Istanbul, the place where Europe sits next to Asia, and the poor next to the rich and the sophisticated to the simple and the beautiful to the ugly. So many people have come here to this endless city for a better life; so many of them with big expectations. Never rejected Istanbul them. She was like a beautiful woman who doesnt know how to say `no`. Somethimes maybe she was a little too promising and sometimes maybe a little too indifferent. If Istanbul were a woman one could tell she knows how to have fun, thats for sure my friend. But she doesnt seem to know how many broken hearts she left behind. Also she doesnt seem to care much.
If Istanbul were a woman you could never satisfy her, thats for sure. Istanbul, a city of huge ups and downs one could tell.
People, the ordinary people on streets, the little man you come across on shops, on bus stops or in crowded buses going to work in the early mornings or trying to go home in the evenings, these people can tell you Istanbul.

There were so many things you wanted to do; maybe there were a few more things you wanted to have. There were a few moments you felt very happy and lots of moments you were sad and there was always the rush like time never was enough.

The little boys and girls who have started working early in their young ages will tell you Istanbul. The factory workers, you can recognise from their big dirty hands will tell you.
Some people said Istanbul was a place where life never stops. Maybe a city of young people who enjoy going out on nights. But it isnt my friend, it isnt.

Everyone wanted a better life. I`m sure the young people working in the bakery on a hot summer day wanted a better life. The old shoe repairman working in a tiny shop maybe wanted a better life. I think he could speak for hours if you would ask him. I`m sure the boys who had to quit the primary school earlier and soon started working in a car repair shop wanted a better life. It will take time but Istanbul will teach them how to calm down and how to accept life as it is.
When you go to Istanbul next time look at two old men having a chat on a narrow road. "Ne var ne yok?" one will say and "Valla ne olsun," the other will tell "yaşayıp gidiyoruz işte".
You will see the deep lines on peoples faces. People will talk a lot. They will talk a lot about anything, about all the unnecessary things they will talk for hours. But about the things they actually want to talk, they will never do. Many have learned how not to care too much and how to be still happy among so much unhappines. People will still smile where you would never expect them. Maybe the poverty you can see on every corner is the soul of this city which makes her so much more real.

Has time passed very fast? Maybe you wanted life to be different. Maybe there were still things you would like to do but now it was too late. Istanbul, my friend is a story an old man likes to start as "there were times...".

I dont know much about Istanbul and I dont want to know much. I just know a bit about the people living in Istanbul. Istanbul, my friend is a story of happiness and sadness. It is only as real as a sad memory in a child`s mind. You could easly forget about it. Maybe there is no Istanbul.

I havent checked properly and I dont know if the issues are explained in an english website, maybe they are but here is a Turkish website (about the `n` buffer) for our Turkish visitors who are interested on these issues.

http://farabi.selcuk.edu.tr/suzep/turk_dili/ders_notlari/bolum_12/bolum12.html

Hello REES,
welcome to the Turkish Class Forums. Please feel free to ask as many questions as you like we like answering them.

1. I have never heard of different pronounciations of `peynir`. It should be pronounced as it is written like `peynir`. In fact Turkish is a phonetic language which means all the letters remain the same sound no matter in which word they are used. There are some exceptions but if you insist on saying words like they have written it will be always acceptable.
Example:
Bir: can be pronounced as `bi` but as I said there is nothing wrong to say it as `bir`. This will be perfectly allright.
Also some vowels have two forms; one higher sounding and one deeper sounding form. But even many Turks mix them sometimes so I wouldnt care much.

2. The letter soft g ( Ğğ ) has a very limited sound and can be very diffucult to pronounce for foreigners. In Turkish ğ does never come to the begining of any word. So it can be between other letters or at the end. If it is between other letters dropping it will be acceptable as long as long as the word consists of more than one syllable. These days some Turks, especially females find it more modern to drop the sound of ğ in some words. It would be better if it is included.

değil: can be pronounced as `değil` or `deil`. The second one will be still acceptable but isnt as good as the first one.
Bir şey değil > you are welcome > This is almost pronounced as one word. bişeydeil or even Bişeydiil will be OK.

3.
Havaalanı : airport
Havaalanına : to the airport

This word is a little complicated. First of all there are actually two nouns here; hava-alan. To make a new word these two have been put together. I dont know the english grammatical term for this. I will be happy if someone lets me know if there is a term for two nouns put together to make a new one.

hava: air
alan: space, place
hava-alan-ı: airport
Here the `ı` is a possesive suffix. Third person singular possesive suffixes can be –ı (-i, -u, -ü) or when the word end with a vowel -sı -si, -su, -sü.

Now we have the word `havaalanı` (the `alan` of the `hava`) and we need to add the dative suffixes to make it `to the airport`. Normally the dative suffixes are -e/a [or by -ye/ya after a vowel] but there is an exception.

"If a third singular word has a possesive suffix any case suffixes following will be placed after the buffer `n`.

Please note that in the example below each noun has a possesive suffix before the n and case suffixes.

Examples:
kendi-si-n-e, to himself
baba-sı-n-a, to his father
okul-u-n-a, to his school
ev-i-n-e, to his house
iş-i-n-e, to his work
kapının kolu-n-a, to the door knop
evin duvar-ı-na, to the house wall

REES,
I hope the complicated grammatical structure of Turkish language wont be putting you off. Grammer is certainly very usefull. If you like studying grammer this is fine but if you dont like it, simply forget about it. Use all the wrong suffixes and people will still understand what you are saying. Time and practice will correct these on its own.

Turkish is a very interesting language because it has the structure of root words. Even the most uncommon words are generated from simple words. An uneducated farmer would understand these kind words in most cases. At least he would have an idea o what it means even if he doesnt understand properly. I will give a few exaples. You can double click on words.

ev-evcimen-evsiz
dur-durgun-durağan
bak-bakım-bakımsız-bakış-bakışımsız

Unfortunately some people in Turkey even some more educated intellectuals find it cool to use foreign words.

Greetings Slavica,

"My first question is: can we use the infinitive instead “accusative+verb=verbal noun”?"
Normally we can`t but `istiyorum` is an exception. In fact when I teach the infinitive form I give lots of examples in my lessons with the infinitive used together with `istiyorum`.

I like swimming. > Yüzmeyi severim. > correct

I like to swim. > Yüzmek severim. > incorrect

I want to see you > Seni görmek istiyorum. > correct

I want to buy shoes > Ayakkabı almak istiyorum. > correct

-----------------------------------------------------------
DATIVE CASE: to, towards
Deniz-e gidiyorum. I go to the sea.
Okul-a gittim. I went to school.
The next example (the one you mentioned) is a good one. This shows that we need to be flexible with a foreign language. It is important to understand that a foreign language can be different. We just need to accept it as it is and move on.

Deli diyorlar bana. > They call me crazy.
Now for the shake of the grammatical structure I can force the translation:
Deli diyorlar bana. > They shout towards me `crazy` They tell to me that I`m crazy.
But these sound very unnatural. So with translations we need to be flexible. If you understand the meaning this is enough to go on learning. You might or might not translate it in any other language. Understanding is the most important part. I think words can be understood better when we see them in a sentence. And sentences can be understood better when we read a story.

But look at this example:
Bana gel. > Come to me.
Here we can see the meaning of `bana` celarly. It means `to me` or `towards me`.

When I started learing English knowing German has helped me a lot. Not because there is a lot of smillarity between languages but because I knew a foreign language could be very different. You need to relax and enjoy swimming in foreign seas.

-----------------------------------------------------------
IMPERATIVE
Slavica you know a lot about the imperative already. That`s great. When you use the imperative with other persons than you(singular) we simply need to add the personal suffixes at the end. If the imperative is ending with a vowel like in `oku` we put the buffer `y` in between.

Examples:

GELMEK:
Singulars:
1.person: Ben geleyim. > let me come
2.person: Sen gel. (polite: siz gelin) > you come
3.person: O gelsin. > he needs to come > let him come
Plurals:
1.person: Biz gelelim. > we come > let us come
2.person: Siz gelin. (polite: siz geliniz) > you come
3.person: Onlar gelsinler. > they need to come > let them come

ALMAK:
Singulars:
1.person: Ben alayım. > let me take
2.person: Sen al. (polite: siz alın) > you take
3.person: O alsın. > he takes > let him take
Plurals:
1.person: Biz alalım. > we take > let us take
2.person: Siz alın. (polite: siz alınız) > you take
3.person: Onlar alsınler. > they need to take > let them take

OKUMAK:
Singulars:
1.person: Ben okuyayım. > I read > let me read
2.person: Sen oku. (polite: siz okuyun) > you read
3.person: O okusun. > he reads > Let him read
Plurals:
1.person: Biz okuyalım. > we read > let us read
2.person: Siz okuyun. (polite: siz okuyunuz) > you read
3.person: Onlar okusunlar. > they need to read > let them read

about translations: whenever there is a second suggestion for a translation the second suggestion is much better.
First person for imperative is quite uncommon but the question form is quite common.
Ben gideyim mi? Should I go?

Here are some links:
http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Facility/3484/turkish-verb-imperative.html
http://www.turkishlanguage.co.uk/imperative.htm
http://www.everything2.com/index.pl?node_id=1717639&lastnode_id=898906
-----------------------------------------------------------

I like these three female names. I think they sound very modern Turkish and maybe because they are related to the Nature, the words and their sounds look pretty much inspiring to me. By double clicking the words you can see the meanings:

Buket
Yaprak
Yağmur

Selamlar Fatih,
bahsettiğin şarkıcı bildiğin veya dinlediğin birisi sanırım yanılıyor muyum?

Hi again Slavica,
I`m happy to know I can help others by learning Turkish.

The accusative with verbs can be used to translate these kind sentences:
I like swimming. > Yüzmeyi severim.
As you see here swimming/yüzmeyi has become the object of the sentence. Technıcally, the word swimming/yüzmeyi is called a "verbal noun" now and is no more a verb.

Ablative Case and Genitive case :
Ablative is very simple to explain. It means `from`. All the information is again on the page mentioned before.

http://www2.egenet.com.tr/mastersj/turkish-case-suffixes.html
The ablative suffixes are -den, -dan, -ten, -tan
examples:
okul > okuldan > from the school
Okuldan sıkıldım. > I'm bored from the school.

Ankara > Ankara`dan > from Ankara
Ankara`dan geliyorum. I come from Ankara.

The Ablative is the answer for any question starting with "From where/what/who...?"


The Genitive case is again simple. On the same page there is some explanation about it. The suffixes are
-in/ün/ın/un
or when after a vowel:
-nin/nün/nın/nun

Examples:
Okulun kapısı > Okul-un kapı-sı > The school's door door of the school
Denizin rengi > deniz-in renk-i > the colour of the sea

The second words with suffixes you see like kapı-sı and renk-i are different. These are the possesive suffixes.

“Limon agaci alabilirim nerede?”
This sentence is acceptable. As a simple rule, you need to put the verb always at the end.
“Limon agaci nerede alabilirim ?” would be better. The correct sentence though is:
“Limon ağacı nereden alabilirim?”

Cheers,
erdinc

Hello Slavica,

I`m sure you will be speaking turkish very well one day. I think you already can speak the basic sentences.

About `görebilmeyi`, `olmayı` etc :
This is called The Direct Object Form. It is also known as The Accusative. The suffix makes the word the object of the sentence.
Example:
Türkiye > Türkiye'yi severim.
çikolata > Çikolatayı severim.
ev > evi gördüm.
okumak > okumayı severim.
yürümek > yürümeyi severim.
The accusative can be used either with nouns or verb. In both cases the word becomes the object of the sentence. When the word is ending with a consonant the accusative suffix will be:
-i/ü/ı/u (like in ev > evi)
when the word is ending with a vowel there will be the buffer `y` added and the suffix becomes:
yi/yü/yı/yu (like in the other examles above)

Here it is important to know when used with verbs it is somewhat easier. As you know the infitive suffixes are -mak and -mek. The k at the end drops here. And we get -me and -ma. Now we need to ad the accusative suffixes. There is only one way to add them. And this is as:
-meyi
-mayı
So when the accusative is used with and verb it has to take either -meyi or -mayı. There is no third option.
More Examples:
Yüzmeyi severim.
Televizyon izlemeyi çok severim.
Türkçe konuşmayı seviyorum.
Tarkan şarkı söylemeyi bilmiyor.

About the accusative you can find everything you need just here:
http://www2.egenet.com.tr/mastersj/turkish-case-suffixes.html

About perfect tenses:
No there is another tense in turkish which can be used as equivalent of past perfect.
example:
I had seen you. > seni görmüştüm.

Maybe I shouldnt say there are no perfect tenses in turkish. Since the past perfect is pretty much met by a form of inferential past in turkish like in the above sentence. But dont worry. All these things are again too much detail. You dont need them. Even some turks dont use all these details.

The thing I wanted to say last time is that you need to use simple past tense in turkish for both translating present perfect and simple past tenses from english. So it becomes:
I have lived here. I lived here. >> Burada yaşadım.

Your example is also correct: "sevdim = I loved = I have loved". Yes well done. But here there is no past perfect tense here.

I loved: simple past tense > sevdim
I have loved: present perfect > sevdim
I had loved: past perfect > sevmiştim

If you had problems with the perfect tenses I think your language is smillar to turkish by not having present perfect tense.

There is one more thing I want to say. I think studying all these siffixes isnt a good way to go. I would never suggest a learning strategy like this. The most important thing is to understand. Learning Turkish can be easier than any language if you think this way. Look at these words for instance:

okumak
oku
okuyabilmek
okuyabilmeyi
okuyabilirim
okumalıyım
okuyabilmeliyim
okusana
okur musun?
okudun mu?

As you see all these word have the same origin: `okumak`. Probably you will understand the meaning of the sentence with any of these words. Even if you dont completely understand you might have an idea what it is about. So I suggest reading anything you can find. Suffixes will be too tiring. Dont bother with them. They will come on they own with time without much studying.
I hope this helps. Cheers,
erdinc

correction:
This is the Necessitative Mood of a very.
This is the Necessitative Mood of a verb.

daha da sıcak olacak > it will be even hotter

smillarly:
güzel > beautiful
daha güzel > more beautiful
en güzel > most beautiful

and:
daha da güzel > even more beautiful

1. git-meli-yim > I have to go
2. git-me-y-elim > let`s dont go
these two above are completely different. Lets have a closer look:

1. git-meli-yim > I have to go
This is the Necessitative Mood of a very.
suffixes are :
-meli
-malı
more examples:
yürümelisin > you have to walk
sigara iç-me-meli-sin > you must not smoke


2. git-me-y-elim > let`s dont go
This is the Subjunctive http://www.turkishlanguage.co.uk/subjmood.htm
There is also the nagative suffix -me,-ma included as you see.
examples:
gid-elim (git-elim t>d) > let`s go
konuş-alım > let's talk