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MİŞ or MİŞTİ
(13 Messages in 2 pages - View all)
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1.       nemanjasrb
507 posts
 17 Dec 2012 Mon 07:20 pm

I have to ask this. What is the difference between -miş and -mişti. I mean,the both are past,right?

2.       Abla
3647 posts
 17 Dec 2012 Mon 07:36 pm

-mIş  -  past (+ hearsay), often equals to English past tense

 

-mIştI  -  double past, often equals to English pluperfect

3.       nemanjasrb
507 posts
 17 Dec 2012 Mon 07:45 pm

 

Quoting Abla

-mIş  -  past (+ hearsay), often equals to English past tense

 

-mIştI  -  double past, often equals to English pluperfect

 

Sağol. And what is the difference between English past tense and English pluperfect? For pluperfect I first heard now in my life. :O

4.       Abla
3647 posts
 17 Dec 2012 Mon 07:49 pm

Sorry. They seem to use the name past perfect these days. Look here:

 

                           http://www.learnenglish.de/grammar/tensetext.htm

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5.       nemanjasrb
507 posts
 17 Dec 2012 Mon 07:53 pm

Sorry? These days?

6.       Abla
3647 posts
 17 Dec 2012 Mon 07:59 pm

I was taught it is pluperfect. That was some years after WW1.

 

There are some lovely schemas on that page. I wish I could find them for Turkish. =)



Edited (12/17/2012) by Abla
Edited (12/17/2012) by Abla [I tried to copy them here but they said no. Look for yourselves.]

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7.       nemanjasrb
507 posts
 17 Dec 2012 Mon 08:04 pm

Oh,that. Okay Thank you. I´ll watch more Muhtesem,and I´ll read this. I hope it would be helpful.
For example,i heard them to say:
Ben size söz vermiştim. - I promised you. OR
Söylemiştim. - I said.
As I know,they use -miş for something that they not sure that´s really happened. But if he/she knows that he/she promis something,I don´t get why they have to use -miş(ti)... {#emotions_dlg.confused}

8.       Abla
3647 posts
 17 Dec 2012 Mon 08:17 pm

Then you must read this thread, nemanja:

 

                http://www.turkishclass.com/forumTitle_53653

 

tunci´s posts are especially about your problem.

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9.       nemanjasrb
507 posts
 17 Dec 2012 Mon 08:34 pm

Tunci´s posts are always helpful. I guess it will be too this time. Inşallah.

10.       tunci
7149 posts
 17 Dec 2012 Mon 10:12 pm

 

I call that form as Narrative perfective tense. In Turkish -mIştı  marking is used for actions that are completed in the past. By using - mIştı , we are ;

1. narrating the past action to someone

2. I witnessed or I myself  performed that action.

3. The action occurred in the definite past *

 

As in your example; 

Ben size söz vermiştim. ---> I had promised you.

 

1. I am reminding you, narrating you the event [my promising you].

 

2. I remember and i witnessed the action that it has been performed by me.

 

3. It occurred in the past and it occurred in a definite time in the past.

 

==============================================

 

The only distinctive difference between simple past tense [size söz verdim] and [size söz vermiştim] is ,  we are narrating the past event that we witnessed.

 

==============================================

3. 3. The action occurred in the definite past *

 

Although this form technically should indicate the indefinite past because of tense narrowing at present time it is used for definite past.

 According to Prof.Hamza Zülfikar ;

The definite perfective past    -dıydı    is replaced by  indefinite perfective past - mıştı 

söz verdiydim ---------------------------------> söz vermiştim

                           tense narrowed into

 

- as a result , at present time, we use -mişti form for definite perfective past time.

The nearest tense in English is  plu-perfect tense [had]

 

 



Edited (12/17/2012) by tunci

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