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1.       Tazx1
434 posts
 15 Jan 2016 Fri 09:27 pm

I copy a sentence below.  Please can a native speaker of Turkish translate it for me into English.  The use of ´ramen´ is causing me problem!!

>500 y覺ll覺k iktidar覺na ramen Turk dilinin dayat覺lmad覺覺 görülür<

If ´ramen´ is properly used ... should it not then be ´dayat覺lma-ma-d覺覺´ ....???

Thanks

2.       tunci
7148 posts
 16 Jan 2016 Sat 02:02 am

 

Quoting Tazx1

I copy a sentence below.  Please can a native speaker of Turkish translate it for me into English.  The use of ´ramen´ is causing me problem!!

>500 y覺ll覺k iktidar覺na ramen Turk dilinin dayat覺lmad覺覺 görülür<

If ´ramen´ is properly used ... should it not then be ´dayat覺lma-ma-d覺覺´ ....???

Thanks

 

-ramen is properly used in the sentence because ,

 

The structure is  .............e/a  ramen 

                      despite....................

500 y覺ll覺k iktidarI-n-a   ramen............

Despite the 500 years of his[or its] rule [authority over area and its people].........

 

Despite the 500 years of its rule [I guess Ottoman Empire ?], It is seen that Turkish Language was not imposed [on people by Ottomans ]

500 y覺ll覺k iktidar覺na ramen Turk dilinin dayat覺lmad覺覺 görülür.

 




Edited (1/16/2016) by tunci

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3.       Tazx1
434 posts
 16 Jan 2016 Sat 06:19 pm

Thank you tunci efendi.  My problem is when ´-ma´ is used as a light form ... as meaning ´-ing´ in English!!  So ´Yapmak´ [to make] is the heavy form ... while ´Yapma´ [making] is the the light form!!  In the sentence I copied, intuitively I knew that it MUST mean ... ´not imposed´.  But ´dayatilma´ .... does it not mean ´Impos-ing´ ... as in ´Yapma´??? Should it not be ´dayatilma-ma-d覺覺´ for ´not imposing?

I get confused as to when ´-ma´ means ... ´-ing´ and when ´-ma´ means ´NOT´. 

Can you please explain this to me!!  Thanks.

Tazx1

 

 

 



Edited (1/16/2016) by Tazx1 [typo]

4.       cymanteg
19 posts
 17 Jan 2016 Sun 12:19 pm

Hello.

It should be "dayat覺lmad覺覺" because the verb is "dayat-覺l-mak"

dayat-覺l-ma-d覺-()覺

"-ma" is used to make this sentence negative, not an "-ing" form.

Also if the verb root (dayat-) takes a negative form (-ma) and it´s used with -d覺k/dik (or with "ramen", d覺a/die) it cannot take "-ing" form.

JNQ liked this message
5.       JNQ
465 posts
 17 Jan 2016 Sun 12:19 pm

 

Quoting Tazx1

Thank you tunci efendi.  My problem is when ´-ma´ is used as a light form ... as meaning ´-ing´ in English!!  So ´Yapmak´ [to make] is the heavy form ... while ´Yapma´ [making] is the the light form!!  In the sentence I copied, intuitively I knew that it MUST mean ... ´not imposed´.  But ´dayatilma´ .... does it not mean ´Impos-ing´ ... as in ´Yapma´??? Should it not be ´dayatilma-ma-d覺覺´ for ´not imposing?

I get confused as to when ´-ma´ means ... ´-ing´ and when ´-ma´ means ´NOT´. 

Can you please explain this to me!!  Thanks.

Tazx1

 

Yapma is not just a light form of yapmak, it is a noun. -ma is used to create nouns from verbs.

Yapma does not simply mean making (like I´m making pie), it means THE making (noun).

Be careful not to literally translate -ing with -ma, there is a great difference in usage of -ma in Turkish.

In a construction with ramen you have to use the verb, not the noun. 

Therefor you start with the root verb -dayat- (impose) and add the suffixes -覺l (be~), -d覺k (that), -覺 (object)

I trust a native will correct me if I´m wrong.



Edited (1/17/2016) by JNQ

cymanteg liked this message
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