting thehandsom

 

 

I will reduce the agreement value abit lower..

In the end, all religions were invented to dominate the masses..

 

Or to reduce fear of the unknown ... {#lang_emotions_scared}

 

61.       libralady
5152 posts
 13 Mar 2009 Fri 02:42 pm

 

Quoting thehandsom

 

 

I will reduce the agreement value abit lower..

In the end, all religions were invented to dominate the masses..

 

 Never thought of a religion as being invented.

62.       TheAenigma
5001 posts
 13 Mar 2009 Fri 02:45 pm

 

Quoting Roswitha

Is it possible to be a true religious believer and at the same time enjoy good relations with people of other faiths or none?

 

 A couple of years ago I would have said "yes".  Since joining this website I have changed my opinion and say "generally, no it is not possible".

 

As an example, there is a strange view from Turks that the EU is "Christian" (when in fact, although we have "official religion" most northern europeans don´t give religion much thought at all would probably describe themselves as agnostic or atheist!!).  The perception of many Turks is that "we don´t like Turkey because they are muslim (!).  I think they give us too much credit for deep thought and caring about Turkey!!!  I am quite sure if you asked most UK citizens what religion Turkish people are, the majority would not have a clue! lol

 

In addition, most UK tourists I know who travel to countries with different faiths, are very interested in learning about that faith and their culture.  Many people I know come back from India, the Maldives, Japan etc. with a new understanding and respect of the faith of the country they visited.  This simply WOULD NEVER HAPPEN if a muslim visited a country who had a different religion - by the very nature of it´s "rules".

 

Therefore, going back to the original question quoted above, it is not possible for a "true religious believer to enjoy good relations with other people or other faiths or none" because in their eyes the world is divided into believers and non-believers of their faith and they assume non-believers of their faith are enemies.

 

(Tami - this post is dedicated to YOU! )

 



Edited (3/13/2009) by TheAenigma
Edited (3/13/2009) by TheAenigma
Edited (3/13/2009) by TheAenigma

63.       SuiGeneris
3922 posts
 13 Mar 2009 Fri 03:13 pm

 

Quoting TheAenigma

 

 

 I am muslim and it is always fascinating me, the culture and their customs in where i visit.

And this is like this with the many people i have known. And they are muslims

 

How do you like generalizing this much?

 

Yes it is true that in europa there are some people who looks like a weirdo to a muslim. And it was your politician in Europa that stated, EU is a christian community. It is in the arcihieves...

 

 

 

 

64.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 13 Mar 2009 Fri 03:14 pm

 

Quoting TheAenigma

 

 

 A couple of years ago I would have said "yes".  Since joining this website I have changed my opinion and say "generally, no it is not possible".


As an example, there is a strange view from Turks that the EU is "Christian" (when in fact, although we have "official religion" most northern europeans don´t give religion much thought at all would probably describe themselves as agnostic or atheist!!).  The perception of many Turks is that "we don´t like Turkey because they are muslim (!).  I think they give us too much credit for deep thought and caring about Turkey!!!  I am quite sure if you asked most UK citizens what religion Turkish people are, the majority would not have a clue! lol


In addition, most UK tourists I know who travel to countries with different faiths, are very interested in learning about that faith and their culture.  Many people I know come back from India, the Maldives, Japan etc. with a new understanding and respect of the faith of the country they visited.  This simply WOULD NEVER HAPPEN if a muslim visited a country who had a different religion - by the very nature of it´s "rules".


Therefore, going back to the original question quoted above, it is not possible for a "true religious believer to enjoy good relations with other people or other faiths or none" because in their eyes the world is divided into believers and non-believers of their faith and they assume non-believers of their faith are enemies.

 

This time I am extending my portion of agreement to 95% AE (5% is just incase )

But I think xenephobia coming from Turks should be treated more differently than the one coming from  religious  beleivers as the first one very much related to other non religious factors such as education, memories of WWI etc.

But, in the end, all religions and religious people believe that theirs is devine and so they are more devine than the others..So, a true believer  would NOT enjoy good relations with other people from other faiths..

And also as far as UK population is concerned, I think more than 30% publicly declare that they dont believe in any religions, more than 80% believe in evolution.

Considering there are not much religion problems in the UK and Britons are quite interested in (and very tolerant to) other religions, we can conclude that ´religions are playing a negative role for tolerance´ (or you can say that non-believers are more tolerant to others than religious people)

 

65.       TheAenigma
5001 posts
 13 Mar 2009 Fri 03:14 pm

 

Quoting SuiGeneris

 

 

 

 

 Forgive me for generalising, but we are being told these things on THIS site by Turks - should I not believe them?

66.       TheAenigma
5001 posts
 13 Mar 2009 Fri 03:16 pm

 

Quoting thehandsom

 

This time I am extending my portion of agreement to 95% AE (5% is just incase )

But I think xenephobia coming from Turks should be treated more differently than the one coming from  religious  beleivers as the first one very much related to other non religious factors such as education, memories of WWI etc.

But, in the end, all religions and religious people believe that theirs is devine and so they are more devine than the others..So, a true believer  would NOT enjoy good relations with other people from other faiths..

And also as far as UK population is concerned, I think more than 30% publicly declare that they dont believe in any religions, more than 80% believe in evolution.

Considering there are not much religion problems in the UK and Britons are quite interested in (and very tolerant to) other religions, we can conclude that ´religions are playing a negative role for tolerance´ (or you can say that non-believers are more tolerant to others than religious people)

 

 

 Ouh is this a first?  Well I will also make a first and say I agree with your post 98% (I deducted 2% just because you are a dudu)

67.       SuiGeneris
3922 posts
 13 Mar 2009 Fri 03:21 pm

 

Quoting TheAenigma

 

 

 Forgive me for generalising, but we are being told these things on THIS site by Turks - should I not believe them?

 

 You should consider the fact that why are they telling those things? As turkey has extremists? Europa also has the same!

 

and you shouldnt close your ears and eyes to the comment made by the politician of yours: "EU is a christian community."

 

I had a hard discussion with many Austrians here about Turkey and Turkish people. For simply some groups here are showing the not correct face of Turkish culture. This never means that Turkey is like that. I have seen many people here with in a very racists and wrong behaviours but i never comment as they are like this and this...

 

At first you should calm down the hatred in your heart and mind, i could recommend.

 

Ich grusse sie!

68.       thehandsom
7403 posts
 13 Mar 2009 Fri 03:30 pm

 

Quoting TheAenigma

 

 

 Ouh is this a first?  Well I will also make a first and say I agree with your post 98% (I deducted 2% just because you are a dudu)

 

I have been undergoing penance for a while ..

Give me my 2%!!{#lang_emotions_rant}

69.       TheAenigma
5001 posts
 13 Mar 2009 Fri 03:30 pm

 

Quoting SuiGeneris

 

 

 You should consider the fact that why are they telling those things? As turkey has extremists? Europa also has the same!

 

and you shouldnt close your ears and eyes to the comment made by the politician of yours: "EU is a christian community."

 

 I do shut my mind to such illogical comments - we have a huge population of muslims in the EU so that comment is wrong.

 

If I were to believe governments as "general thought" in a country, then I would believe that Turkey supported Israel in the Gaza conflict!!

 

Hate in my heart?  I have no such hate - you need to be religious to have that!

70.       theblonde
148 posts
 13 Mar 2009 Fri 03:39 pm

Quote: TheAenigma

As an example, there is a strange view from Turks that the EU is "Christian" (when in fact, although we have "official religion" most northern europeans don´t give religion much thought at all would probably describe themselves as agnostic or atheist!!).  The perception of many Turks is that "we don´t like Turkey because they are muslim (!).  I think they give us too much credit for deep thought and caring about Turkey!!! 

In principle I agree with you Aenigma, however on my fairly recent reunion with a  friend who happens to be an employee of the ´EU apparatus´ we had an innocent debate about whether or not Turkey will ever be considered to be incorporated into EU. And the answer was: ´There is a huge cultural and religious divide between EU and Turkey and EU is trying to form a block of countries based on many similar historical, cultural, religious and political values, so ultimately Turkey would not fit into that pattern. But this will be solved by some sort of a special commercial agreement.´

Is it not Europe that is at fault for the division??

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