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Turkish Poetry and Literature

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A brief Turkish article about frienship
1.       og2009
394 posts
 26 Oct 2015 Mon 01:50 am

GOOD PEOPLE

Being a good person is not so easy, it requires sincerity, effort, altruism and knowledge

Being a good person does not depend on your ethnic group, religion, status in your life, race, skin color, political views or culture.

It depends on how you treats others.

2.       peyote
101 posts
 26 Oct 2015 Mon 08:09 pm

 

Quoting og2009

GOOD PEOPLE

Being a good person is not so easy, it requires sincerity, effort, altruism and knowledge

Being a good person does not depend on your ethnic group, religion, status in your life, race, skin color, political views or culture.

It depends on how you treats others.

 

not sure if altrusim is the right word in this statement : The basic principle of altruism is that man has no right to exist for his own sake, that service to others is the only justification of his existence, and that self-sacrifice is his highest moral duty, virtue and value.

Do not confuse altruism with kindness, good will or respect for the rights of others. These are not primaries, but consequences, which, in fact, altruism makes impossible. The irreducible primary of altruism, the basic absolute, is self-sacrifice—which means; self-immolation, self-abnegation, self-denial, self-destruction—which means: the self as a standard of evil, the selfless as a standard of the good.

Do not hide behind such superficialities as whether you should or should not give a dime to a beggar. That is not the issue. The issue is whether you do or do not have the right to exist without giving him that dime. The issue is whether you must keep buying your life, dime by dime, from any beggar who might choose to approach you. The issue is whether the need of others is the first mortgage on your life and the moral purpose of your existence. The issue is whether man is to be regarded as a sacrificial animal. Any man of self-esteem will answer: “No.” Altruism says: “Yes.

this is Ayn Rand´s definition of altrusim



Edited (10/26/2015) by peyote

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3.       JNQ
465 posts
 27 Oct 2015 Tue 11:34 am

But the question wasn´t if you have a right to exist, but if you are a good person without altruism. Or kindness for that matter. Can you be a good person without kindness (if not altruism)? Or effort and wisdom? Can stupid people not be good people? Maybe stupid people are the only ones who can effortlessly be good people



Edited (10/27/2015) by JNQ

4.       peyote
101 posts
 27 Oct 2015 Tue 06:05 pm

 

Quoting JNQ

But the question wasn´t if you have a right to exist, but if you are a good person without altruism. Or kindness for that matter. Can you be a good person without kindness (if not altruism)? Or effort and wisdom? Can stupid people not be good people? Maybe stupid people are the only ones who can effortlessly be good people

 

First it was never a question it was a statement.

. The original statement was regarding "that being a good person required  effort,altruism , knowledge and sincerity.  It is almost impossible to have all these qualities combined. It would be unclear whether the action in interest  is altruistic or self-aggrandizing, humane or prurient, psychopathic or admirable. Re read what Ayn Rand said about true altrusim. Humans can not be true to altruistic behaviour because if they did they would stop looking after themselves. I am not saying there are not good and great and helpful people in this world. I just said that altruism was the wrong word to use in that particular statement. Many religions like to supplement this word in for a person who is self sacrifing to a god for a purpose which would again be egotistical as they most often do it for a selfish reason. ( to get into heaven or what ever hierarchy upper echelon system that exist ).

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5.       JNQ
465 posts
 27 Oct 2015 Tue 11:23 pm

 

Quoting peyote

 

 

First it was never a question it was a statement.

I meant ´question´ in the meaning of ´issue´ (like Dutch ´kwestie´

And I think we agree. No need to get all worked up

 

 

6.       peyote
101 posts
 28 Oct 2015 Wed 02:06 am

 

Quoting JNQ

 

I meant ´question´ in the meaning of ´issue´ (like Dutch ´kwestie´

And I think we agree. No need to get all worked up

 

 

 

not worked up Can you define a good person. hmmmm

A good person is really subjective to the individual. There´s no objectively correct answer, just opinions. The same goes for commendable or detestable actions. You can look to common thought for an answer. Or laws. But those aren´t your own thoughts. If there´s an intersection of your moral opinions and law those opinions in the intersection may have been developed by your personal experience, which is individual to you; Also, may have been developed under a social influence - being common thought of the law.I would better like to describe someone as a descent person. Because we all know under direst or stress we can turn pretty ugly very quickly and the need to survive kicks in.

7.       JNQ
465 posts
 31 Oct 2015 Sat 11:29 am

 

Quoting peyote

 

 

not worked up Can you define a good person. hmmmm

A good person is really subjective to the individual. There´s no objectively correct answer, just opinions. The same goes for commendable or detestable actions. You can look to common thought for an answer. Or laws. But those aren´t your own thoughts. If there´s an intersection of your moral opinions and law those opinions in the intersection may have been developed by your personal experience, which is individual to you; Also, may have been developed under a social influence - being common thought of the law.I would better like to describe someone as a descent person. Because we all know under direst or stress we can turn pretty ugly very quickly and the need to survive kicks in.

 

May have been developed? I think the concept of goodness only exists in a cultural environment and through development of culture. There are tribes still today where the concept of goodness doesn´t even exist. We´re making it all up ourselves

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8.       peyote
101 posts
 31 Oct 2015 Sat 09:01 pm

 

Quoting JNQ

 

 

May have been developed? I think the concept of goodness only exists in a cultural environment and through development of culture. There are tribes still today where the concept of goodness doesn´t even exist. We´re making it all up ourselves

 

Your viewpoint would be called consequentialism. The idea is that the consequence of our goodness by society is valued hypothetically world wide by goodness versus selfishness/evilness.

We all have to remember that even the worse criminal/evil person has done what could be deemed as goodness or kind acts at some point in their life. This does not mean they are a good person.

9.       JNQ
465 posts
 01 Nov 2015 Sun 07:58 pm

It could be the other way around. Someone could have done a terrible thing but still be a good person. Who decides? We do, according to our culture and culturally developed morals. 

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