We clearly do not talk about the same type of sexuality or pornography or prostitution. Anyway I have to work tomorrow so I´m off to bed.

May it be clear that I am against the same things you are. I only really don´t agree with your definition of female sexuality and female exploitation. And the exceptions you speak of are apparantly different from the ones I speak of as well. Anyway. I´ll agree to disagree and wish you a good night

 Then let´s agree to disagree. I don´t think you´ll be able to explain me what is so degrading about pornography and prostitution. And I don´t think I´ll be able to make you understand that indeed the large picture of women traficking and male domination in forced prostitution is wrong, but that THAT specific (and big) aspect of ´sex industry´ doesn´t necessarily make it more degrading to have sex and get money than to bake cookies and get money. I really don´t see the difference, because of my own perception of what sex is, and what it can be.

 I am talking about these few exceptions as an ideal. I wasnt talking about ´prostitution in general´ or ´prostitution in the Netherlands´ or something. I was merely talking about those exceptions, and why I don´t think it is degrading in itself.

Your idea of prostitution according to above comparison has to do with a boss, workers, minimum pay and maximum effort and no rights to protect them. The idea of prostitution that I have no problems with, is one of independent workers (callcentre, at home, behind the window, giving massages or coming as a stripper on a bachelor party, you name it, male or female), that work under protected circumstances with the right to refuse clients and acts, that work on their own times and that are insured.

 Yes. There are indeed many reasons. And I am definitely on your side when it comes to reasons of domination or poverty, amongst others. Ofcourse no male domination or economic hardship (in a male dominated society) should be forcing factors into unwanted prostitution. Let me just be clear about that: no forced prostitution and no male dominated society where the ideas of female sexuality are based upon the demands of men.

But, Again this is about your perception of sex and sexuality: sex involves male domination and a woman being penetrated in a painful way and can not enjoy it, and sexuality has to do with your gender.

The idea of a union is, amongst others, for men and women to have the right to refuse clients or to refuse to perform or take part in certain things. Your idea of sex kind of seems to involve the idea of an asexual woman without wishes or preferences. You´d be surprized there are women who enjoy being banged. 

Many forms of pornography and prostitution are very degrading for women. But that does not make pornography or prostitution in itself degrading.

 No I don´t see how a john buys domination from a woman if she is willing to spread her legs as long as he pays. Where exactly is the domination? The domination is there when your definition of female sexuality involves male domination.

Like I said before: why can I sell my voice on a cd, but if I want to sell my body it´s unexcusable?

Well that is your own feeling and I have no idea where you got that from, nor do I feel I did anything to give you such feeling.

 I remember that sometimes I had a throatache from talking too much in class in primary cshool Especially after the weekends or holidays where I hadnt seen my friends much and thus talked less.

 I doubt if I would have gotten that one!

Yes, it isnt really bad. I could nearly imagine my mom saying it   Actually I relaly think that we curse rather politely. I still get annoyed by Turkish curse phrases, (for example when watching a match or when in the traffic), I am sure they are no longer seen for its meaning (among the young population, whod obviously not use it next to their ´bigger ones´ , but just have become ´general curse phrase´, but as a foreigner I automatically translate it, and they are very rude.

 +1

I agree. And the idea that sexuality cannot be sold? Why not? Why can I sell my thoughts or get paid for working in a factory, or get paid for having a beautiful voice, but then when I decide I want to make money from my sexual ´expertise´, it suddenly is unexcusable? I really don´t see why. It sort of sounds like sex is something holy and that women should understand it as such. And thinking of it that way sounds either religious or patriarchal ´woman needs to stay virgin till marriage´.

And you forget that there are also men selling themselves.