Travelling to Turkey |
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How (not) to do it - Harams/helals
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18 Feb 2008 Mon 07:56 pm |
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Quoting azade: Apparently islam is fast growing in the USA, but as for the reasons I haven't really checked that out.
Of the many reverts I know in Denmark I'd say 90-95% of them converted without the influence of others (eg. muslim men  ), because most of them don't even know any muslim men and are single. Most of those who are married say that they are more devoted to religion than their men.
In islam it's also a sin to convert with the wrong intention, i.e. not because of genuine faith. |
Funny enough, azade, here in the US there are also support groups for former muslims (mainly women).
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18 Feb 2008 Mon 08:08 pm |
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Possibly it's for women from cultures where they were not treated well. There's relatively many iranians in the USA, right?
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18 Feb 2008 Mon 08:15 pm |
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Quoting AEnigma III: Quoting alameda: However, my contention:
The most dangerous people are those with nothing left to loose....or those who feel they have lost their dignity, self worth. |
This man was a 30 year old teaching assistant, who was a loving family man, was married with a child, and had a very comfortable life, living in the UK with more rights than he would ever have in his own country. All his family are astonished that he would ever do such a thing.
Now please tell me how this man felt he had lost dignity or self worth? This is not a suicide. This is a terrorist attack in the name of extremist muslims with the promise of eternal paradise for the bomber. |
how about this man? was he living in a poverty getting 1600L benefits from the gov?
www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=515633&in_page_id=1770
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18 Feb 2008 Mon 08:16 pm |
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Quoting femme_fatal: Quoting alameda:
What is needed is more education. The problem now is one of how things are interpreted. For instance the whole veil thing from what There is an ayat in the Quran saying roughly saying the believing woman should draw her outer garment over herself. Some interpret this and put the woman in a tent, others cover the head and face, some just the head others think it means to dress modestly.
Also, it is not a lot of Azade's marrying Muslim men that account for the growth in Islam. Certainly Michael Wolfe,Cat Stevens aka Yousef Islam, Roger Garaudy, Martin Lings Aminah Assilmi |
so i was right
and hoandsome is wrong
islam is the fastest growing islam thanks to dudus and azades, alamedas and peace trains!
i know
i know
even neil armstrong converted beyond his knowledge
cat stevens is indeed "highly spritied" personality |
Dont be so sure of yourself femme..
I remember reading it in bbc or theindependent. I just could not find the article. As soon as I find I will let you know. Islam is not the fastest growing religion I am afraid!!
Alameda..
I dont think the education is the biggest problem in Islam..
There are specific references to hand chopping for example; there is clear indication that women and men are not treated equally..
How can you sort these type of problems?
well..you cant.
But we also know that many things in Quran , including above examples, are outdated for the time we are living in..
Dont you agree?
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18 Feb 2008 Mon 08:31 pm |
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Quoting thehandsom:
Dont be so sure of yourself femme..
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eeee! im as confident as you are in your love towards me
Quoting thehandsom:
I remember reading it in bbc or theindependent. I just could not find the article. As soon as I find I will let you know. Islam is not the fastest growing religion I am afraid!!
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i can give you other sources disproving it
Quoting thehandsom:
Alameda..
I dont think the education is the biggest problem in Islam..
There are specific references to hand chopping for example; there is clear indication that women and men are not treated equally..
How can you sort these type of problems?
well..you cant.
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although im not alameda i wanna ask you, alameda doesnt give a fart to the fact that the education in the middles east is completely islamic. they are educated about islam from their early childhood. so whats wrong with this education that has beed practised throughout more than a thousand years?
Quoting thehandsom:
But we also know that many things in Quran , including above examples, are outdated for the time we are living in..
Dont you agree?
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are you insinuating that the divine text being outdated?
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18 Feb 2008 Mon 09:06 pm |
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Quoting thehandsom: Alameda..
I dont think the education is the biggest problem in Islam..
There are specific references to hand chopping for example; there is clear indication that women and men are not treated equally..
How can you sort these type of problems?
well..you cant.
But we also know that many things in Quran , including above examples, are outdated for the time we are living in..
Dont you agree?
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I still think it's related to education, which leads to greater understanding. For instance where does it actually say in the Quran that one's hand should be litteraly cut off, or one should be stoned to death for adultery?
I believe this is something that came later. Also, could it not be that it means stopping access to the ability to steal? If one reads the Hadiths, one can see there was a great deal of compassion from the Prophet (saw) in dealing with these issues.
I have found reading the works of this woman:
Riffat Hassan
"The Pakistani academic has made a name for herself through her progressive and enlightened interpretation of Islam and the teachings of the Quran."
more on Riffat Hassan
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18 Feb 2008 Mon 09:12 pm |
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Quoting thehandsom:
But we also know that many things in Quran , including above examples, are outdated for the time we are living in..
Dont you agree?
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AGREE 
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18 Feb 2008 Mon 09:22 pm |
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Quoting azade: Possibly it's for women from cultures where they were not treated well. There's relatively many iranians in the USA, right? |
There are a lot of refugees from Muslim areas, like Afhganistan, Iran, Somalia, Bosnia, Kosovo, Somalia, Tatar Crimean Turks and others. It's amazing to see the struggles they go through as the different generations pass time here. Even the ones who are first generation, but were children when they arrived go through radical changes. It's actually painful to be a witness to their cultural turmoil.
I was working with a youth group where there were some refugees dressed in very modern hip hop garments, but their parents still wore the traditional cloths.
I have some Afghani friends who I visit from time to time. Their son listens to Hip Hop music, dresses in baggy cloths. Downstairs the mother sits on the floor making traditional food. The older sons have Western girlfriends, one daughter married an "American", much to the father and mothers shame. Little by little they learn to accept, but it is a painful process.
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18 Feb 2008 Mon 09:26 pm |
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Quoting alameda:
For instance where does it actually say in the Quran that one's hand should be litteraly cut off, or one should be stoned to death for adultery?
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005.038
YUSUFALI: As to the thief, Male or female, cut off his or her hands: a punishment by way of example, from Allah, for their crime: and Allah is Exalted in power.
PICKTHAL: As for the thief, both male and female, cut off their hands. It is the reward of their own deeds, an exemplary punishment from Allah. Allah is Mighty, Wise.
SHAKIR: And (as for) the man who steals and the woman who steals, cut off their hands as a punishment for what they have earned, an exemplary punishment from Allah; and Allah is Mighty, Wise.
Quoting alameda:
If one reads the Hadiths, one can see there was a great deal of compassion from the Prophet (saw) in dealing with these issues.
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sahih bukhari
seems like a wonderful prophet himself loved butchering 
Volume 8, Book 81, Number 790:
Narrated 'Abdullah bin 'Umar:
The Prophet cutoff the hand of a thief for stealing a shield that was worth three Dirhams.
Volume 8, Book 81, Number 791:
Narrated Abu Huraira:
Allah 's Apostle said, 'Allah curses the thief who steals an egg (or a helmet) for which his hand is to be cut off, or steals a rope, for which his hand is to be cut off.'
Volume 8, Book 81, Number 792:
Narrated 'Aisha:
The Prophet cut off the hand of a lady, and that lady used to come to me, and I used to convey her message to the Prophet and she repented, and her repentance was sincere.
Quoting alameda:
I have found reading the works of this woman:
Riffat Hassan
'The Pakistani academic has made a name for herself through her progressive and enlightened interpretation of Islam and the teachings of the Quran.'
more on Riffat Hassan |
that woman is a liar just like you, alameda.
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18 Feb 2008 Mon 09:50 pm |
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Quoting thehandsom: wow..your post seemed quite long but after taking off my post from it, it now, looks really weak and thin |
Checkmate ! 
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