Teas, for me, this isn´t a matter of whether or not to trust the goverment (not that I do).  It is a simple matter of the constitutionality of being free of government infringement and involvement in our lives.  It goes against my basic core principles to have government run healthcare and although they say that this is  and will be an option, I think people are naive to believe that insurance companies will be able to compete and that we will be able to keep our private insurance.  This bill is merely a prelude to nationalized healthcare for everyone simply because it will eliminate competition. 

I went to a bipartisan townhall meeting at our hospital last night.  There were both Republican and Democratic congressman and senators, the audience was mainly physicians and other healthcare professionals and some patients of the facility.   I can tell you that none of our representatives could answer anything beyond very general questions.  Our docs had very pointed questions and not one person could answer them.  I hope that our government will stop and listen to healthcare experts and not lobbists before doing anything.  Healthcare reform needs to happen, but it needs to happen in the right way and for the right reasons.  It needs to help people and not hurt them.  One of our congress woman actual said that they plan on implementing the reform and then fix things as they break......ummmm....I don´t know about you guys, but that is not acceptable to me.  We need to get this right because you can´t just go back and "fix" things in healthcare.....you either get it right or people die. 

 Clever cloggies!

This is a difficult issue to solve, and as long as you are looking for a solution that primarily satisfies the insurence and drug companies, there wont´ be a solution that really works. However, I think that something has to be done, because in a country like this, it is absolutely unacceptable that only the rich get quality healthcare and they say tough love to everyone else. We clearly do not live in a democracy here, because if we did, we would hear more from teh people and their perspective on this and not only what the powerful in the society think (businesses). What we see is barbaric, people who work hard all their lives lose their homes when they become middle aged and get a heart attack or stroke and need treatment, while all this could have been prevented. A lot of mentally ill people don´t get treatment and end up on the streets, and then we say to them "you are the worthless parts of the society, you deserve what you have".

I think that a good solution would be to give a universal primary and mental health care coverage to everyone, raise taxes on the rich, and keep private insurence for specialty care. 

I disagree with some of your points, cat.  First of all, most American do have health insurance and like what they have.  Some Americans really need some help.  Don´t you think it would be a better idea to fix what is broken rather than blow the whole thing up and start over?  Why do some many people think that it is OK to unfairly tax "rich" people?  Most people in our country who have money have worked very hard to get there and to tax people disproportionately is completely unfair.  This is what starts civil unrest.....and who decides who is rich? 

 Do you only know that now?

 "Seventy-eight percent are dissatisfied with the cost of the nation´s health care system, including 54 percent "very" dissatisfied. Indeed, most Americans, or 54 percent, are now dissatisfied with the overall quality of health care in the United States."

I am yet to see a patient who is totally happy with their insurance or have no complaints about the system! hehe

I think what is broken in the system is the lack of primary care, so that´s why I think that´s what should be fixed.

I think that civil unrest should have happened long time ago with teh politicians catering to the businesses and none to the people.

 Cat, I´ve read a lot of studies about how many people are satisfied and how many are not....most of what I have read and heard are saying that most are happy.  I don´t think that we can say just how many either way because opinion polls are squewed in favor of whoever is asking.  In other words, I don´t think there are acurate studies to that point.  I don´t personally know anyone who is unhappy with their coverage, which leads me to believe that circumstances may be different in your part of the US......which is another concern in my eyes. 

I absolutely agree that lack of primary care is very concerning BUT you have to look at the underlying reasons for the lack of new docs getting into primary care......one of the main reasons is reimbursement and another is the fear of lawsuits.  We need to fix what is in place and see what we have before we do anything.

I think you are right too about government and business.....but what do you think healthcare will become to the government?  We are a free people and we should be free of government entanglements in our lives.....at least that is my feeling.  I don´t want the government deciding because I am not looking for help or a handout, that I am rich and can therefore pay a higher tax rate.  It is simply unconstitutional.  If we fix what is broken, there will be plenty to go around for everyone.

1.  Stop medical fraud

2.  Tort reform

3.  Stop putting caps on reimbursments

So far, I think from what Trudy said, the Netherlands has a fairly decent idea.  Make the people who want government healthcare pay for what they choose.  Don´t just blindly tax some citizens.

We recently did a colleague survey on our benefits.  To my surprise 99% of our $7,000 + colleagues were very happy with their insurance.   The overall feeling I have heard from my co-workers is that they do not want a universal healthcare plan.  In fact most are scared...I just wonder who are these people that are so unhappy?  Ok..I´ll refrain from answering this..

 Good idea....I will send you my thoughts on this in a PM.  The truth hurts too much.

 +++++

Elisabeth, you seem to live on some alternative universe.  Your view certainly does not resemble what I see.  I believe you work in the health care industry, don´t you?  From your perspective you most probably get a different view. 

Many of those rich people DID NOT work for it.....they inherited it.   As to deciding who is rich....it´s really not that hard now, is it?  Of course those who have more should pay more.  Why should they get tax breaks...while the rest of the poor schleps pay proportionally?

Another thing to consider is those who have grown up in privileged environment have advantages in many areas such as; learning, nutritional benefits that developed healthier bodies, helpful social contacts, knowledge of beneficial social etiquette  and many other areas.  You can not in any way compare a poor black descendent of field slaves, or an indigenous person to a wealthy privileged person of European heritage.