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Where to put the adjective
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| 1. |
04 Jan 2006 Wed 08:22 pm |
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I know that with nouns the adjective can be put either in front or after the noun in exactly the same way as in English:
Bu yaramaz köpek - this is a naughty dog
Bu köpek yaramaz - this dog is naughty
But is the same true for the position of an adjective when applied to a verb? In this thread erdinc wrote "Yüzmek çok güzel. It's very nice to swim."
Would it be OK to write:
çok güzel yüzmek ???
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| 2. |
04 Jan 2006 Wed 08:26 pm |
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I should have to look up the rule, but someone explained to me once that verbs can take the role of a noun, and then your example would become "Yüzmeyi". It has the same meaning if we would say "Swimming is nice".
I'll look for the exact rule though.
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| 3. |
04 Jan 2006 Wed 08:37 pm |
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I'm sorry Bod, your example was right. "Yüzmek çok hoş(tur)" means "Swimming is fun" indeed. The -tur comes from "olmak".
I think it would be best to put "yüzmek" first because it is the subject. The verb (-tur in this case, which you can ommit) comes at the end of the sentence.
But if you'd want to say that you love swimming, then you'd have to use the accusative, and then it would become "(Ben) yüzmeyi seviyorum".
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| 4. |
04 Jan 2006 Wed 08:42 pm |
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Quoting Elisa: I should have to look up the rule, but someone explained to me once that verbs can take the role of a noun, and then your example would become "Yüzmeyi". It has the same meaning if we would say "Swimming is nice".
I'll look for the exact rule though. |
Confused again 
How can "yüzmeyi" be "swimming is nice" - where does the "nice" part come from? Or is this a special case that cannot be applied to different adjectives?
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| 5. |
04 Jan 2006 Wed 08:49 pm |
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Sorry sorry sorry Bod!! Read my post after that one, I think it will be clearer then :-s
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| 6. |
04 Jan 2006 Wed 11:13 pm |
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Quoting bod: I know that with nouns the adjective can be put either in front or after the noun in exactly the same way as in English:
Bu yaramaz köpek - this is a naughty dog
Bu köpek yaramaz - this dog is naughty
But is the same true for the position of an adjective when applied to a verb? In this thread erdinc wrote "Yüzmek çok güzel. It's very nice to swim."
Would it be OK to write:
çok güzel yüzmek ??? |
The first example doesn't make any sense. Bu yaramaz köpek means something along the lines of "This naughty is dog". I think you mean to to say "Bu yaramaz bir köpek", which means "This is a naughty dog".
Remember, you reverse the english order when you use an adjective in combination with the indefinite article, otherwise it's the same.
e.g.
Bu oğlan uzun - This boy is tall
Bu uzun bir oğlan - This is a tall boy
As for your other examples:
Yüzmek çok güzel - This means "Swimming is very good/nice". Yüzmek in this case is acting like a noun, it is a substantive (something that acts like a noun, but usually isn't a noun).
çok güzel yüzmek - This means "To swim beautifully/nicely"
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| 7. |
05 Jan 2006 Thu 02:07 am |
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Quoting Teanga: The first example doesn't make any sense. Bu yaramaz köpek means something along the lines of "This naughty is dog". I think you mean to to say "Bu yaramaz bir köpek", which means "This is a naughty dog". |
Yes - I actually added the "bir" to the first example and then thought it didn't make sense to also add it to the second sentence. I should have thought it through more 
Quoting Teanga: Bu oğlan uzun - This boy is tall
Bu uzun bir oğlan - This is a tall boy |
Do you see any differences between these two???
Quoting Teanga: Yüzmek çok güzel - This means "Swimming is very good/nice". |
Yes - that is more how I would have translated it.
But I got confused as erdinc (a native Turk I believe) said "Yüzmek çok güzel. It's very nice to swim."
The translation I would have adopted would be "to swim is very nice" so as to keep the verbal infinitive tense.
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| 8. |
05 Jan 2006 Thu 02:21 am |
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Quoting bod:
Quoting Teanga: Bu oğlan uzun - This boy is tall
Bu uzun bir oğlan - This is a tall boy |
Do you see any differences between these two???
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Yes, the first refers to ONE boy and only one boy. Commenting on how TALL he is. The second sentence gives the meaning of this is a tall boy, but there are many others.
The first sentence is more definite. The second one is indefinite. It's hard to explain as there is only a slight difference between them, but the meaning could change in different contexts.
Quoting bod:
Quoting Teanga: Yüzmek çok güzel - This means "Swimming is very good/nice". |
Yes - that is more how I would have translated it.
But I got confused as erdinc (a native Turk I believe) said "Yüzmek çok güzel. It's very nice to swim."
The translation I would have adopted would be "to swim is very nice" so as to keep the verbal infinitive tense. |
It can be translated as that as well. However, "to swim is very nice" isn't very natural. It's more natural to say "Swimming is really good". "Swimming" being a verb acting as a noun and "to swim" being the infinitive form of a verb.
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| 9. |
05 Jan 2006 Thu 02:33 am |
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Quoting Teanga: However, "to swim is very nice" isn't very natural. It's more natural to say "Swimming is really good". "Swimming" being a verb acting as a noun and "to swim" being the infinitive form of a verb. |
"swimming" is not really acting as a noun.......
In English it is a participle - as I understand things* Türkçe does not have any participles so there is no direct comparison.
*It is 5 weeks since I first started learning Türkçe so I may very well be wrong in my understanding!!!
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| 10. |
05 Jan 2006 Thu 02:39 am |
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Quoting bod: Quoting Teanga: However, "to swim is very nice" isn't very natural. It's more natural to say "Swimming is really good". "Swimming" being a verb acting as a noun and "to swim" being the infinitive form of a verb. |
"swimming" is not really acting as a noun.......
In English it is a participle - as I understand things* Türkçe does not have any participles so there is no direct comparison.
*It is 5 weeks since I first started learning Türkçe so I may very well be wrong in my understanding!!! |
Swimming is acting as the subject of the sentence. It is a substantive, something which acts as a noun. Its correct grammatical term is a "Verbal Noun".
You can't directly compare the grammar of two languages from two different families. Turkish does have participles, they just act in a slightly different way.
Don't worry, your understanding of the grammar will come in time.
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