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Armenian Tashnak Party: 'Armenian territories' will come off Turkey sooner or later
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| 140. |
28 Nov 2007 Wed 03:55 am |
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Quoting teaschip1: Quoting AlphaF: Check the role of US in Armenian rebellion against the OTTOMAN Empire...around year 1915.
Ask yourself why.
See if there are similarities between what US did then, and what US is trying to do now... |
When your ecomony is in the fore front and you can speak freely with out imprisonment, then talk to me.. |
Do you ever read human rights violations reports? Did you know that your mighty country has also a mighty big file there? In the past, many bad things happened to those defending unwelcome causes and many of those bad things happened in your country. We are now looking to leave the sins of the past behind us. Turkey has achieved a great deal in that department. We often criticize the US because we feel that the going is the other way around there.
As for our economy's being not so forefront- you are right; we might as well be called a banana republic compared to the US. Your economy is not doing well either but you don't feel it. Your government keeps you in a fool's paradise that runs on money coming from outside the US in the form of cheap Chinese labour, cheap production in the third world where nature is recklessly deranged by polluting industries and oil patronage. Being a superpower you have every right to drain the resources of the world to the limits. Did you know that the US (correct me if I am wrong) is the only country that hasn't signed the Kyoto protocol. It seems American people are happy burning hell a lot of gas in their 5 liter engine cars at 1 dollar a gallon and will happily invade any country that stands in the way.
You may call this a priority enjoyed by a superpower. I will stick with human rights, equality both for my own country and for all the other countries in the world. I will continue to believe that there must be integrity in all spheres of life and that includes politics.
Now tell me, how much do you care about the Iraqi people who have lost their lives since the beginning of this war? Is this bashing, name calling or what? Let me answer my own question: we are not bashing anyone here but before you childishly accuse a nation of a genocide, remember objectivity and also be man (in your case woman) enough to acknowledge the mistakes of your own government.
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| 141. |
28 Nov 2007 Wed 04:28 am |
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| 142. |
28 Nov 2007 Wed 05:07 am |
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Quoting vineyards: Quoting teaschip1: Quoting AlphaF: Check the role of US in Armenian rebellion against the OTTOMAN Empire...around year 1915.
Ask yourself why.
See if there are similarities between what US did then, and what US is trying to do now... |
When your ecomony is in the fore front and you can speak freely with out imprisonment, then talk to me.. |
Do you ever read human rights violations reports? Did you know that your mighty country has also a mighty big file there? In the past, many bad things happened to those defending unwelcome causes and many of those bad things happened in your country. We are now looking to leave the sins of the past behind us. Turkey has achieved a great deal in that department. We often criticize the US because we feel that the going is the other way around there.
As for our economy's being not so forefront- you are right; we might as well be called a banana republic compared to the US. Your economy is not doing well either but you don't feel it. Your government keeps you in a fools paradise and the extra money comes from outside the US in the form of cheap Chinese labour, cheap production in the third world where nature is recklessly deranged by polluting industries and oil patronage. Being a superpower you have every right to drain the resources of the world to the limits. Did you know that the US (correct me if I am wrong) is the only country that hasn't signed the Kyoto protocol. It seems American people are happy burning hell a lot of gas in their 5 liter engine cars at 1 dollar a gallon and will happily invade any country that stands in the way.
You may call this a priority enjoyed by a superpower. I will stick with human rights, equality both for my own country and for all the other countries in the world. I will continue to believe that there must be integrity in all spheres of life and that includes politics.
Now tell me, how much do you care about the Iraqi people who have lost their lives since the beginning of this war? Is this bashing, name calling or what? Let me answer my own question: we are not bashing anyone here but before you childishly accuse a nation of a genocide, remember objectivity and also be man (in your case woman) enough to acknowledge the mistakes of your own government. |
First of all, I never indicated that Turkey was guilty of a genocide. I mearly raised the questions as to why your government doesn't wish to further discuss this and you as well as other members CLEARLY made me realize why.
To deny or discuss the possiblity that there was a genocide continues the process. It strives to reshape history and prevents the healing of victims. It murders the dignity of the survivors and destroys the remembrance of the crime. That is why it is important to discuss!
If there is no claim to this genocide by Turkey, it has created enough discussion around the world. If Turkey seeks to join the European Union, 90 years later this has become certainly a current part of the international community and has raised many discussions, just to disregard.
I'm not Armenian, I have no vested interest. But I have no problem questioning a historical tragedy. Just like many of you pose your opinions of my governments intent..I would expect the same...
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| 143. |
28 Nov 2007 Wed 05:17 am |
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Quoting vineyards: Quoting teaschip1: Quoting AlphaF: Check the role of US in Armenian rebellion against the OTTOMAN Empire...around year 1915.
Ask yourself why.
See if there are similarities between what US did then, and what US is trying to do now... |
When your ecomony is in the fore front and you can speak freely with out imprisonment, then talk to me.. |
Do you ever read human rights violations reports? Did you know that your mighty country has also a mighty big file there? In the past, many bad things happened to those defending unwelcome causes and many of those bad things happened in your country. We are now looking to leave the sins of the past behind us. Turkey has achieved a great deal in that department. We often criticize the US because we feel that the going is the other way around there.
As for our economy's being not so forefront- you are right; we might as well be called a banana republic compared to the US. Your economy is not doing well either but you don't feel it. Your government keeps you in a fool's paradise that runs on money coming from outside the US in the form of cheap Chinese labour, cheap production in the third world where nature is recklessly deranged by polluting industries and oil patronage. Being a superpower you have every right to drain the resources of the world to the limits. Did you know that the US (correct me if I am wrong) is the only country that hasn't signed the Kyoto protocol. It seems American people are happy burning hell a lot of gas in their 5 liter engine cars at 1 dollar a gallon and will happily invade any country that stands in the way.
You may call this a priority enjoyed by a superpower. I will stick with human rights, equality both for my own country and for all the other countries in the world. I will continue to believe that there must be integrity in all spheres of life and that includes politics.
Now tell me, how much do you care about the Iraqi people who have lost their lives since the beginning of this war? Is this bashing, name calling or what? Let me answer my own question: we are not bashing anyone here but before you childishly accuse a nation of a genocide, remember objectivity and also be man (in your case woman) enough to acknowledge the mistakes of your own government. |
Sorry, I had to laugh at this $1.00 a gallon. Boy do I wish! Does this mean the trip is cancelled you were hosting? I was looking forward to it...
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| 144. |
28 Nov 2007 Wed 05:51 am |
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What makes you think Turks do not want to discuss the issue?
Do you know that a fair discussion of the issue, even between historians, is forbidden in some European countries? In France you can go to jail only by saying "There was no Armenian Genocide", even if you are a Professor of History..
If you are, really interested in a fair discussion, pls do...but give us your facts....not hearsay crap.
Tell me Armenians did not enjoy 700 hundred years of peace under Ottoman Empire,
Tell me they were not allowed to practice their religion freely,
Tell me they never donned French and Russian unuforms, while the majority of Turks were busy fighting in Gallipoli,
Tell me the Ottomans had no right to fight the rebels and traitors.
Tell me Armenians killed no Turks,
Tell me Ottomans were dumb enough to fight Armenians at Empire's weakest state, that they could not have eliminated all Armenians easily a 100 years in advance (year 1800 had they an intention of genocide in their minds.
Tell me there were no American missionaries in the area who tried to break the peace among Anatolian people.
Or keep your smart ideas to yourself and let the wounds heal between the two old friends.
Your approach is neither to the benefit of Turks, nor the Armenians in Armenia, nor Armenians living in Turkey (as Turkish citizens). It only serves a bunch of militant Armenian diaspora, who make their living by selling hatred
Our story is 90 years old....Why dont you fight for the rights of Palestinians, with the same bravery, NOW !
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| 145. |
28 Nov 2007 Wed 11:02 am |
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Quoting teaschip1: Quoting mylo: Quoting AlphaF: Remember you tried invading Vietnam too...The fat lady in Iraq did not sing yet... |
She did and she's saying get the f"""" out of my country,nobody heard her too many bullets flying around)))))) |
So are we! |
We????? Speak for yourself. You certainly DO NOT speak for the whole USA. 
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| 146. |
28 Nov 2007 Wed 11:05 am |
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Quoting AlphaF: What makes you think Turks do not want to discuss the issue?
Do you know that a fair discussion of the issue, even between historians, is forbidden in some European countries? In France you can go to jail only by saying "There was no Armenian Genocide", even if you are a Professor of History..
If you are, really interested in a fair discussion, pls do...but give us your facts....not hearsay crap.
Tell me Armenians did not enjoy 700 hundred years of peace under Ottoman Empire,
Tell me they were not allowed to practice their religion freely,
Tell me they never donned French and Russian unuforms, while the majority of Turks were busy fighting in Gallipoli,
Tell me the Ottomans had no right to fight the rebels and traitors.
Tell me Armenians killed no Turks,
Tell me Ottomans were dumb enough to fight Armenians at Empire's weakest state, that they could not have eliminated all Armenians easily a 100 years in advance (year 1800 had they an intention of genocide in their minds.
Tell me there were no American missionaries in the area who tried to break the peace among Anatolian people.
Or keep your smart ideas to yourself and let the wounds heal between the two old friends.
Your approach is neither to the benefit of Turks, nor the Armenians in Armenia, nor Armenians living in Turkey (as Turkish citizens). It only serves a bunch of militant Armenian diaspora, who make their living by selling hatred
Our story is 90 years old....Why dont you fight for the rights of Palestinians, with the same bravery, NOW ! |
I think the Turks are trying to discuss the matter, it's that others don't want to listen. Or, could it be there is another agenda?
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| 147. |
28 Nov 2007 Wed 11:44 am |
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Teaschip couldn't quite get what you are hinting at. Are you talking about the car I chose for the journey? Do you have the first idea about what kind of a journey it would be and what sort of terrain the vehicle would move on. That would certainly not be a Hummer show on the asphalt.
I am not asking to stay away from the subject. I am just asking you to be more responsible when making remarks. For my own part, I am extra cautious when talking about this problem. I have never said we did not kill the Armenians nor can I say we killed them all. I don't have proof about the number of Turks killed by the Armenians and vice versa.
How can you reach conclusions so easily when you know that this is one of the hottest political debates used by all sorts of people.
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| 148. |
28 Nov 2007 Wed 12:43 pm |
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Quoting AlphaF: What makes you think Turks do not want to discuss the issue? |
a good question, dont you think?
Quoting AlphaF:
Do you know that a fair discussion of the issue, even between historians, is forbidden in some European countries?
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the debate is not forbidden, declaring that there wasnt any holokaust is forbidden.
Quoting AlphaF:
In France you can go to jail only by saying 'There was no Armenian Genocide', even if you are a Professor of History.
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tell me if there is any historian jailed in france.
Quoting AlphaF:
Tell me Armenians did not enjoy 700 hundred years of peace under Ottoman Empire,
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tell me how they enjoyed.
Quoting AlphaF:
Tell me they were not allowed to practice their religion freely,
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oh, tell me
Quoting AlphaF:
Tell me they never donned French and Russian unuforms, while the majority of Turks were busy fighting in Gallipoli,
Tell me the Ottomans had no right to fight the rebels and traitors.
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children and women paid for the rebels.
Quoting AlphaF:
Tell me Armenians killed no Turks,
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they were killed (with no exaggeration pls)
Quoting AlphaF:
Tell me Ottomans were dumb enough to fight Armenians at Empire's weakest state, that they could not have eliminated all Armenians easily a 100 years in advance (year 1800 had they an intention of genocide in their minds.
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it has been done systematically throughout centuries. but ottomans wouldnt kill them off, why? what for? who would pay jizya? janissaries were always popular.
Quoting AlphaF:
Tell me there were no American missionaries in the area who tried to break the peace among Anatolian people.
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there were missionaries who came to educate armenians opening schools and there appeared lots of armenian intelligents who became a threat to turkey.
it was better for turks to have those armenians uneducated and poor under theior control. thats why turks have executed many of those intelligent armenians.
Quoting AlphaF:
Or keep your smart ideas to yourself and let the wounds heal between the two old friends.
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wounds would heal if its properly diagnosed.
Quoting AlphaF:
Your approach is neither to the benefit of Turks, nor the Armenians in Armenia, nor Armenians living in Turkey (as Turkish citizens). It only serves a bunch of militant Armenian diaspora, who make their living by selling hatred
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yes, many armenians learnt to live in peace with turks, its better for them not to speak. only a few are bad learners.
Quoting AlphaF:
Our story is 90 years old....Why dont you fight for the rights of Palestinians, with the same bravery, NOW ! |
this is offtopic
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| 149. |
28 Nov 2007 Wed 12:45 pm |
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Quoting alameda:
We????? Speak for yourself. You certainly DO NOT speak for the whole USA. |
i think your place is in saudi arabia, my dear liar.
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| 150. |
28 Nov 2007 Wed 12:46 pm |
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Quoting alameda:
I think the Turks are trying to discuss the matter, it's that others don't want to listen. Or, could it be there is another agenda? |
you are not only a professional liar but also a good flatterer!
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