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Varying Functions of -sA-
(12 Messages in 2 pages - View all)
[1] 2
1.       Abla
3647 posts
 02 Jun 2012 Sat 12:10 am

I paid attention to a newspaper headline

 

                                Bugün ne pişirsem? ´What should I cook today?´

 

It seemed to me that there was something wrong with it. The if material -se- which is usually in the subclause is in the main clause here! What is the reason:

 

1. because it is a question OR

2. because the subclause is lacking?



Edited (1/2/2013) by Abla

2.       gokuyum
5049 posts
 02 Jun 2012 Sat 12:22 am

 

Quoting Abla

I paid attention to a newspaper headline

 

                                Bugün ne pişirsem? ´What should I cook today?´

 

It seemed to me that there was something wrong with it. The if material -se- which is usually in the subclause is in the main clause here! What is the reason:

 

1. because it is a question OR

2. because the subclause is lacking?

 

Think this "se" as a wish clause. It is like "What may I cook?"

tunci liked this message
3.       Abla
3647 posts
 02 Jun 2012 Sat 12:24 am

I see. Can I generalize it? I mean if -se- seems to be in the main clause is it a wish?

4.       tunci
7149 posts
 02 Jun 2012 Sat 01:16 am

 

Quoting Abla

I paid attention to a newspaper headline

 

                                Bugün ne pişirsem? ´What should I cook today?´

 

It seemed to me that there was something wrong with it. The if material -se- which is usually in the subclause is in the main clause here! What is the reason:

 

1. because it is a question OR

2. because the subclause is lacking?

 

If  conditional -se,-sa is the  predicate of the main clause then it is optative.

Therefore the subclauses with conditional -se,-sa is treated as adverbial clause of the main clause.


Bugün  ne  pişirsem ? ---> What I fancy [wish] to cook today ?

Bugün kek pişirsem yer mi acaba ? ---> would he/she  eat if I make a cake today ?

Bugün kek pişirsem  --> subclause [conditional]

yer mi acaba --> main clause

yer --> predicate of the main clause

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As in the compound clause below;

O da gelirse gideriz.---> If he comes too then we would go.

"gideriz " is the predicate of the compound clause.

Biz ---> Subject

O da gelirse --> Adverbial clause [subclause ] and -se here is conditional.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 


 





 



Edited (6/2/2012) by tunci

Moha-ios liked this message
5.       ikicihan
1127 posts
 02 Jun 2012 Sat 01:17 am

bugün nereye gitsem (acaba). [Where to go, I have no idea, do you have any suggestion]

yarın ne yapsam.

ne yesem.

...

 

6.       Abla
3647 posts
 02 Jun 2012 Sat 01:56 am

Thank you, gokuyum, tunci, ikicihan. Great help. I can´t remember having seen an optative form in a question before but it makes sense now.

seanthegutsy liked this message
7.       si++
3785 posts
 02 Jun 2012 Sat 02:50 pm

 

Quoting Abla

I paid attention to a newspaper headline

 

                                Bugün ne pişirsem? ´What should I cook today?´

 

It seemed to me that there was something wrong with it. The if material -se- which is usually in the subclause is in the main clause here! What is the reason:

 

1. because it is a question OR

2. because the subclause is lacking?

 

Actually it´s the main clause lacking.

 

For example:

Bugün ne pişirsem ("iyi/uygun olurdu" or "karar veremiyorum" or "diye düşünüyorum" etc.)?

caliptrix liked this message
8.       Abla
3647 posts
 02 Jun 2012 Sat 03:32 pm

Quote:si++

Bugün ne pişirsem ("iyi/uygun olurdu" or "karar veremiyorum" or "diye düşünüyorum" etc.)?

 

Why do I have the feeling that subjunctive would do the same job here?

 

                          Bugün ne pişireyim...

 

It seems that there are at least two grammatical ways of expressing the speaker´s envisaging things. Well, ise is still almost lexical.

9.       Abla
3647 posts
 25 Sep 2012 Tue 04:10 pm

Another nice question example with optative here:

 

                     Ne yapsak da bu sıkıntıyı atlatsak? ´What could we do to get over the hump?´

 

Nothing like ´in order to´ is needed. Handy.

10.       tunci
7149 posts
 25 Sep 2012 Tue 09:45 pm

 

 

Some functions of  the suffix -sA


1. Condition

Gürültü yaparsan insanlar uyanır.

If you make noise ,people would [will] wake up.

 

Erken yola çıkarsan akşama eve varırsın.

If you set off early you would [will] get home tonight.

 

******************************************

 

2. Determination

No matter what happens, no matter what conditions ,

we are determined to achive or fulfil the action.

 

Kar da yağsa yine gelirim.

Even [if] it snows I will still come.

[I am determined to come ]

 

Dünya tersine dönse vazgeçmem.

Even [if] the world turns upside down, I will not give up.

 

3. Guess, strong guess.


Ahmet yorgun olsa gerek zira bugün kahveye gelmedi.

Ali must be tired since he didn´t come to the cafe today.

 

Bu camı olsa olsa Serkan kırmıştır.

Only person that broke this window must be Serkan.

 

4. hypothetically

 

Benim yerimde olsan ne yapardın ?

[Hypothetically] what would you do if you were in my place ?

 

5. Doubt, Fear, Worry

 

Ya eve hırsız girmişse !

What if a thief broke in the house ! ------> FEAR

 

Ya bu kış çok soğuk olursa !    --------> WORRY

What if this this winter gets very cold !

 

Ya bir gün hastalansam bu çocuklara kim bakar? ----> WORRY

What if  one day I get ill, who would look after these kids ?

 

6. threat

Ders çalışmazsan kızarım ha!    

If you don´t study I will get mad at you !

 

Bak, söylediklerimi yapmazsan anlaşmayı bozarım !

Look, if you don´t do what I say,I will break the agreement !

 

7. indecisiveness

 

Bilmem söylesem mi, söylemesem mi?

shall I say or not, I really don´t know.

 

Ucuz mu satsam, pahalı mı?

shall I sell it cheap or expensive ?

 

8. Not to care, not to give an importance, ignore

 

Ne halin varsa gör !

Do what the hell you want ! [ i dont care]

 

Ders çalışsam ne olur çalışmasam ne olur.

What difference would that make, whether I study or not.

 

Ne yaparsan yap seninle ilgilenmiyorum.

Whatever you do, I don´t care.

 

9. wish

Keşke yarın hava güzel olsa.

I wish tomorrow the weather will be good.



Edited (9/25/2012) by tunci

Moha-ios, Henry, tomac and caliptrix liked this message
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