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Forum Messages Posted by alameda

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Thread: Turkish ladies

3301.       alameda
3499 posts
 08 Oct 2007 Mon 09:32 pm

No, that is not what I wrote or was trying to express. My point was, being obsessed with looks is not a unique trait of Turkish women. It is a trait held by many woman internationally. When discussing cultural traits, one looks for something unique, not a common trait held in many other cultures. Is that clear enough for you?

Quoting catwoman:

Alameda, you're saying "because american women are also obsessed with looks, we shouldn't talk about turkish women", which I don't think makes sense. It is worth to talk about it even if it was just because of the fact that the way american women obsess about looks, (express their emotions, the things they think about in their lives) are all very different from turkish women.



So the How that is different would be more useful, in this case. You were not specific on how that difference manifests itself in Turkish culture.



Thread: Turkish ladies

3302.       alameda
3499 posts
 08 Oct 2007 Mon 08:53 pm

Here is what your synopsis of Turkish women was:
"The one generalization that I think is accurate is that most Turkish women are unfortunately very much obsessed with looks, which is really not surprising, looking at Turkish media. Overall they are nice and friendly, just like Turks in general."

Do you think they are more obsessed with looks than American women? In the US there is an epedemic of anorexia and bulimia....all related to looking a certain way, with very destructive results. Women wearing childish garments that are not at all age appropriate, in order to look younger and more appealing.

And talk about media....Turkish media has nothing on US media concerning the propagation of women looking sexy. I have noticed European media being much better.

I forget what film it was, but they had to go to Europe to find an actress who had not been botoxed, nipped and tucked to look much younger. One sees women in the US competing with 20 year olds in the looks department.

FWIW from the many Turkish women I've met, the one characteristic that stands out is their good manners and ettiquette. This I have seen from highly educated women to simple country women.

Quoting catwoman:

Quoting alameda:

From what I easily understood reading Badiadancer's post was: Your post didn't say anything that was unique to Turkish women.


Of course that's not true, there are unique things in Turkish women, though they're not easy to describe. Of course there are individual differences and it's wrong to say that "every Turkish woman is x and y". But at the same time there certainly are cultural differences that are worthwhile to talk about.
I wrote what I wrote earlier because I wanted to emphasize that there are differences and the similarities are not straightforward. It's important to not make generalizations that are not true, but at the same time some ARE true to a noticeable extent.




Thread: Turkish ladies

3303.       alameda
3499 posts
 08 Oct 2007 Mon 08:22 pm

From what I easily understood reading Badiadancer's post was: Your post didn't say anything that was unique to Turkish women. What you said could be attributed to any people, any place, anytime. What you said was true about all humans.....and you didn't give her time to respond regarding "I even asked you to explain better why it's SO wrong to try and talk about how culture affects people"

Some people don't devote full time to responding here.

Quoting catwoman:

Quoting Badiabdancer74:

It's sarcasm. "they are human beings...Who would have thought!" is the same as "they are human beings...duhhh!" It doesn't work well in written form without inflection. If you aren't a native English speaker, you really might not understand it so I explained. I suppose I could write anything and someone is going to pick out one line and try to make a fight. My point being I think humans have a lot more in common cross-culturally than they do differences.


And so do I. Strange though that you write things that can be made into a fight and then you're surprised that someone responds with the same sarcasm... and then - YOU make it into a fight! I even asked you to explain better why it's SO wrong to try and talk about how culture affects people.





Thread: Turkish ladies

3304.       alameda
3499 posts
 08 Oct 2007 Mon 06:54 pm

Quoting catwoman:

Of course they can't be lumped together (and nobody is trying to do that!), but THERE ARE cultural differences. Would you mind being more clear on how asking about "Turkish ladies" implies to you that they're not human beings???



So....what are the cultural differences? From your post it was not easy to see any. It seems you feel the major defining attribute is:

"The one generalization that I think is accurate is that most Turkish women are unfortunately very much obsessed with looks, which is really not surprising, looking at Turkish media. Overall they are nice and friendly, just like Turks in general."

You don't think that is an attribute shared in other places? How about the epidemic of Anorexia Nervosa,

"Social and environmental factors
Sociocultural studies have highlighted the role of cultural factors, such as the promotion of thinness as the ideal female form in Western industrialised nations, particularly through the media. A recent epidemiological study of 989,871 Swedish residents indicated that gender, ethnicity and socio-economic status were large influences on the chance of developing anorexia, with those with non-European parents among the least likely to be diagnosed with the condition, and those in wealthy, white families being most at risk."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anorexia_nervosa

Or....Bulimia nervosa?



Thread: Mercan Dede - Sufi Sounds

3305.       alameda
3499 posts
 08 Oct 2007 Mon 06:42 pm

What do you find so narcissistic about that? He said "some". Certainly there are "some" with much greater flaws, don't you agree? Or do you think otherwise?

Quoting catwoman:

Quoting vineyards:

That's another proof that Turks are crazy about being admired. Having said this, I wish the shortcomings of some other cultures were as benign as this little flaw.


That narcissistic? Unbelievable!





Thread: Mercan Dede - Sufi Sounds

3306.       alameda
3499 posts
 07 Oct 2007 Sun 09:10 pm

I don't know any person or culture that does not like being admired. Who would like to be held in disdain? Would one who prefers to be held in disdain be considered emotionally healthy?

Quoting vineyards:

. We Turks have a habit of admiring what others admire in us in an unproportionate way. For example, there are thousands of Turks who don't have the first idea about classical music yet they seem to like it when Fazil Say plays it. That's another proof that Turks are crazy about being admired. Having said this, I wish the shortcomings of some other cultures were as benign as this little flaw.





Thread: Evlerinin Önü Boyalı Direk Flamenco Version

3307.       alameda
3499 posts
 07 Oct 2007 Sun 05:34 pm

Quoting caliptrix:

Have you ever listened to this "türkü"?

Here is now the flamenco tangos version:
http://www.turkblog.info/evlerinin-onu-boyali-direk-flamengo-tangos-version



Oh that is very interesting Caliptrix. I've listened to Falameco for years and have been aware of the Eastern influence in it, but hearing it from the East is great. Thanks for uploading this.



Thread: ki, olarak and somethings!

3308.       alameda
3499 posts
 07 Oct 2007 Sun 06:39 am

Actually, it's the same in English. Most native English speakers have very little technical knowledge of how to put things together. That seems to be a common problem. Some how we muddle through.

It is amazing we communicate as well as we do, what with the complexity and imprecision in spoken and written language.

Quoting cynicmystic:

well,
that's why I am called
cynicmystic
I am actually a cynical bastard...

Quoting vineyards:

Cynicmystic, I think you are a bit unfair to Turkish native speakers. Now that it seems you should also mind your own "-de"s and "de"s which is a very common confusion; we are left with no one to speak Turkish good enough by your own reasoning.



Thread: World Poetry Translated from English

3309.       alameda
3499 posts
 07 Oct 2007 Sun 04:39 am

Ohhh fabulous vineyards! Your English is so good. I wish someday to achieve fraction of the proficiency in Turkish you have in English.



Thread: Turkish Poems Translated into English

3310.       alameda
3499 posts
 07 Oct 2007 Sun 04:23 am

Quoting vineyards:

Here is a re-post of some of the Turkish poems I translated into English:



Fabulous vineyards....this is how I like to learn a language, from the poetry.



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