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Saddam Sentenced To Death
(103 Messages in 11 pages - View all)
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1.       miss_ceyda
2627 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 02:12 pm

Former Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein has been sentenced to death by hanging.

The ex-president, who was deposed in the US-led invasion three years ago, was convicted of crimes against humanity by a court in Baghdad.

The charges relate to the killing of 148 Shias in the village of Dujail in 1982. Saddam's trial heard that he ordered the slaughter in revenge for an assassination attempt.

Sectarian tensions have been running high in Iraq in the run-up to the hearing, with a major security clampdown in force.

A 12-hour curfew imposed in Baghdad and three other provinces - including Salahuddin, which contains Saddam's home town of Tikrit.

The reaction in Iraq to the news will be watched closely around the world including in the US where mid-term elections are just two days away.

As the verdict was delivered a visibly shaken Hussein shouted "God is great" and "Life for the glorious nation, and death to its enemies".

His half brother Barzan Ibrahim and Awad Hamed al-Bandar, the head of Iraq's former Revolutionary Court, were also sentenced to death by hanging for their part in the killings.

Former Vice President Taha Yassin Ramadan was convicted of murder and given a life term, while three other defendants were convicted of murder and torture and sentenced to up to 15 years in prison. One defendant was acquitted for lack of evidence.

Hussein's defence team had said they were expecting a death sentence before the hearing in Baghdad's heavily fortified Green Zone, and are apparently preparing an appeal. He still faces further trials over a number of other alleged crimes.

http://news.uk.msn.com

2.       mustafa selim
25 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 02:26 pm

hi all ..
as an Iraqi person..i can say saddam hurts ALL the iraqi ppl in a way or another...ALL the ppl..not only a sector of the iraqis...
but the question now is:
IS THERE ANY BENEFIT OF KILLING SADDAM?
if u asked me..i wont care if saddam is killed or not..
but what should this do to heal iraq?? iraq now is dying..and running to the darkness... does death of saddam will take iraq to the daylight??
we'll see....

thanx all

3.       oludenizdollz
80 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 02:37 pm

My feeling is whatever wrong a human being has done we do not have the right to kill him or her.

Wether the death of saddam will help the Iraqui people- I do not think so- the withdrawal of the occupying forces - and of Israel from Palestinian lands may be a starting point

4.       teaschip
3870 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 03:43 pm

Today is a divine justice for the Iraqi people. Saddam got what he deserved for the crimes against humanity committed during years of brutal dictatorship. He sent millions of people to their deaths. And you ask is there any benefit to kill Saddam? I think this is better answered by the Iraqi people who's children, husbands, wifes, parents, brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, grandparents who were murdered by Saddams reign. In my opinion Saddam and Hitler can rot in hell together and compare notes. Justice has finally been served!

5.       miss_ceyda
2627 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 04:04 pm

Quoting teaschip:

Today is a divine justice for the Iraqi people. Saddam got what he deserved for the crimes against humanity committed during years of brutal dictatorship. He sent millions of people to their deaths. And you ask is there any benefit to kill Saddam? I think this is better answered by the Iraqi people who's children, husbands, wifes, parents, brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, grandparents who were murdered by Saddams reign. In my opinion Saddam and Hitler can rot in hell together and compare notes. Justice has finally been served!




Hmm.. This is a good point although one may argue that the death of Saddam doesnt bring back those relatives who were killed. This event could be described as two wrongs, which dont make a right...??

Does no-one believe that there is a motive for everything?


If a paedophile abused and murdered 10 children should he not be forced to seek medical help rather than be executed?

6.       christine
443 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 04:14 pm

Quoting mustafa selim:

hi all .IS THERE ANY BENEFIT OF KILLING SADDAM?



While ever Saddim lives some iraq people with thing he will return to power some day.These are not my words,but the words of an iraq doctor i work with and because of saddim regume could not go home.

7.       lady in red
6947 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 04:14 pm

Wait and see if you are still ofthis opinion when you have children of your own Miss Ceyda

8.       teaschip
3870 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 04:15 pm

Quoting miss_ceyda:

Quoting teaschip:

Today is a divine justice for the Iraqi people. Saddam got what he deserved for the crimes against humanity committed during years of brutal dictatorship. He sent millions of people to their deaths. And you ask is there any benefit to kill Saddam? I think this is better answered by the Iraqi people who's children, husbands, wifes, parents, brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, grandparents who were murdered by Saddams reign. In my opinion Saddam and Hitler can rot in hell together and compare notes. Justice has finally been served!




Hmm.. This is a good point although one may argue that the death of Saddam doesnt bring back those relatives who were killed. This event could be described as two wrongs, which dont make a right...??

Does no-one believe that there is a motive for everything?


If a paedophile abused and murdered 10 children should he not be forced to seek medical help rather than be executed?



I happen to be a person that forgives, but doesn't forget. I don't believe an eye for an eye is the best moral practice. You are right,there are cases where people who have committed crimes that can be reformed through the prison systems. However, I also believe in evil and I believe Saddam is just plain evil. He has no remorse or regret and is a threat to all society. I think by sentencing Saddam to death, would give some of the victims a little closure. Will it help their grief for their losses, no not totally. But will they feel some sense of justice, perhaps.

9.       mustafa selim
25 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 04:16 pm

Quoting teaschip:

Today is a divine justice for the Iraqi people. Saddam got what he deserved for the crimes against humanity committed during years of brutal dictatorship. He sent millions of people to their deaths. And you ask is there any benefit to kill Saddam? I think this is better answered by the Iraqi people who's children, husbands, wifes, parents, brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, grandparents who were murdered by Saddams reign. In my opinion Saddam and Hitler can rot in hell together and compare notes. Justice has finally been served!

hi teaschip...very nice to hear yor feeling..dony think i'm not hurt by saddam...bcz that my father is not in his party he was jail..and was about to be killed..and dad was taking only 3$ for his job in saddams government...believe me..if iraq was good after saddam i'll celebrate today..but you're not in iraq and cant imagine what is iraq after saddam...belive me..killing saddam may give rest to dead ppl..and for ppl who hurt by him like me..he was totallt unfair..but now..100 times of Sunna islam r killed after saddam..and a civil war is on the door..so..killing saddam wont do anything to a WHOLE COUNTRY DYING.....
THANK U AGAIN

10.       teaschip
3870 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 04:25 pm

Quoting mustafa selim:

Quoting teaschip:

Today is a divine justice for the Iraqi people. Saddam got what he deserved for the crimes against humanity committed during years of brutal dictatorship. He sent millions of people to their deaths. And you ask is there any benefit to kill Saddam? I think this is better answered by the Iraqi people who's children, husbands, wifes, parents, brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, grandparents who were murdered by Saddams reign. In my opinion Saddam and Hitler can rot in hell together and compare notes. Justice has finally been served!

hi teaschip...very nice to hear yor feeling..dony think i'm not hurt by saddam...bcz that my father is not in his party he was jail..and was about to be killed..and dad was taking only 3$ for his job in saddams government...believe me..if iraq was good after saddam i'll celebrate today..but you're not in iraq and cant imagine what is iraq after saddam...belive me..killing saddam may give rest to dead ppl..and for ppl who hurt by him like me..he was totallt unfair..but now..100 times of Sunna islam r killed after saddam..and a civil war is on the door..so..killing saddam wont do anything to a WHOLE COUNTRY DYING.....
THANK U AGAIN



I am sorry to hear about your father, that is awful. Believe me, I'm not at all implying by killing Saddam will solve all of your countries problems. I realize Iraq has a long road ahead of them to be reformed and I hope that it will come sooner than later for the Iraqi people. My prayers are with you and your country.

11.       mustafa selim
25 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 04:26 pm

HI AGAIN..
many of ppl now think that i'm sad bcz saddam is judged by death!!!!! IT IS NOT TRUE......I'M HAPPY BCZ HE'LL DIE...we left Iraq for many many years bcz of his unjustice..i lived lost in Jordan..Lybia....and we were hurt too too much....
now why i left iraq?
bcz i was to be killed so many times in Baghdad..and left my job and my life out there.. i have NOTHING NOW....so what should saddams death do to me to get my lost life?? LET HIM GO TO HELL...HE IS THE CAUSE OF ALL WHAT IS HAPPINING NOW....
but it wont give life for 150,000 iraq killed after he's gone... that's the point......thank u all ppl

12.       Lapinkulta
0 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 04:34 pm

all european, u will be against that dead penalty as u did after Abdullah ocalan (who is responsible to kill more than 30.000 innocent peoples dead) was captured by turkish officer..

13.       heidilovesosman
208 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 04:39 pm

im glad this is going to happen. the reason for this is because he makes me sick. but then he could care less if he dies because is what he wants. so really they are giving him what he wants. unless im missing the point.

14.       miss_ceyda
2627 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 04:42 pm

Quoting lady in red:

Wait and see if you are still ofthis opinion when you have children of your own Miss Ceyda




It was only an example

I meant in any case similar to that.. Lets say someone murdered a member of my family. Personally, before wanting to actually murder the person who did it, I would prefer to learn the reason.
Everything has a reason at the end of the day. And if it turns out that this action was meaningless then yeah, the eye for an eye thang is great.

But despite what Saddam has done...the lives he has destroyed.. .dont you think that he should be asked what his motive was.??
Maybe he has already stated his reason, I personally dont know.

But there are many people who can feel so passionately about something which they dont actually know about.
This is also the same for both of my examples.

15.       catwoman
8933 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 04:53 pm

Quoting miss_ceyda:

Quoting lady in red:

Wait and see if you are still ofthis opinion when you have children of your own Miss Ceyda




It was only an example

I meant in any case similar to that.. Lets say someone murdered a member of my family. Personally, before wanting to actually murder the person who did it, I would prefer to learn the reason.
Everything has a reason at the end of the day. And if it turns out that this action was meaningless then yeah, the eye for an eye thang is great.

But despite what Saddam has done...the lives he has destroyed.. .dont you think that he should be asked what his motive was.??
Maybe he has already stated his reason, I personally dont know.

But there are many people who can feel so passionately about something which they dont actually know about.
This is also the same for both of my examples.



That is why they had court trials - to give him a chance to tell the story from his own perspective. However, I don't think there is a "reason" that would be acceptable to us for such atrocities.
Some poeple just aren't sensitive to other human beings. Killing, torturing someone, especially someone weaker, doesn't sound like a big deal to them. It's a psychopathology that must have been deeply engraved into the person's mind and I think that in such cases, it's impossible to 'cure' those people. Once our brain is hardwired, it's impossible to change those connections.

16.       evabeshiri
156 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 04:57 pm

I think death is the "easy" way out. It would have been even more miserable for him if he was forced to spend the rest of his life in prison. (in my opinion)

17.       miss_ceyda
2627 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 05:03 pm

Quoting catwoman:

Quoting miss_ceyda:

Quoting lady in red:

Wait and see if you are still ofthis opinion when you have children of your own Miss Ceyda




It was only an example

I meant in any case similar to that.. Lets say someone murdered a member of my family. Personally, before wanting to actually murder the person who did it, I would prefer to learn the reason.
Everything has a reason at the end of the day. And if it turns out that this action was meaningless then yeah, the eye for an eye thang is great.

But despite what Saddam has done...the lives he has destroyed.. .dont you think that he should be asked what his motive was.??
Maybe he has already stated his reason, I personally dont know.

But there are many people who can feel so passionately about something which they dont actually know about.
This is also the same for both of my examples.



That is why they had court trials - to give him a chance to tell the story from his own perspective. However, I don't think there is a "reason" that would be acceptable to us for such atrocities.
Some poeple just aren't sensitive to other human beings. Killing, torturing someone, especially someone weaker, doesn't sound like a big deal to them. It's a psychopathology that must have been deeply engraved into the person's mind and I think that in such cases, it's impossible to 'cure' those people. Once our brain is hardwired, it's impossible to change those connections.



Catwoman, I agree with you.

What I have said is only me, trying to see events from different perspectives.


I agree with you when you say that when a certain psychopatholgy is engraved into ones mind, it's impossible to cure. (You would be very surprised how much I know about this actually.)

But then.. why has that person become that way?
Was it their upbringing? Environment? Why? What is the reason?
If there is no actual reason for the killings, or a reason which is not good enough then there must be a reason for why this person has turned out in this way?

Why does no one care about this?






And yeah, another thing.. A few people here have described Saddam's death as "justice"? Maybe so, if Iraq was never bombed? I think that may have counted as revenge dont you?
Im sure Saddam didnt like the fact that his country was being bombed?


But then again, hey.. this is all being done for the Iraqi people yeah?
Why did none of us Westerners think about the Iraqi people when we were bombing them.
Would us,dropping bombs on random towns, killing people's "children, husbands, wifes, parents, brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, grandparents", not make us as bad as Saddam??
I think it would.

And now we are "happy" because Saddam is going to be killed? When we did exactly the same thing as him? What does this mean arkadaşlar? Do we not deserve the same punishment?

18.       christine
443 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 05:31 pm

Anyone who did such terrible crimes againist humanity, such as Saddim did and can still be arrogant,bombastic and think they did nothing wrong are not human.His words on hearing of his death sentence " God is great" Hopeful when he meet his maker. God will show him how great he really is
and punish him for his terrible crimes.

19.       miss_ceyda
2627 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 05:33 pm

Quoting christine:

Anyone who did such terrible crimes againist humanity, such as Saddim did and can still be arrogant,bombastic and think they did nothing wrong are not human.His words on hearing of his death sentence " God is great" Hopeful when he meet his maker. God will show him how great he really is
and punish him for his terrible crimes.




Quoting miss_ceyda:

But then again, hey.. this is all being done for the Iraqi people yeah?
Why did none of us Westerners think about the Iraqi people when we were bombing them.
Would us,dropping bombs on random towns, killing people's "children, husbands, wifes, parents, brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, grandparents", not make us as bad as Saddam??
I think it would.

And now we are "happy" because Saddam is going to be killed? When we did exactly the same thing as him? What does this mean arkadaşlar? Do we not deserve the same punishment?

20.       ramayan
2633 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 05:34 pm

its a big stupid complicated game..


united states supported him and made president, then made him fight against iran who is muslim for nothing and for ten years...then made him invade kuwait and then usa went and saved all kuwait with all its oil.... and now as they made him president they resigned him and put in a cage...and now this punishment...i wont comment if saddam did right or not...instead of commenting on this we should just look the ones who judge him...they have killed more than 600.000 civilian in two years...and its not formal ..im sure its more than millions

its so stupid ...

21.       miss_ceyda
2627 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 05:36 pm

Quoting ramayan:

its a big stupid complicated game..


united states supported him and made president, then made him fight against iran who is muslim for nothing and for ten years...then made him invade kuwait and then usa went and saved all kuwait with all its oil.... and now as they made him president they resigned him and put in a cage...and now this punishment...i wont comment if saddam did right or not...instead of commenting on this we should just look the ones who judge him...they have killed more than 600.000 civilian in two years...and its not formal ..im sure its more than millions

its so stupid ...



dimi yani??

22.       aenigma x
0 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 05:39 pm

As a member of Amnesty International I have to agree with them that this was NOT a fair trial. Also, how can we support capital punishment, when in fact it is banned in the whole of the European Union?

Saddam’s death will also prevent him being prosecuted for many other crimes, including those committed in Kuwait.

This verdict will cause far more problems than it will solve.

23.       mustafa selim
25 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 06:08 pm

PLEASE PPL..
HOW CAN U SAY I'M NOT HAPPY BCZ SADDAM WILL BE HANGED????? HE KILLED BEST FRIEND OF MINE...AND HE'S THE CAUSE OF THE WAR.....AND ALL OF THIS...

MY COMMENT IS :
WILL HANGING HIM CURES IRAQ??
THERE'S A CIVIL WAR OUT THERE AND I RAN BCZ OF IT...
I WAS ABOUT TO BE KILLED BCZ OF THE CIVIL WAR ....

WHOULD SADDAM DEATH CURES IRAQ?????

NOOOOO
NOOOOOOOOO
NOOOOOOO

24.       catwoman
8933 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 06:08 pm

All of you have such brilliant points, it's so nice to listen to you

25.       aenigma x
0 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 06:15 pm

Quoting mustafa selim:



I am so sorry to hear your story. I am inclined to think it is only your comments which matter here.

26.       catwoman
8933 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 06:18 pm

Quoting miss_ceyda:

But then.. why has that person become that way?
Was it their upbringing? Environment? Why? What is the reason?
If there is no actual reason for the killings, or a reason which is not good enough then there must be a reason for why this person has turned out in this way?

Why does no one care about this?

And yeah, another thing.. A few people here have described Saddam's death as "justice"? Maybe so, if Iraq was never bombed? I think that may have counted as revenge dont you?
Im sure Saddam didnt like the fact that his country was being bombed?


But then again, hey.. this is all being done for the Iraqi people yeah?
Why did none of us Westerners think about the Iraqi people when we were bombing them.
Would us,dropping bombs on random towns, killing people's "children, husbands, wifes, parents, brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, grandparents", not make us as bad as Saddam??
I think it would.

And now we are "happy" because Saddam is going to be killed? When we did exactly the same thing as him? What does this mean arkadaşlar? Do we not deserve the same punishment?



First of all, WHY people become psychopaths/cruel... is a question of psychology, sociology, psychiatry... and even all of them don't know full answers to this. I don't think that even the people in question know why they behave the way they do. It must have something to do with both genetics and upbringing.

The second point you make is excellent! However, in this case the attackers on Iraq are the strongest ones, so they don't think they need to obey any rules, there's no immediate judge over them (just like there wasn't anything at the time when Saddam was committing his crimes and that's why he thought he could do it). Yes, it's full of hipocricy.

27.       lady in red
6947 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 06:21 pm

Quoting aenigma x:

Quoting mustafa selim:



I am so sorry to hear your story. I am inclined to think it is only your comments which matter here.



+1 aenigma

28.       kai
0 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 06:30 pm

my comment is simple: Same as Mustafa's....Yeah we want him to die.... but really I don't give a shit because the damage he has done doesn't compare to the millions of lives that have suffered because of him.
For me...he shouldn't even go to hell, because he will just feel right at home. Words cannot describe how whe makes me feel. Friends of mine have suffered so much that it is even hard to imagine what life is like for them.

Thanks to terrorism...life for many people will not be the same...including mine. I wish I didn't have to wish for the things that I wish for....
I pray...

29.       aenigma x
0 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 06:37 pm

Quoting kai:

Yeah we want him to die....



Who is 'we' ?


Quoting kai:

...but really I don't give a shit because the damage he has done doesn't compare to the millions of lives that have suffered because of him.



You should give a s**t Kai! You SHOULD care about the justice system and the right to fair trials. You could equally say that the forces in Iraq have caused death to thousands.... do we hang them too? There are many evil leaders in this world we didn't put on trial.

You say you have suffered before because of terrorism and I am very sorry to hear this. But be sure, this verdict will multiply this evil by many hundreds.

30.       aenigma x
0 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 06:41 pm

In addition....what did Saddam Hussain have to do with "terrorism"? I am not saying he did not commit crimes, but don't confuse this trial with the terrorist attacks. The two are completely separate.

31.       miss_ceyda
2627 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 06:43 pm

Quoting catwoman:


The second point you make is excellent! However, in this case the attackers on Iraq are the strongest ones, so they don't think they need to obey any rules, there's no immediate judge over them (just like there wasn't anything at the time when Saddam was committing his crimes and that's why he thought he could do it). Yes, it's full of hipocricy.




You are right, and thats unfair.
No one should judge someone and say they deserve to die when their own country has done the same thing, TO THE SAME COUNTRY!! thats ridiculous... surely what im saying makes sense?

i joined this website to learn not only turkish but also to mix with people who i guessed are older and therefore more experienced and intelligent than myself.

yet again however, i find that there are only a few like this whilst the others talk junk..?? tuhh

32.       aenigma x
0 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 06:48 pm

I completely agreed with all you said Miss C. I didn't want to spoil your posts by posting over them ! You are wise beyond your years

33.       miss_ceyda
2627 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 06:51 pm

Quoting aenigma x:

I completely agreed with all you said Miss C.




I thought u might



Quoting aenigma:

I didn't want to spoil your posts by posting over them ! You are wise beyond your years




hehe, you should see my little face-

just like this = hihihi

34.       kai
0 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 06:53 pm

What I meant was that I don't give a shit in some sense because killing him won't bring back the people he killed...if it did then hell yeah kill him! but I do give a shit in other sense...it's hard to explain and even thinkintg about it hurts my head...so this will be my last comment.

P.S. want him to die...such as happy he will die...and I say "we" because if you look at number 11 you will see Mustafa also said "I'M HAPPY BCZ HE'LL DIE"

35.       mustafa selim
25 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 06:54 pm

hi again nice ppl
something u dont really understand....
IT IS THE TRUTH..i'm iraqi and you all shoulr read this..
saddam killed thousands of ppl for politician causes..
and after saddam regimen was gone till now,600,000 iraqi ppl was killed, in frame of what's called( the covert civil war)..
i'm one of the ppl who were threatened by many sectors of iraqi ppl...iwas few meters from death each time i was about to be killed....i left here..to egypt....
so..... i care about ppl whor killed by saddam....
but..
ALL should care about 600.000 deads...
it is increasing...
in the middle of all this ..what should death of saddam do any thing to help iraq??
it is NOTHING...
in iraq...ppl who love saddam and ppl who hate him r in danger...so..how saddams death help them??
for me ...honestly..i dont care if he died or lived....
it wont get my life back...

thanx for listening...

and very special thanx for aenigma....


36.       miss_ceyda
2627 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 07:00 pm

Quoting mustafa selim:




so what was you motive in iraq? why were you close to death?
if you are iraqi as you say you should have only wanted the best for your country, as did saddam??

37.       mustafa selim
25 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 07:09 pm

Quoting miss_ceyda:

Quoting mustafa selim:




so what was you motive in iraq? why were you close to death?
if you are iraqi as you say you should have only wanted the best for your country, as did saddam??

miss_ceyda..
i tried to still in iraq...to help in saving iraq...but this country is dying..beside i was shot to death..then i realized that i have no life there..
i wish..i really wish if u can undersatnd me miss... but there's no life in iraq now


thnk u very much..

38.       Roswitha
4132 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 07:15 pm

http://www.guardian.co.uk/

39.       eestlane
32 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 07:28 pm

I think Saddam should be burnt on a stake.

40.       Mina_TR
50 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 07:28 pm

Quoting teaschip:

I am sorry to hear about your father, that is awful. Believe me, I'm not at all implying by killing Saddam will solve all of your countries problems. I realize Iraq has a long road ahead of them to be reformed and I hope that it will come sooner than later for the Iraqi people. My prayers are with you and your country.



My sentiments to you mustafa selim exactly as Miss teaschip said it best.

God Bless and Take care

41.       mustafa selim
25 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 07:32 pm

thank u nice ppl....
but i thank Allah every day that my father is alife now..
whenever i look to him..i feel glad...that he/s not hurt..in saddam's time or the civil war after him...

all iraqi ppl need your prays

you r very kind ....all of you
thank u from my heart

mustafa

42.       mustafa selim
25 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 07:48 pm

PPL MY FATHER IS ALIFE.......HE'S NOT DEAD.....

HE WAS (ABOUT ) TO BE KILLED.....


lol lol lol


BUT THANK U VERY VERY MUCH....

I'M SORRY FOR MISUNDERSTANDING

XXXXXXXXXXXXXX FOR ALL OF YOU



43.       Capoeira
575 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 10:06 pm

I just don't believe that killing solves killing. It is illogical. Two wrongs don't equal a right!

44.       robyn :D
2640 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 10:27 pm

how is it that england and america dont go into countries like north korea and japan and say what they do to their people is wrong..or how about zimbabwe..i'll tell why..they have no oil..
saddam did wrong and killed innocents but him being killed doesn't bring back the dead and doesn't solve a thing....maybe blair and bush should be put on trial for sending all the soldiers to fight for an unjust war... or the american government for funding the IRA in previous years..neway these 'weapons of mass destruction' were given to iraq in the first place by england and america ...maybe we should kill our governments in that case too

45.       alperhkn
84 posts 		 05 Nov 2006 Sun 10:38 pm

Quoting robyn :

how is it that england and america dont go into countries like north korea and japan and say what they do to their people is wrong..or how about zimbabwe..i'll tell why..they have no oil..
saddam did wrong and killed innocents but him being killed doesn't bring back the dead and doesn't solve a thing....maybe blair and bush should be put on trial for sending all the soldiers to fight for an unjust war... or the american government for funding the IRA in previous years..neway these 'weapons of mass destruction' were given to iraq in the first place by england and america ...maybe we should kill our governments in that case too



+1

46.       teaschip
3870 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 01:05 am

I was just thinking about this and understand we all have our own opinions here. But something to point out, we all have something in common here, too. We are all a part of history today. If you think about this, our children, grandchildren, greatchildren etc... will be reading about Saddam in years to come in their studies. Like we have read about historical leaders in the past in our studies. Most of us will remember posting comments here on this Turkish Class site as a discussion. That's why Turkish Class goes beyond the concept of just learning Turkish. I hope the admins here realize and understand this. Thanks for allowing this topic and for those who have contributed to it.

47.       kai
0 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 02:02 am

Quoting alperhkn:

Quoting robyn :

how is it that england and america dont go into countries like north korea and japan and say what they do to their people is wrong..or how about zimbabwe..i'll tell why..they have no oil..
saddam did wrong and killed innocents but him being killed doesn't bring back the dead and doesn't solve a thing....maybe blair and bush should be put on trial for sending all the soldiers to fight for an unjust war... or the american government for funding the IRA in previous years..neway these 'weapons of mass destruction' were given to iraq in the first place by england and america ...maybe we should kill our governments in that case too



+1



+1 here too...shame about Guy fawks isn't it canım lol

48.       aenigma x
0 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 02:04 am

Quoting kai:

+1 here too...shame about Guy fawks isn't it canım lol



+1 Very timely comment Kai !

49.       CANLI
5084 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 02:21 am

Quoting teaschip:

We are all a part of history today. If you think about this, our children, grandchildren, greatchildren etc... will be reading about Saddam in years to come in their studies. Like we have read about historical leaders in the past in our studies.


They won't be reading only about Saddam !

50.       kai
0 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 02:37 am

Quoting aenigma x:

Quoting kai:

+1 here too...shame about Guy fawks isn't it canım lol



+1 Very timely comment Kai !



Thought it was a good time to mention it lol

51.       Roswitha
4132 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 03:18 am

http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/11/02/opinion/edbush.php

52.       CANLI
5084 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 03:25 am

Quoting ramayan:

its a big stupid complicated game..


united states supported him and made president, then made him fight against iran who is muslim for nothing and for ten years...then made him invade kuwait and then usa went and saved all kuwait with all its oil.... and now as they made him president they resigned him and put in a cage...and now this punishment...i wont comment if saddam did right or not...instead of commenting on this we should just look the ones who judge him...they have killed more than 600.000 civilian in two years...and its not formal ..im sure its more than millions

its so stupid ...



+1

İ don't care wheather he live or died,but is it acceptable to send him into trial,whee the judges are the people who've created him ?!

53.       teaschip
3870 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 03:32 am

Quoting kai:

Quoting alperhkn:

Quoting robyn :

how is it that england and america dont go into countries like north korea and japan and say what they do to their people is wrong..or how about zimbabwe..i'll tell why..they have no oil..
saddam did wrong and killed innocents but him being killed doesn't bring back the dead and doesn't solve a thing....maybe blair and bush should be put on trial for sending all the soldiers to fight for an unjust war... or the american government for funding the IRA in previous years..neway these 'weapons of mass destruction' were given to iraq in the first place by england and america ...maybe we should kill our governments in that case too



+1



+1 here too...shame about Guy fawks isn't it canım lol



I don't want to get off the topic too much here and spoil this thread, however last time I checked Japan was our allie and I believe there was this thing called the Korean War. I don't know about England, but the U.S. has not benefited from oil because gas has almost doubled here. If the government is hiding it some where, I sure would like to know. What do Englands gases prices look like there?

54.       robyn :D
2640 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 03:58 am

they have gone up here too teaschip..

55.       arabianofelix
144 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 05:38 am

A Leader has fallen. The Last to save his race's dignity has been backstabbed and sold by his own people, courtesy of American Intellegence and Greed.
-before anyone make a decision, please don't make it based on what you hear in the media. GO SEE FOR YOUR SELF.

56.       Netzen
408 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 06:06 am

Null

57.       arabianofelix
144 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 08:01 am

Quoting Netzen:

..."YE SHALL KNOW THEM BY THEIR FRUIT"



those who consumed their fruits came to be the most ungrateful of all mankind.

58.       aenigma x
0 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 10:32 am

Quoting arabianofelix:

Quoting Netzen:

..."YE SHALL KNOW THEM BY THEIR FRUIT"



those who consumed their fruits came to be the most ungrateful of all mankind.



This kind of comment just completely alienates me, and I don't think the forum is the place for it.

59.       aenigma x
0 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 10:36 am

Quoting arabianofelix:

A Leader has fallen. The Last to save his race's dignity has been backstabbed and sold by his own people, courtesy of American Intellegence and Greed.
-before anyone make a decision, please don't make it based on what you hear in the media. GO SEE FOR YOUR SELF.



Are you saying he is also blameless? "The last to save his race's dignity?" Are you quite sure about this statement? Yes we SHOULD know all the facts before making a decision, and I think my views on the trial and verdict have been made quite clear here, but I think you also need to check ALL your facts before making such a statement like this...

60.       susie k
1330 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 11:29 am

61.       Roswitha
4132 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 02:14 pm

http://news.google.com/news?q=Baghdad+Under+Lockdown+After+Saddam+Verdict&hl=en&lr=&sa=X&oi=news&ct=title

62.       Roswitha
4132 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 02:20 pm

http://www.wmtw.com/news/10244110/detail.html

63.       libralady
5152 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 03:36 pm

It is difficult to add any more to this thread except agree with much of what has already been said. But I do feel that the Death Penality does not solve the problems and the killing will go on in Iraq whether Saddam is hanged or not and in some cases may even increase. I feel that there is divine satisfaction in him being hanged coming out of some of these posts and also in news reports and I dont think we should feel like that. He is not the first or the last to be the perpertrator of genocide but I agree should be punished accordingly and if the dealth penalty is the desired method in Iraq, then so be it. Time will tell if this proves to be effective.

64.       miss_ceyda
2627 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 03:40 pm

The people judging him are MURDERERS.
They deserve a worse punishment

65.       qdemir
811 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 04:39 pm

What of the people America has killed in Iraq (about 650.000 as of November). I wonder who has killed more people, Saddam (in 35 years) or America (in 2,5 years)?

66.       SuiGeneris
3922 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 04:42 pm

Quoting qdemir:

What of the people America has killed in Iraq (about 650.000 as of November). I wonder who has killed more people, Saddam (in 35 years) or America (in 2,5 years)?



what a nice question is this?

my friend, they were bringing "democracy" to there you know...

67.       robyn :D
2640 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 05:09 pm

oh no suigeneris..didnt u know it was to kget the 'weapons of mass destruction' back that they gave to him lol

68.       teaschip
3870 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 05:11 pm

Quoting miss_ceyda:

The people judging him are MURDERERS.
They deserve a worse punishment



What a strong statement to make, Miss Ceyda. I never been called a murderer, indirectly. You may not agree with my view, but to make such a harsh statement for those that don't agree with you. What shall my punishment be then? Like I said in my previous posts, I do forgive. So I will forgive you.

69.       libralady
5152 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 05:11 pm

Quoting SuiGeneris:

Quoting qdemir:

What of the people America has killed in Iraq (about 650.000 as of November). I wonder who has killed more people, Saddam (in 35 years) or America (in 2,5 years)?



what a nice question is this?

my friend, they were bringing "democracy" to there you know...



I think "trying" to bring democracy. Democracy can only come from within the country and by the people of that country. Democracy cannot be forced by outside nations.

70.       libralady
5152 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 05:13 pm

Can I make a request for this thread? That it remains a discussion and nothing more.

71.       robyn :D
2640 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 05:16 pm

Quoting libralady:

Can I make a request for this thread? That it remains a discussion and nothing more.



why libralady would the people of tc make it anything else?

72.       teaschip
3870 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 05:24 pm

Quoting libralady:

Can I make a request for this thread? That it remains a discussion and nothing more.



Yes, libralady I happen to agree. You mention democracy, I saw the reaction of many of the Iraqi people when the verdict was read. This was enough for me to believe that some of the Iraqi's want democracy in their country. I also saw how many people turned out to vote, a freedom they never had before. I happen to agree that you cannot force democracy onto a nation. However, when people get a taste of freedom, they usually don't turn back otherwise.

73.       aenigma x
0 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 05:24 pm

I have to agree with Libralady. I think this discussion is becoming rather rabid now

74.       aenigma x
0 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 05:28 pm

Quoting teaschip:

Yes, libralady I happen to agree. You mention democracy, I saw the reaction of many of the Iraqi people when the verdict was read. This was enough for me to believe that some of the Iraqi's want democracy in their country. I also saw how many people turned out to vote, a freedom they never had before. I happen to agree that you cannot force democracy onto a nation. However, when people get a taste of freedom, they usually don't turn back otherwise.



Dont you realise how antagonistic this is, Teaschip? Did the Iraqi people ASK for this? Do you imagine for one minute that they have "freedom" now?

The US are NOT the world police.

75.       teaschip
3870 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 05:29 pm

Quoting aenigma x:

I have to agree with Libralady. I think this discussion is becoming rather rabid now



As I recall this topic was about Saddam.

76.       teaschip
3870 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 05:45 pm

Quoting aenigma x:

Quoting teaschip:

Yes, libralady I happen to agree. You mention democracy, I saw the reaction of many of the Iraqi people when the verdict was read. This was enough for me to believe that some of the Iraqi's want democracy in their country. I also saw how many people turned out to vote, a freedom they never had before. I happen to agree that you cannot force democracy onto a nation. However, when people get a taste of freedom, they usually don't turn back otherwise.



Dont you realise how antagonistic this is, Teaschip? Did the Iraqi people ASK for this? Do you imagine for one minute that they have "freedom" now?

The US are NOT the world police.



It takes years to reform a country, it doesn't happen overnight. And yes, many of the Iraqi people did ask for this, however it just so happened that our countries were the only ones to take notice and listen. I realize there is alot of controversy, whether we should be there or not. However, I still take the stand of supporting our troops. Obviously, you differ and your entitled to your own opinion. We can agree to disagree on this. Again, wasn't this topic about Saddam's sentensing? Yet again, America takes the heat. Let me ask you this, should we have just minded our own business and left Saddam in power to continue to kill and reign over the Iraqi people? hmm

77.       robyn :D
2640 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 05:48 pm

Quoting teaschip:

Quoting aenigma x:

Quoting teaschip:

Yes, libralady I happen to agree. You mention democracy, I saw the reaction of many of the Iraqi people when the verdict was read. This was enough for me to believe that some of the Iraqi's want democracy in their country. I also saw how many people turned out to vote, a freedom they never had before. I happen to agree that you cannot force democracy onto a nation. However, when people get a taste of freedom, they usually don't turn back otherwise.



Dont you realise how antagonistic this is, Teaschip? Did the Iraqi people ASK for this? Do you imagine for one minute that they have "freedom" now?

The US are NOT the world police.



It takes years to reform a country, it doesn't happen overnight. And yes, many of the Iraqi people did ask for this, however it just so happened that our countries were the only ones to take notice and listen. I realize there is alot of controversy, whether we should be there or not. However, I still take the stand of supporting our troops. Obviously, you differ and your entitled to your own opinion. We can agree to disagree on this. Again, wasn't this topic about Saddam's sentensing? Yet again, America takes the heat.




well as the saying goes 'if u cant stand the heat get out of the kitchen'
sorry teaschip..im not being offensive towards u at all because i dont know u..im referring to the american and english governments..
and yes u right..we are all mature enough to agree to disagree on this matter and also yes it was about saddam originally

78.       teaschip
3870 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 05:58 pm

Quoting robyn :

Quoting teaschip:

Quoting aenigma x:

Quoting teaschip:

Yes, libralady I happen to agree. You mention democracy, I saw the reaction of many of the Iraqi people when the verdict was read. This was enough for me to believe that some of the Iraqi's want democracy in their country. I also saw how many people turned out to vote, a freedom they never had before. I happen to agree that you cannot force democracy onto a nation. However, when people get a taste of freedom, they usually don't turn back otherwise.



Dont you realise how antagonistic this is, Teaschip? Did the Iraqi people ASK for this? Do you imagine for one minute that they have "freedom" now?

The US are NOT the world police.



It takes years to reform a country, it doesn't happen overnight. And yes, many of the Iraqi people did ask for this, however it just so happened that our countries were the only ones to take notice and listen. I realize there is alot of controversy, whether we should be there or not. However, I still take the stand of supporting our troops. Obviously, you differ and your entitled to your own opinion. We can agree to disagree on this. Again, wasn't this topic about Saddam's sentensing? Yet again, America takes the heat.




well as the saying goes 'if u cant stand the heat get out of the kitchen'
sorry teaschip..im not being offensive towards u at all because i dont know u..im referring to the american and english governments..
and yes u right..we are all mature enough to agree to disagree on this matter and also yes it was about saddam originally



Well noted like my saying "don't let the door hit you in the ass". Believe me, I'm always up for a good discussion. But I also know when to take a step back, somethings are really not worth mentioning here.

79.       libralady
5152 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 07:19 pm

For what it is worth, I never agreed with troups invading Iraq the second time round as it was on very flimsy excuses which have been unfounded. That is not to say I agreed with his regime either. But I am sure they could have done the job first time round when Iraq invaded Kuwait if they had really wanted to get Saddam.

80.       Capoeira
575 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 08:25 pm

Quoting teaschip:

Quoting aenigma x:

Quoting teaschip:

Yes, libralady I happen to agree. You mention democracy, I saw the reaction of many of the Iraqi people when the verdict was read. This was enough for me to believe that some of the Iraqi's want democracy in their country. I also saw how many people turned out to vote, a freedom they never had before. I happen to agree that you cannot force democracy onto a nation. However, when people get a taste of freedom, they usually don't turn back otherwise.



Dont you realise how antagonistic this is, Teaschip? Did the Iraqi people ASK for this? Do you imagine for one minute that they have "freedom" now?

The US are NOT the world police.



It takes years to reform a country, it doesn't happen overnight. And yes, many of the Iraqi people did ask for this, however it just so happened that our countries were the only ones to take notice and listen. I realize there is alot of controversy, whether we should be there or not. However, I still take the stand of supporting our troops. Obviously, you differ and your entitled to your own opinion. We can agree to disagree on this. Again, wasn't this topic about Saddam's sentensing? Yet again, America takes the heat. Let me ask you this, should we have just minded our own business and left Saddam in power to continue to kill and reign over the Iraqi people? hmm


How is supporting our troops...sending them into a poorly planned military operation based on faulty intelligence? And then watching as they come home one by one in body bags with no real exit plan in sight? Sounds to me like that's military suicide. I support them by asking Pres. Bush to bring them home and STOP involving our country in military actions that bring nothing but death and destruction. Maybe you are reading different newspapers and watching different news than me..but it looks like Iraq is hell on earth now and maybe worse than before. No disrespect to the people living there, I am sure they are wonderful people put into a tough situation by political gaming.

81.       teaschip
3870 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 08:37 pm

Quoting Capoeira:

Quoting teaschip:

Quoting aenigma x:

Quoting teaschip:

Yes, libralady I happen to agree. You mention democracy, I saw the reaction of many of the Iraqi people when the verdict was read. This was enough for me to believe that some of the Iraqi's want democracy in their country. I also saw how many people turned out to vote, a freedom they never had before. I happen to agree that you cannot force democracy onto a nation. However, when people get a taste of freedom, they usually don't turn back otherwise.



Dont you realise how antagonistic this is, Teaschip? Did the Iraqi people ASK for this? Do you imagine for one minute that they have "freedom" now?

The US are NOT the world police.



It takes years to reform a country, it doesn't happen overnight. And yes, many of the Iraqi people did ask for this, however it just so happened that our countries were the only ones to take notice and listen. I realize there is alot of controversy, whether we should be there or not. However, I still take the stand of supporting our troops. Obviously, you differ and your entitled to your own opinion. We can agree to disagree on this. Again, wasn't this topic about Saddam's sentensing? Yet again, America takes the heat. Let me ask you this, should we have just minded our own business and left Saddam in power to continue to kill and reign over the Iraqi people? hmm


How is supporting our troops...sending them into a poorly planned military operation based on faulty intelligence? And then watching as they come home one by one in body bags with no real exit plan in sight? Sounds to me like that's military suicide. I support them by asking Pres. Bush to bring them home and STOP involving our country in military actions that bring nothing but death and destruction. Maybe you are reading different newspapers and watching different news than me..but it looks like Iraq is hell on earth now and maybe worse than before. No disrespect to the people living there, I am sure they are wonderful people put into a tough situation by political gaming.



I have a brilliant idea, since the U.S. is doing such a terrible job in Iraq. Then why don't you tell me how you would improve things. Please share with me how you would resolve and help this country? So,what is the solution then. Please, I can't wait to hear?

82.       aenigma x
0 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 08:51 pm

Quoting teaschip:

I have a brilliant idea, since the U.S. is doing such a terrible job in Iraq. Then why don't you tell me how you would improve things. Please share with me how you would resolve and help this country? So,what is the solution then. Please, I can't wait to hear?



We shouldn’t have created this mess in the first place Teaschip – surely even you can see that?

You, rather sanctimoniously, suggested earlier that this war as been for the benefit of the Iraqi people, to give them democracy. The US and UK are hardly good examples of that are they?

Blair went against many of his cabinet and our elected MPs to support Bush. Many senior members of his party resigned because of his decision, but he did it anyway.

Only a cursory glance at the handling of the last US Presidential elections will show you that “democracy” depends on money and how many corrupt officials you befriend. It is just dictatorship with a fancy name…

83.       MrX67
2540 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 08:57 pm

this damn war created it's own many Saddams,their claims were to bring democracy,but they created just violence and to be divided instead of democracy and happiness ,for their big aims on middle east..

84.       Capoeira
575 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 09:01 pm

Quoting teaschip:



I have a brilliant idea, since the U.S. is doing such a terrible job in Iraq. Then why don't you tell me how you would improve things. Please share with me how you would resolve and help this country? So,what is the solution then. Please, I can't wait to hear?


Stop voting for the Republican agenda! That will be the first and best start!

85.       Joey
0 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 09:34 pm

Quoting robyn :

how is it that england and america dont go into countries like north korea and japan and say what they do to their people is wrong..or how about zimbabwe..i'll tell why..they have no oil..
saddam did wrong and killed innocents but him being killed doesn't bring back the dead and doesn't solve a thing....maybe blair and bush should be put on trial for sending all the soldiers to fight for an unjust war... or the american government for funding the IRA in previous years..neway these 'weapons of mass destruction' were given to iraq in the first place by england and america ...maybe we should kill our governments in that case too


It is not the English government but the UK government, in fact many of the top posts are held by Scots and I have to admit that Tony Blair was born and partially educated in Scotland You speak of Nth. Korea,the Americans suffered heavy casualties protecting the south when they were invaded by the north in the 1950's and look at the difference between the two countries now.As for invading Japan looking at the number of japanese cars on our roads I think the opposite is true Sure the Americans have made mistakes, haven't we all? But I for one will always be grateful to the Yanks for the help they have given us over the years, after all we in Britain might be speaking almanca

86.       robyn :D
2640 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 10:49 pm

Quoting Joey:

Quoting robyn :

how is it that england and america dont go into countries like north korea and japan and say what they do to their people is wrong..or how about zimbabwe..i'll tell why..they have no oil..
saddam did wrong and killed innocents but him being killed doesn't bring back the dead and doesn't solve a thing....maybe blair and bush should be put on trial for sending all the soldiers to fight for an unjust war... or the american government for funding the IRA in previous years..neway these 'weapons of mass destruction' were given to iraq in the first place by england and america ...maybe we should kill our governments in that case too



It is not the English government but the UK government, in fact many of the top posts are held by Scots and I have to admit that Tony Blair was born and partially educated in Scotland You speak of Nth. Korea,the Americans suffered heavy casualties protecting the south when they were invaded by the north in the 1950's and look at the difference between the two countries now.As for invading Japan looking at the number of japanese cars on our roads I think the opposite is true Sure the Americans have made mistakes, haven't we all? But I for one will always be grateful to the Yanks for the help they have given us over the years, after all we in Britain might be speaking almanca



well the situation in north korea hasn't changed much since the 1950's if u do ur research..consequently japanese human rights records are some practises are atrocious..also i see u avoided the zimbabwe issue..rather wisely and whether the posts are held by scottish people or people educated in scotland is irrelevant..they have their own parliament
the phrase 'passing the buck' springs to mind

87.       Joey
0 posts 		 06 Nov 2006 Mon 11:51 pm

Quoting robyn :

Quoting Joey:

Quoting robyn :

how is it that england and america dont go into countries like north korea and japan and say what they do to their people is wrong..or how about zimbabwe..i'll tell why..they have no oil..
saddam did wrong and killed innocents but him being killed doesn't bring back the dead and doesn't solve a thing....maybe blair and bush should be put on trial for sending all the soldiers to fight for an unjust war... or the american government for funding the IRA in previous years..neway these 'weapons of mass destruction' were given to iraq in the first place by england and america ...maybe we should kill our governments in that case too



It is not the English government but the UK government, in fact many of the top posts are held by Scots and I have to admit that Tony Blair was born and partially educated in Scotland You speak of Nth. Korea,the Americans suffered heavy casualties protecting the south when they were invaded by the north in the 1950's and look at the difference between the two countries now.As for invading Japan looking at the number of japanese cars on our roads I think the opposite is true Sure the Americans have made mistakes, haven't we all? But I for one will always be grateful to the Yanks for the help they have given us over the years, after all we in Britain might be speaking almanca



well the situation in north korea hasn't changed much since the 1950's if u do ur research..consequently japanese human rights records are some practises are atrocious..also i see u avoided the zimbabwe issue..rather wisely and whether the posts are held by scottish people or people educated in scotland is irrelevant..they have their own parliament
the phrase 'passing the buck' springs to mind


Zimbabwe is a fellow member of the Commonwealth of Nations. As long as it has the support of some members there is very little that can be done.

88.       robyn :D
2640 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 12:10 am

Quoting Joey:

Quoting robyn :

Quoting Joey:

Quoting robyn :

how is it that england and america dont go into countries like north korea and japan and say what they do to their people is wrong..or how about zimbabwe..i'll tell why..they have no oil..
saddam did wrong and killed innocents but him being killed doesn't bring back the dead and doesn't solve a thing....maybe blair and bush should be put on trial for sending all the soldiers to fight for an unjust war... or the american government for funding the IRA in previous years..neway these 'weapons of mass destruction' were given to iraq in the first place by england and america ...maybe we should kill our governments in that case too




It is not the English government but the UK government, in fact many of the top posts are held by Scots and I have to admit that Tony Blair was born and partially educated in Scotland You speak of Nth. Korea,the Americans suffered heavy casualties protecting the south when they were invaded by the north in the 1950's and look at the difference between the two countries now.As for invading Japan looking at the number of japanese cars on our roads I think the opposite is true Sure the Americans have made mistakes, haven't we all? But I for one will always be grateful to the Yanks for the help they have given us over the years, after all we in Britain might be speaking almanca



well the situation in north korea hasn't changed much since the 1950's if u do ur research..consequently japanese human rights records are some practises are atrocious..also i see u avoided the zimbabwe issue..rather wisely and whether the posts are held by scottish people or people educated in scotland is irrelevant..they have their own parliament
the phrase 'passing the buck' springs to mind


Zimbabwe is a fellow member of the Commonwealth of Nations. As long as it has the support of some members there is very little that can be done.



thats the exact problem i have with this situation joey..why ignore some peoples struggles and exaggerate others?...dont zimbabweans deserve our 'help' in instilling 'democracy' as well

89.       teaschip
3870 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 12:12 am

Quoting Joey:

Quoting robyn :

Quoting Joey:

Quoting robyn :

how is it that england and america dont go into countries like north korea and japan and say what they do to their people is wrong..or how about zimbabwe..i'll tell why..they have no oil..
saddam did wrong and killed innocents but him being killed doesn't bring back the dead and doesn't solve a thing....maybe blair and bush should be put on trial for sending all the soldiers to fight for an unjust war... or the american government for funding the IRA in previous years..neway these 'weapons of mass destruction' were given to iraq in the first place by england and america ...maybe we should kill our governments in that case too



It is not the English government but the UK government, in fact many of the top posts are held by Scots and I have to admit that Tony Blair was born and partially educated in Scotland You speak of Nth. Korea,the Americans suffered heavy casualties protecting the south when they were invaded by the north in the 1950's and look at the difference between the two countries now.As for invading Japan looking at the number of japanese cars on our roads I think the opposite is true Sure the Americans have made mistakes, haven't we all? But I for one will always be grateful to the Yanks for the help they have given us over the years, after all we in Britain might be speaking almanca



well the situation in north korea hasn't changed much since the 1950's if u do ur research..consequently japanese human rights records are some practises are atrocious..also i see u avoided the zimbabwe issue..rather wisely and whether the posts are held by scottish people or people educated in scotland is irrelevant..they have their own parliament
the phrase 'passing the buck' springs to mind


Zimbabwe is a fellow member of the Commonwealth of Nations. As long as it has the support of some members there is very little that can be done.



Joey, it's almost point less to have a real debate here. Because first you need knowledge and facts about politics, world events & history. Which I'm finding very difficult for some people to discuss here. You seem to have a good deal of knowledge though, found your post interesting. Thanks for the enlightment

90.       tirrogan
0 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 12:14 am

Quoting teaschip:

Today is a divine justice for the Iraqi people. Saddam got what he deserved for the crimes against humanity committed during years of brutal dictatorship. He sent millions of people to their deaths. And you ask is there any benefit to kill Saddam? I think this is better answered by the Iraqi people who's children, husbands, wifes, parents, brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, grandparents who were murdered by Saddams reign. In my opinion Saddam and Hitler can rot in hell together and compare notes. Justice has finally been served!


i really think which day will be a divine justice for the U.S Politicians.Saddam got what he deserved and what will U.S politicians deserve for these dyings in iraq? Giving freedome a country didnt have to be like that.didnt U.s killed ppl in hiroshima and negazaki.who sentenced them to death.i dont appriciate Saddam.i know what kind of man who is.he really deserved this.but i am asking you teaschip.everyday alot of ppl are dying with the freedome which you gave them in iraq.everyday children, husbands, wifes, parents, brothers are still dying in iraq.do u know this?what did U.S prevent in iraq.just read what u wrote and realize the massacre u are doing in iraq......

91.       robyn :D
2640 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 12:15 am

Quoting teaschip:

Quoting Joey:

Quoting robyn :

Quoting Joey:

Quoting robyn :

how is it that england and america dont go into countries like north korea and japan and say what they do to their people is wrong..or how about zimbabwe..i'll tell why..they have no oil..
saddam did wrong and killed innocents but him being killed doesn't bring back the dead and doesn't solve a thing....maybe blair and bush should be put on trial for sending all the soldiers to fight for an unjust war... or the american government for funding the IRA in previous years..neway these 'weapons of mass destruction' were given to iraq in the first place by england and america ...maybe we should kill our governments in that case too



It is not the English government but the UK government, in fact many of the top posts are held by Scots and I have to admit that Tony Blair was born and partially educated in Scotland You speak of Nth. Korea,the Americans suffered heavy casualties protecting the south when they were invaded by the north in the 1950's and look at the difference between the two countries now.As for invading Japan looking at the number of japanese cars on our roads I think the opposite is true Sure the Americans have made mistakes, haven't we all? But I for one will always be grateful to the Yanks for the help they have given us over the years, after all we in Britain might be speaking almanca



well the situation in north korea hasn't changed much since the 1950's if u do ur research..consequently japanese human rights records are some practises are atrocious..also i see u avoided the zimbabwe issue..rather wisely and whether the posts are held by scottish people or people educated in scotland is irrelevant..they have their own parliament
the phrase 'passing the buck' springs to mind


Zimbabwe is a fellow member of the Commonwealth of Nations. As long as it has the support of some members there is very little that can be done.



Joey, it's almost point less to have a real debate here. Because first you need knowledge and facts about politics, world events & history. Which I'm finding very difficult for some people to discuss here. You seem to have a good deal of knowledge though, found your post interesting. Thanks for the enlightment



trying to suggest that people have no knowledge just because they dont agree with is kind of immature teaschip..i do my research which is why i am in a position to offer such information and insight..i however dont believe that someone is has no knowledge of facts just because they disagree with my opinion...

92.       tirrogan
0 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 12:23 am

the only reason for the Saddam death is to take the votes at the coming election.they just care about the election.they just put him in the oven.when the elections come, it will be ready to eat.Some ppl are doing policy on Saddam.thats all....

93.       arabianofelix
144 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 01:01 am

Quoting aenigma x:

Quoting arabianofelix:

Quoting Netzen:

..."YE SHALL KNOW THEM BY THEIR FRUIT"



those who consumed their fruits came to be the most ungrateful of all mankind.



This kind of comment just completely alienates me, and I don't think the forum is the place for it.



Nothing is pointed at you. I'm only elaborating on your quote: "Ye shall know them by their fruit"

94.       arabianofelix
144 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 01:09 am

Quote:


Are you saying he is also blameless? "The last to save his race's dignity?" Are you quite sure about this statement? Yes we SHOULD know all the facts before making a decision, and I think my views on the trial and verdict have been made quite clear here, but I think you also need to check ALL your facts before making such a statement like this...



He is not blameless. His fault is he was forced to befriend the wrong people. It is well known who made him do this. GWB will tell you why is he doing this for his papa...it ain't my fault his dadddy took his pants down for them. and Then blamed Saddam for the incident.

Quote:

and I think my views on the trial and verdict have been made quite clear here

-- did you even watch at least ONE trial. or at most a trial in full. the Judge was speaking English for God's sake. Yes or No, why has they changed the judges few times. Cuz their plan wasn't going their way. He knows his faults, but he sin't responsible. and The Dujail incidence isn't his fault.

Lets not make this an argument. I just hate things going in the wrong direction, especially if such ambitious and lovely people like all of you here are effected. in fact, everyone in the world. and Truly, our views and abstracted views. and brainwashed isn't the right term. or you say, ain't "politically correct"...

95.       aenigma x
0 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 01:14 am

Arabianofelix - you are preaching to the converted! I have already said that I believe the trial was a sham and as a member of Amnesty International support their views on this also. I am against this war in EVERY way!

All I am saying here is...please...please...let us not make this man a martyr. He is not an innocent victim. The people of Iraq are the innocent victims here.

96.       Roswitha
4132 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 01:18 am

97.       christine
443 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 02:25 am

Quoting aenigma x:


...please...please...let us not make this man a martyr. He is not an innocent victim. The people of Iraq are the innocent victims here.



=1

98.       Capoeira
575 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 03:03 am

Quoting teaschip:

Quoting Joey:

Quoting robyn :

Quoting Joey:

Quoting robyn :

how is it that england and america dont go into countries like north korea and japan and say what they do to their people is wrong..or how about zimbabwe..i'll tell why..they have no oil..
saddam did wrong and killed innocents but him being killed doesn't bring back the dead and doesn't solve a thing....maybe blair and bush should be put on trial for sending all the soldiers to fight for an unjust war... or the american government for funding the IRA in previous years..neway these 'weapons of mass destruction' were given to iraq in the first place by england and america ...maybe we should kill our governments in that case too



It is not the English government but the UK government, in fact many of the top posts are held by Scots and I have to admit that Tony Blair was born and partially educated in Scotland You speak of Nth. Korea,the Americans suffered heavy casualties protecting the south when they were invaded by the north in the 1950's and look at the difference between the two countries now.As for invading Japan looking at the number of japanese cars on our roads I think the opposite is true Sure the Americans have made mistakes, haven't we all? But I for one will always be grateful to the Yanks for the help they have given us over the years, after all we in Britain might be speaking almanca



well the situation in north korea hasn't changed much since the 1950's if u do ur research..consequently japanese human rights records are some practises are atrocious..also i see u avoided the zimbabwe issue..rather wisely and whether the posts are held by scottish people or people educated in scotland is irrelevant..they have their own parliament
the phrase 'passing the buck' springs to mind


Zimbabwe is a fellow member of the Commonwealth of Nations. As long as it has the support of some members there is very little that can be done.



Joey, it's almost point less to have a real debate here. Because first you need knowledge and facts about politics, world events & history. Which I'm finding very difficult for some people to discuss here. You seem to have a good deal of knowledge though, found your post interesting. Thanks for the enlightment

Odd, the only "enlightened" posts are the ones that share your point of view. Might I add that the U.S. only entered WWII after we were bombed at Pearl Harbor, NOT when intelligence reports came back confirming the Holocaust! We seemed to have left out that important bit of history. So I guess your early assumption that some have problems backing their arguments with important historical data is VERY true! Hey even I agree. It makes for a more romantic story to say that we entered into the war to 'save' the world from the Axes of Terror! Opps, am I confusing WWI, Iraq and Afghanistan here?!?!? Will the 'real' historians here set the record straight? lol

99.       robyn :D
2640 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 03:10 am

Quoting Capoeira:

Quoting teaschip:

Quoting Joey:

Quoting robyn :

Quoting Joey:

Quoting robyn :

how is it that england and america dont go into countries like north korea and japan and say what they do to their people is wrong..or how about zimbabwe..i'll tell why..they have no oil..
saddam did wrong and killed innocents but him being killed doesn't bring back the dead and doesn't solve a thing....maybe blair and bush should be put on trial for sending all the soldiers to fight for an unjust war... or the american government for funding the IRA in previous years..neway these 'weapons of mass destruction' were given to iraq in the first place by england and america ...maybe we should kill our governments in that case too



It is not the English government but the UK government, in fact many of the top posts are held by Scots and I have to admit that Tony Blair was born and partially educated in Scotland You speak of Nth. Korea,the Americans suffered heavy casualties protecting the south when they were invaded by the north in the 1950's and look at the difference between the two countries now.As for invading Japan looking at the number of japanese cars on our roads I think the opposite is true Sure the Americans have made mistakes, haven't we all? But I for one will always be grateful to the Yanks for the help they have given us over the years, after all we in Britain might be speaking almanca



well the situation in north korea hasn't changed much since the 1950's if u do ur research..consequently japanese human rights records are some practises are atrocious..also i see u avoided the zimbabwe issue..rather wisely and whether the posts are held by scottish people or people educated in scotland is irrelevant..they have their own parliament
the phrase 'passing the buck' springs to mind


Zimbabwe is a fellow member of the Commonwealth of Nations. As long as it has the support of some members there is very little that can be done.



Joey, it's almost point less to have a real debate here. Because first you need knowledge and facts about politics, world events & history. Which I'm finding very difficult for some people to discuss here. You seem to have a good deal of knowledge though, found your post interesting. Thanks for the enlightment

Odd, the only "enlightened" posts are the ones that share your point of view. Might I add that the U.S. only entered WWII after we were bombed at Pearl Harbor, NOT when intelligence reports came back confirming the Holocaust! We seemed to have left out that important bit of history. So I guess your early assumption that some have problems backing their arguments with important historical data is VERY true! Hey even I agree. It makes for a more romantic story to say that we entered into the war to 'save' the world from the Axes of Terror! Opps, am I confusing WWI, Iraq and Afghanistan here?!?!? Will the 'real' historians here set the record straight? lol


+1million capo canim!!!!!!!!!!

100.       teaschip
3870 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 04:37 am

Quoting Capoeira:

Quoting teaschip:

Quoting Joey:

Quoting robyn :

Quoting Joey:

Quoting robyn :

how is it that england and america dont go into countries like north korea and japan and say what they do to their people is wrong..or how about zimbabwe..i'll tell why..they have no oil..
saddam did wrong and killed innocents but him being killed doesn't bring back the dead and doesn't solve a thing....maybe blair and bush should be put on trial for sending all the soldiers to fight for an unjust war... or the american government for funding the IRA in previous years..neway these 'weapons of mass destruction' were given to iraq in the first place by england and america ...maybe we should kill our governments in that case too



It is not the English government but the UK government, in fact many of the top posts are held by Scots and I have to admit that Tony Blair was born and partially educated in Scotland You speak of Nth. Korea,the Americans suffered heavy casualties protecting the south when they were invaded by the north in the 1950's and look at the difference between the two countries now.As for invading Japan looking at the number of japanese cars on our roads I think the opposite is true Sure the Americans have made mistakes, haven't we all? But I for one will always be grateful to the Yanks for the help they have given us over the years, after all we in Britain might be speaking almanca



well the situation in north korea hasn't changed much since the 1950's if u do ur research..consequently japanese human rights records are some practises are atrocious..also i see u avoided the zimbabwe issue..rather wisely and whether the posts are held by scottish people or people educated in scotland is irrelevant..they have their own parliament
the phrase 'passing the buck' springs to mind


Zimbabwe is a fellow member of the Commonwealth of Nations. As long as it has the support of some members there is very little that can be done.



Joey, it's almost point less to have a real debate here. Because first you need knowledge and facts about politics, world events & history. Which I'm finding very difficult for some people to discuss here. You seem to have a good deal of knowledge though, found your post interesting. Thanks for the enlightment

Odd, the only "enlightened" posts are the ones that share your point of view. Might I add that the U.S. only entered WWII after we were bombed at Pearl Harbor, NOT when intelligence reports came back confirming the Holocaust! We seemed to have left out that important bit of history. So I guess your early assumption that some have problems backing their arguments with important historical data is VERY true! Hey even I agree. It makes for a more romantic story to say that we entered into the war to 'save' the world from the Axes of Terror! Opps, am I confusing WWI, Iraq and Afghanistan here?!?!? Will the 'real' historians here set the record straight? lol



Interesting Capo, you actually did some research here. But you may want to go back and do a little more regarding Japan and Pearl Harbor, my friend. You are a teacher correct? So, any further enlighment would be beneficial from you, in fact I welcome it. Now this is a discussion, not a debate. I have no problem with people throwing facts at me, this helps me learn a great deal. The problem I have if you take notice in previous posts here are the uneducated wanting to argue. I won't even address Tirrogans post, because I fine no value in his response. We could all benefit from a little history, but please don't misconstrue it. I have alot of respect for people at this site that can provide knowledge, but not alot of bullshit that has no meaning. I'm speaking primarily to politics which I believe is a no no here. Oh well, I will suffer the slap on the hand if I must. Lastly to address the age concern here. I must admit I have rethought that comment and really age is not an issue. I'm thinking more like a Personality Assessment. You know, "Do you play well with others"? I just took one at work and the results were interesting.

101.       teaschip
3870 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 04:45 am

Last comment on this thread from me, since most of you believe we should pull our troops out of Iraq, who will volunteer here to go there and rebuild? Do I have any volunteers? Come on Capo, I believe you made this comment in your previous post. I am open for suggestions here from anyone. I'm not being sarcastic either.....

102.       Capoeira
575 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 05:11 am

opps we got in trouble!

103.       admin
758 posts 		 07 Nov 2006 Tue 05:56 am

This thread is locked because of the political discussion.

(103 Messages in 11 pages - View all)
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