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Mother Teresa
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20. |
01 Mar 2009 Sun 08:25 pm |
Sorry to disturb this, but Saint Nicholas is NOT the same as Santa Claus. We celebrate it not on December 6th but on the 5th (here is Wiki wrong!). Saint Nicholas (or Sinterklaas / Sint Nicolaas) was in reality born in Myra (now Demre), is burried in Bari in Italy and for us (our kids) he lives in Spain. He rides a white horse and has black helpers (Zwarte Pieten / Black Peters). Your Santa Claus lives near Rovaniemi in Finland, Northpole area. This one rides a sledge with reindeer and his helpers are elves.
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21. |
01 Mar 2009 Sun 08:44 pm |
Sorry to disturb this, but Saint Nicholas is NOT the same as Santa Claus. We celebrate it not on December 6th but on the 5th (here is Wiki wrong!). Saint Nicholas (or Sinterklaas / Sint Nicolaas) was in reality born in Myra (now Demre), is burried in Bari in Italy and for us (our kids) he lives in Spain. He rides a white horse and has black helpers (Zwarte Pieten / Black Peters). Your Santa Claus lives near Rovaniemi in Finland, Northpole area. This one rides a sledge with reindeer and his helpers are elves.
I´m gonna send my Santa Claus to beat your Sinterklaas up!
Black helpers?
Edited (3/1/2009) by Melek74
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22. |
01 Mar 2009 Sun 08:57 pm |
I remembered something about the black men. It´s a bit by David Sedaris about Santa Claus. It´s called "6 to 8 Black Men". I think you´d enjoy it.
Here´s the best part:
"The words silly and unrealistic were redefined when I learned that Saint Nicholas travels with what was consistently described as "six to eight black men." I asked several Dutch people to narrow it down, but none of them could give me an exact number. It was always "six to eight," which seems strange, seeing as they´ve had hundreds of years to get a decent count.
The six to eight black men were characterized as personal slaves until the mid-fifties, when the political climate changed and it was decided that instead of being slaves they were just good friends. I think history has proven that something usually comes between slavery and friendship, a period of time marked not by cookies and quiet times beside the fire but by bloodshed and mutual hostility. They have such violence in Holland, but rather than duking it out among themselves, Santa and his former slaves decided to take it out on the public. In the early years, if a child was naughty, Saint Nicholas and the six to eight black men would beat him with what Oscar described as "the small branch of a tree."
"A switch?"
"Yes," he said. "That´s it. They´d kick him and beat him with a switch. Then, if the youngster was really bad, they´d put him in a sack and take him back to Spain."
"Saint Nicholas would kick you?"
"Well, not anymore," Oscar said. "Now he just pretends to kick you."
"And the six to eight black men?"
"Them, too."
He considered this to be progressive, but in a way I think it´s almost more perverse than the original punishment. "I´m going to hurt you, but not really." How many times have we fallen for that line? The fake slap invariably makes contact, adding the elements of shock and betrayal to what had previously been plain, old- fashioned fear. What kind of Santa spends his time pretending to kick people before stuffing them into a canvas sack? Then, of course, you´ve got the six to eight former slaves who could potentially go off at any moment. This, I think, is the greatest difference between us and the Dutch. While a certain segment of our population might be perfectly happy with the arrangement, if you told the average white American that six to eight nameless black men would be sneaking into his house in the middle of the night, he would barricade the doors and arm himself with whatever he could get his hands on.
"Six to eight, did you say?"
In the years before central heating, Dutch children would leave their shoes by the fireplace, the promise being that unless they planned to beat you, kick you, or stuff you into a sack, Saint Nicholas and the six to eight black men would fill your clogs with presents. Aside from the threats of violence and kidnapping, it´s not much different from hanging your stockings from the mantel. Now that so few people have a working fireplace, Dutch children are instructed to leave their shoes beside the radiator, furnace, or space heater. Saint Nicholas and the six to eight black men arrive on horses, which jump from the yard onto the roof. At this point, I guess, they either jump back down and use the door, or they stay put and vaporize through the pipes and electrical wires. Oscar wasn´t too clear about the particulars, but, really, who can blame him? We have the same problem with our Santa. He´s supposed to use the chimney, but if you don´t have one, he still manages to come through. It´s best not to think about it too hard.
While eight flying reindeer are a hard pill to swallow, our Christmas story remains relatively simple. Santa lives with his wife in a remote polar village and spends one night a year traveling around the world. If you´re bad, he leaves you coal. If you´re good and live in America, he´ll give you just about anything you want. We tell our children to be good and send them off to bed, where they lie awake, anticipating their great bounty. A Dutch parent has a decidedly hairier story to relate, telling his children, "Listen, you might want to pack a few of your things together before you go to bed. The former bishop from Turkey will be coming along with six to eight black men. They might put some candy in your shoes, they might stuff you in a sack and take you to Spain, or they might just pretend to kick you. We don´t know for sure, but we want you to be prepared."
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23. |
01 Mar 2009 Sun 09:12 pm |
I remembered something about the black men. It´s a bit by David Sedaris about Santa Claus. It´s called "6 to 8 Black Men". I think you´d enjoy it.
Here´s the best part:
"The words silly and unrealistic were redefined when I learned that Saint Nicholas travels with what was consistently described as "six to eight black men." I asked several Dutch people to narrow it down, but none of them could give me an exact number. It was always "six to eight," which seems strange, seeing as they´ve had hundreds of years to get a decent count.
The six to eight black men were characterized as personal slaves until the mid-fifties, when the political climate changed and it was decided that instead of being slaves they were just good friends. I think history has proven that something usually comes between slavery and friendship, a period of time marked not by cookies and quiet times beside the fire but by bloodshed and mutual hostility. They have such violence in Holland, but rather than duking it out among themselves, Santa and his former slaves decided to take it out on the public. In the early years, if a child was naughty, Saint Nicholas and the six to eight black men would beat him with what Oscar described as "the small branch of a tree."
"A switch?"
"Yes," he said. "That´s it. They´d kick him and beat him with a switch. Then, if the youngster was really bad, they´d put him in a sack and take him back to Spain."
"Saint Nicholas would kick you?"
"Well, not anymore," Oscar said. "Now he just pretends to kick you."
"And the six to eight black men?"
"Them, too."
He considered this to be progressive, but in a way I think it´s almost more perverse than the original punishment. "I´m going to hurt you, but not really." How many times have we fallen for that line? The fake slap invariably makes contact, adding the elements of shock and betrayal to what had previously been plain, old- fashioned fear. What kind of Santa spends his time pretending to kick people before stuffing them into a canvas sack? Then, of course, you´ve got the six to eight former slaves who could potentially go off at any moment. This, I think, is the greatest difference between us and the Dutch. While a certain segment of our population might be perfectly happy with the arrangement, if you told the average white American that six to eight nameless black men would be sneaking into his house in the middle of the night, he would barricade the doors and arm himself with whatever he could get his hands on.
"Six to eight, did you say?"
In the years before central heating, Dutch children would leave their shoes by the fireplace, the promise being that unless they planned to beat you, kick you, or stuff you into a sack, Saint Nicholas and the six to eight black men would fill your clogs with presents. Aside from the threats of violence and kidnapping, it´s not much different from hanging your stockings from the mantel. Now that so few people have a working fireplace, Dutch children are instructed to leave their shoes beside the radiator, furnace, or space heater. Saint Nicholas and the six to eight black men arrive on horses, which jump from the yard onto the roof. At this point, I guess, they either jump back down and use the door, or they stay put and vaporize through the pipes and electrical wires. Oscar wasn´t too clear about the particulars, but, really, who can blame him? We have the same problem with our Santa. He´s supposed to use the chimney, but if you don´t have one, he still manages to come through. It´s best not to think about it too hard.
While eight flying reindeer are a hard pill to swallow, our Christmas story remains relatively simple. Santa lives with his wife in a remote polar village and spends one night a year traveling around the world. If you´re bad, he leaves you coal. If you´re good and live in America, he´ll give you just about anything you want. We tell our children to be good and send them off to bed, where they lie awake, anticipating their great bounty. A Dutch parent has a decidedly hairier story to relate, telling his children, "Listen, you might want to pack a few of your things together before you go to bed. The former bishop from Turkey will be coming along with six to eight black men. They might put some candy in your shoes, they might stuff you in a sack and take you to Spain, or they might just pretend to kick you. We don´t know for sure, but we want you to be prepared."
Typical American. No, these are NOT the real stories. Peter is black, yes. There are two reasons, and both are not because he is/was a personal slave. The first is because Peter is probably from Moroccon/Arabian descent (as in Spain many ´Moors´ were centuries ago) which explains his dark colour. Second is the chimney storey, he became black because of all the dirt. Many Peters here are not covered neat with make-up but with white parts in their faces, as if there is really soot in their skin.
Six to eight? Never heard that number before, most just 1 or 2. Only the ´real´ Sinterklaas - who appears on television every year half November arriving by steam ship from Spain has hundreds, all in charge of something else: cooking Piet, gift wrapping Piet, co-ordinating Piet, writing-Piet, horse-Piet (taking care of Amerigo, Sinterklaas´ white horse), captain-Piet (boss of the ship) etc. etc.
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24. |
01 Mar 2009 Sun 09:30 pm |
Typical American. No, these are NOT the real stories. ...
Six to eight? Never heard that number before, most just 1 or 2. Only the ´real´ Sinterklaas - who appears on television every year half November arriving by steam ship from Spain has hundreds, all in charge of something else: cooking Piet, gift wrapping Piet, co-ordinating Piet, writing-Piet, horse-Piet (taking care of Amerigo, Sinterklaas´ white horse), captain-Piet (boss of the ship) etc. etc.
NOT real stories? I have to say it´s somewhat dissapointing there will be no 6-8 black Peters coming to my home in the middle of the night.
Sedaris is a humor writer, and that bit I quoted is super funny when you hear him read it (it really wasn´t meant as a true portrayal of Dutch Christmas traditions). He also has great ones about learning French, which all of us, who study languages, can greatly relate to.
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25. |
01 Mar 2009 Sun 10:34 pm |
I have moved this thread as I think it has been determined that Mother Teresa is not Turkish.
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26. |
01 Mar 2009 Sun 11:03 pm |
I have moved this thread as I think it has been determined that Mother Teresa is not Turkish.
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27. |
01 Mar 2009 Sun 11:20 pm |
I have moved this thread as I think it has been determined that Mother Teresa is not Turkish.
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28. |
01 Mar 2009 Sun 11:26 pm |
I have moved this thread as I think it has been determined that Mother Teresa is not Turkish
you should check your genotype libra..it may turn out u r more Turkish than you ever have thought of it..hihi..not to mention mother T or the pope John Paul the 2nd..
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29. |
01 Mar 2009 Sun 11:31 pm |
I have moved this thread as I think it has been determined that Mother Teresa is not Turkish
you should check your genotype libra..it may turn out u r more Turkish than you ever have thought of it..hihi..not to mention mother T or the pope John Paul the 2nd..
I think she has always said that she carries some Turkish genes..no?
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30. |
01 Mar 2009 Sun 11:35 pm |
I think she has always said that she carries some Turkish genes..no?
Mother Theresa???said that???hmmm...you should get back to her works...she insisted on love..not genes..universal love
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