Actually I heard a reason for Turks not to eat pork is the association with Christians, who do eat pork. But that doesnt make it less hypocritical Ive had lots of talks with friends who fast during ramazan, but drink and screw around as they please the other 11 months.  In that case I really fail to see the point. And they didnt really have an answer to it themselves.

 I have never seen an over decorated catholic church really, but thats probably my ´loss´. Did see the most important ones in Rome, maybe at that time I still had ´westernized eyes´, I do not know. Then again. Not my style!!

 Well, not all the sections of the Dolmabahçe Sarayý are kitsch, I have to agree with that. But seriously, some parts are very much over decorated (like any other palace that is) and like Ý wonder about any palace: what do they need huuuuuge rooms for, when they decide to place only 4 chairs in it   Yes as I said, it is impressive. I should look up where that room was. Ýt has a dome, which is highlighted even more because of the painting, you relaly get the idea you are looking up at some heavenly spheres or something, and it has an enormous light hanging down, of which I think it took months or even years to install, and it was a few tons of weight. Haaa why cnat I remember.

I think it would be nice if you sent Christmas wishes as well. After all, if they try to include you in their customs, you could show them a little bit of ´your world´ as well.

I am not a Christian, but I still send my friends both in the Netherlands and in Turkey Christmas cards, as for me it is a cultural feature that I was brought up with in an unreligious but English family. Nobody has been offended, actually they all quite liked it. And mind you! There´s Christmas trees and lighted reindeers on big buildings in the big cities. But Ive heard they are seen more as new years decorations than that they have got anything to do with Christmas

 Isnt there a member with that name?? The change of first letters is first what came to my mind when I saw that

 Actually the sexual part of harem is rather true, there was a gözde who was picked to sleep with the sultan whenever he pleased, and actually the girls all wanted to become the gözde. But it is not as ´male idealistic´ as orientalistic views say. I am currently reading 3 articles about it, I havent finished them yet, but they are by Gülru Necipoðlu and Leslie Peirce, and they are about the sovereignty women in the harem had. when I finish reading I will letyou know But it seems that the harem (women part) was more of a political intrigue game for power of women than the sultans sex room (which is definitely the view of orientalism I think)

And no, my mind wasnt busy with that I did wonder where all the beds were though But I was mainly intrigued by a HUGE lamp in one of the rooms. Should ask Chantal which room again it was, I forgot, but it was a VERY heavy lamp, and Im still amazed that the ceiling managed to hold it!!! Dolmabahçe is very kitsch, but very impressive in the same time.

Why did you post an empty message?

I deleted the 2 extra double threads.

Edit: it became 3 by the time I deleted 2 Sorry inþallah for deleting your post, but becuase it has already been done twice and the threads were triple, I deleted all further messages.

four

 Just the boys?

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